The Jeremy Kyle Show 23rd September 2009
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00:00Coming up on today's show, the man claiming he's the father to his best mate's ex-girlfriend's baby.
00:05What would being a father mean to you?
00:08Hell of a lot. I love that little boy in my life itself and I'd love to be his dad so much.
00:13Are you lying about having sex with him three weeks ago?
00:14No. Why would I lie?
00:16Why would he make that up?
00:17Because he's out to get me.
00:19Who's telling the truth? Him, when he says that he slept with her three weeks ago,
00:22or her when she says this man is obsessive, he's obsessed with this child and he won't leave me alone.
00:26Who's telling the truth?
00:27DNA results are revealed.
00:28The DNA test results show that Martin...
00:38The woman with a 20-year solvent addiction.
00:41He's smoked.
00:42Yeah.
00:42I mean, you know, in layman's terms, for Mr. Carr, you could blow yourself up.
00:46Yeah.
00:46I'm being serious.
00:47I've nearly done that before when I forgot that I put a cigarette in my mouth and it's like...
00:51That's all on my show. It's next.
00:58Good morning, guys. How are you?
01:24Thank you very much indeed, Martin.
01:27Everybody all right? How are you?
01:29Lovely team, sir, my friend. How are you?
01:31You all right? Nice to see you.
01:32You all right, darling?
01:33Thank you very much indeed.
01:37Thank you very much indeed.
01:38Good morning and a big, big welcome to the show.
01:39Now, first today, we're going to meet Martin.
01:41Martin says that around a year ago, he had a one-night stand with his best mate's girlfriend, Maxine,
01:47only to find out nine months later that she'd had a baby.
01:49Now, he made contact and after seeing the child, claims that he's 90% sure he's the father to the seven-week-old.
01:56Now, he's here for a DNA test to find out the truth.
01:58Is he or his ex-best mate the dad?
02:01Let's get him out to unravel this story.
02:02Martin's on the show, guys.
02:06Good morning, my friend. How are you?
02:07You're welcome.
02:08Good.
02:09Take a seat.
02:10You know what the first question's going to be, isn't it?
02:13What are you doing sleeping with your ex-best mate's girlfriend?
02:16Well, I know it's bad, but he slept...
02:17So, he was going out, Chris, with Maxine.
02:22They'd had a Barney.
02:24He'd done something that you were annoyed with some time before.
02:27Did you fancy, or was it just, I'm getting back at him?
02:30Just to get back at him.
02:31So, in essence, today, there could be a child that's been born
02:34simply because you decided to sleep with your ex-best mate's girlfriend
02:37because you wanted to score a cheap point.
02:38She ain't innocent. I mean, she's, like, sleeping with me,
02:41like, cheating on her boyfriend, so she ain't perfect, you know?
02:43So, um, she has the child.
02:46You find out about this child.
02:47How does that make you feel?
02:48You must have thought, blimey, there's a chance.
02:50Yeah, I didn't want to have a baby, like, in this situation, but, you know...
02:53Or put something on the end of it, then.
02:55Yeah, I know. I know.
02:57That was wrong. I shouldn't have done it, you know.
02:58In terms of the child, I said in the introduction
03:00you're now 90% sure that this child's yours. How?
03:04Yeah, and she's telling me she's 75% sure it's mine.
03:06And everyone that's sitting says, like, you know,
03:08we really look like each other.
03:09Have you seen the child?
03:10Mm, quite a few times.
03:11How do you feel when you see him?
03:13He's lovely. I love him to bits, you know,
03:14and getting to think, like, he might be my son.
03:16I love him. I do. I love him. I love him as a son.
03:19I'd like to be his dad.
03:20The flip side of the coin is today you could find out that he isn't
03:22because you told my researchers she had a bit of a reputation,
03:25and let's be fair to you,
03:28she was in a relationship and having sex with somebody else.
03:31Were you the only one?
03:33Who knows?
03:34What sort of reputation has she got?
03:36Um, blokes she's had, like, down her flat in the last month.
03:40She's had five different blokes.
03:41She's had five different blokes down her flat in the last four weeks?
03:45Mm-hmm.
03:46When was the last time you slept with her?
03:48Uh, probably about three weeks ago.
03:49Oh, so you're part of it as well.
03:51So you're painting the picture of a girl who sleeps around?
03:58Yeah.
03:58And do you know, I'm really...
03:59Do you know, the thing that really, really riled me this morning
04:02when I read this story,
04:03when you had sex with her three weeks ago,
04:05did you use contraception?
04:06No.
04:06Why?
04:08Because she wanted a little baby brother or sister for Adam.
04:13Can I ask you a question,
04:14or is this not actually going to get into your head?
04:16Um, how are you going to support these children?
04:19Yeah, I'll just get a job, innit?
04:22Get a job, int it.
04:24It's quite hard for an awful lot of people at the moment who are struggling.
04:27I'm just wondering whether it would be a good idea.
04:30Well, then, don't have unprotected sex
04:32and potentially have another baby, then.
04:33What are you talking about?
04:35I don't know.
04:35I just...
04:36I want a little brother and sister as well, you know.
04:37We both talked about it before we had sex, and...
04:39But you don't even know if the first one's yours yet.
04:42I know.
04:44You're not in a relationship with her, are you?
04:46No, but we were sorting things out.
04:47She was going to split up with her boyfriend, and...
04:49Oh, so you think that if you're the dad today,
04:51you two will sail off into the distance, play happy families,
04:54you'll have a brother or sister,
04:55and all the people out there who work, including me,
04:57will pay for your kids to be brought up, yeah?
04:59Brilliant.
05:00After the break, we're going to meet Maxine.
05:02We want her to have a say.
05:03Don't go anywhere, because I'm right back.
05:04What would being a father mean to you?
05:07Hell of a lot.
05:08It's like, I love that little boy in one life itself,
05:10and I just, I'd love to be his dad so much.
05:11The DNA test results show that Martin...
05:14Help, and you want to be considered for the show,
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05:58Thank you very much indeed. Welcome back.
05:59So before the break, I was talking with Martin.
06:01Can I be really honest with you?
06:03Yeah, of course.
06:03Because that's what the show's about.
06:06You and Maxine, a girl you say you don't fancy.
06:10No.
06:12You only slept with when you were drunk,
06:14and let's be honest, she's a bit of a reputation.
06:17In fact, in the last four weeks, she's had at least five men in her flat.
06:21You're here for a DNA test on her.
06:23She was, in fact, your ex-best mate's girlfriend when you slept with her.
06:26You didn't use contraception.
06:27But despite all of that, what I love about this story
06:30is that three weeks ago, you think you'll have unprotected sex with her again,
06:33and we'll create a little family-perfect unit.
06:35Keep it in your trousers.
06:37Let's get Maxine on the show.
06:45What?
06:46Can I just ask you a question?
06:47Why are you actually here?
06:48You don't care about Callum.
06:49I don't care about Callum.
06:50No, you don't.
06:51You don't care about Callum.
06:51Oh, but the bloke should be having down in your flat then.
06:53You've got Chris down there.
06:54He does cannabis and coke in front of your girlfriend's kitchen.
06:56And you don't do drugs now?
06:58No, I don't do drugs.
06:58Yes, you do.
06:59I haven't touched Class A drugs for three months.
07:00I ain't had a split for three weeks, just under.
07:02I don't do drugs.
07:04I've given it up.
07:05I'm sorting myself out.
07:06Do you know one of these days,
07:07I am actually going to hyperventilate, implode,
07:09and disappear straight through the ceiling.
07:11Welcome to the show.
07:12Can I just ask you a question, right?
07:14This one night stands your head with Martin here.
07:16Why didn't you use contraception?
07:20I wish I did now, and I regret it.
07:22You were with his best mate, his ex-best mate.
07:25What sort of thing is going through your mind when you're having sex with him?
07:28It was a big mistake.
07:30It was a big mistake?
07:30Yeah.
07:30Out of which, potentially, Callum could have been born.
07:34How sure are you that Martin is the father of your son?
07:37Well, 50-50%, but I would like Chris.
07:40I would like...
07:41Well, 75%.
07:41Can I take what you said to my research team as a reason,
07:45which is a romantic thing to say to all of you, right?
07:47This is what concerns me about you.
07:50The reason you had sex with Martin, you told my researchers, was why?
07:55Because I was drunk and horny.
07:59No, it wasn't that at all.
08:01He was like...
08:02He was like, oh, OK, I was drunk, yeah, like...
08:06So it was sort of like it, then, yeah.
08:08Well, yeah, but it wasn't like your saying.
08:09I was drunk, right?
08:11Well, I said drunk and horny, so so far we've agreed on the drunk bit.
08:13Tell me about the horny bit.
08:15He was, like, rubbing my leg and rubbing my back, you know?
08:18I'm trying to make a point.
08:19I know.
08:20A child could have been born because you two, drunk, didn't think.
08:24However, what concerns me even more, Maxine,
08:26apart from the truth about Callum's parentage,
08:29is that he says in the last few weeks,
08:31you've been having people around the flat
08:32and still having unprotected sex with him three weeks ago,
08:36that's what he said.
08:37He's a lawyer.
08:37I'm a lawyer.
08:38Why is a lawyer?
08:39Why would I lie about that?
08:40I've not been asked nothing, right?
08:41But you've made my life hell, right?
08:43Frightening me with social services the other day.
08:45Yeah?
08:45Yeah?
08:45Trying to take Callum's, no.
08:47Because the people you've got Callum, you've got, like,
08:47it's nothing to do with you who can't do my flat.
08:49So you've got them around Callum?
08:51I care about that little Callum and that.
08:52Whether he's my son or not, I love him to bits.
08:54And you shouldn't have people like that down the flat around Callum.
08:56What do you say to his accusations that...
08:57He's a complete liar.
08:59I just want everyone to see what he actually is.
09:00Did you sleep with him three weeks ago?
09:01No, I didn't.
09:02I swear down, I did not sleep with him.
09:04So you're making out that he is...
09:06A complete utter liar?
09:07Yeah, why do I call national TV and say I slept with you?
09:09I ain't proud of it, you know what I mean?
09:15That he's got a baby somewhere else and he has...
09:19Yeah, he's got a baby somewhere else, he's not even allowed to see it.
09:22Is that true?
09:23No, I better know where that comes from.
09:24Chris as well, yeah.
09:25Now, Chris is the other potential dad, right?
09:28Uh-huh.
09:28This is the guy that you were going out with when you jumped into bed with Martin.
09:32Uh-huh.
09:33Because you were drunk and feeling horny.
09:34I will never forgive Martin and Maxine for sleeping together behind my back.
09:38He was my best mate and she was my girlfriend at the time.
09:40I loved her but she broke my heart.
09:42I'm 50-50 that the baby might be mine
09:44but it also might be Martin's.
09:45The baby doesn't look like anyone
09:47so I can't see how Martin says it looks like him.
09:49I've only seen the child once
09:50because I don't want to bond with it until I find out the truth.
09:53If I am the dad then I will take responsibility for it
09:55but I want absolutely nothing ever to do again
09:58with either Maxine or Martin.
10:00This is a guy who was hurt massively by your behaviour.
10:02I'm lying.
10:03Are you lying about having sex with him three weeks ago?
10:05No.
10:06Why would I lie?
10:07Why would he make that up?
10:08Because he's out to get me.
10:10Like, I've got threatening messages from him.
10:12He wants to take Karim away from me.
10:14This is what he's planning to do.
10:15I don't want to take Karim away from me.
10:16So you're saying he's making you out to be a bad mum
10:18because you're in a relationship, right?
10:19No, I'm not with no one.
10:21All right.
10:21Have you slept with five men at your flat the last four weeks?
10:23No, I've...
10:24Well, I'd like to see how I've had all my girl mates up there.
10:27No, what happened to you then?
10:29Oh, nothing...
10:30Was it day off today?
10:31I don't know, Thursday.
10:32You know what I mean?
10:33You're sick, Mark.
10:34You are absolutely sick.
10:35I'm right, you're sick.
10:36You're sick.
10:37You don't care about Karim.
10:38If you did, you wouldn't have those people down your flat.
10:39You keep having them going down there now.
10:41Does it concern you, if he is the dad,
10:43that he might try and take this further?
10:45Yeah, and I...
10:47Well, hopefully...
10:49So you'd like it not to be, Martin?
10:51Yeah, I really do.
10:52I hope for my sake it is
10:53because, like, Chris don't give a s***.
10:55He don't give a s*** about the five kids he's got already.
10:56When old are you?
10:56You're making my life hell, yeah?
10:58I've been there since the moment he was born.
10:59Who's Sarah?
11:01Sarah's my best mate.
11:02Let's get Sarah on the show, ladies and gentlemen.
11:04You all right?
11:08Let's get up.
11:09Hello.
11:12What's your take on this?
11:13With a guy who says,
11:14she's a reputation,
11:15I stayed with her three weeks ago at the flat
11:16with a girl who says
11:17he's an absolutely obsessive pain in the backside,
11:19it won't leave me alone.
11:19What's the truth?
11:20I'd like to clear that one up.
11:21Three weeks ago, she stayed at my flat.
11:23Yeah, three weeks ago, Martin,
11:25she was at my flat.
11:26How would you describe this man?
11:29Where do I start?
11:30To be honest, Martin...
11:31Can I speak to her, please?
11:33Button it.
11:34Go on.
11:34To be honest,
11:35it started with
11:36before Martin was okay
11:37when I first met him
11:38about a year ago
11:39in the pub.
11:40No.
11:41Oh, there's a surprise.
11:41When he was with Paul.
11:42The first day you met me...
11:43Whatever, let's not argue about what...
11:44Be quiet.
11:45Tell me the story.
11:46Well, when I first met him,
11:47he was in the pub
11:47with his cousin
11:48and I thought he was all right then.
11:51But when I saw him up the flat
11:52when he first came to see Callum,
11:55he was feeding Callum a bottle
11:56and within five minutes
11:58he was in the kitchen
11:58trying to get up
11:59with one of our mates.
12:00Whatever.
12:01Hasn't he tried it on with you?
12:02Yeah.
12:03Do you seriously believe this?
12:05I don't want to believe.
12:06You texted me all the time.
12:07You texted me last night
12:08saying,
12:08meet you for a fag night,
12:09on the way up here.
12:11You wanted to go out
12:11for a drink for a night,
12:12no.
12:13No, because I ran out of fags
12:14I wanted a fag.
12:14I didn't want no drink.
12:15Do you think he was
12:15trying to sleep
12:16with you last night then?
12:17He was chatting to me all night
12:19and then in the end
12:19because I wouldn't go out
12:20and meet him
12:21he was going to come
12:21to the hotel to find us.
12:23Because I wouldn't meet him
12:24he was going to go home.
12:25Who's telling the truth?
12:25Him, when he says
12:26that he slept with her
12:27three weeks ago
12:28or her when she says
12:29this man is obsessive,
12:30he's obsessed with this child
12:31and he won't leave me alone.
12:32Who's telling the truth?
12:33Maxine.
12:33He needs to leave me alone.
12:35I've got nothing to gain
12:36by lying about that.
12:36I think you're driving me down
12:38to have a nervous breakdown.
12:39Maxine was touching upon
12:40the fact that she'd heard
12:43that he had a bit of a reputation.
12:44Something about drugs as well
12:45that you brought up.
12:45What was that?
12:47The reputation is
12:48he's been in drugs,
12:49he's been in prison
12:49and apparently
12:51he burgled an old lady.
12:53Really?
12:53He did watch an old lady.
12:54Burgled an old lady.
12:56Would you like to ask
12:57the police about that?
12:58Because I haven't burgled
12:59an old lady.
12:59What did you get to prison for?
13:01Burglary, but it wasn't
13:02it was on a football club.
13:03No, it was on a football club.
13:06Oh, well that makes it all right.
13:08Be quiet.
13:09Go ask the police.
13:09Did you beat up an old lady?
13:11No, I didn't beat up
13:12an old lady, thank you.
13:12Right, okay.
13:13But you went to prison for burglary?
13:15Yeah, on a football club.
13:16Not an old lady.
13:16You can go ask the police
13:17that I'd tell you.
13:19I don't understand, you see.
13:21This is the bit
13:21that I don't get.
13:23A lot of blokes,
13:24can I speak?
13:25Thanks.
13:26A lot of blokes
13:26want to turn their lives around
13:29and I'm just wondering
13:30whether this guy's had problems
13:31and wants to be a dad
13:32and that's what he sees
13:33and that's why he's quite obsessive.
13:34But a lot of blokes
13:35are on this stage
13:35and they don't want to know.
13:36He does seem quite keen
13:38to do what's right by Callum.
13:39I think that's quite important
13:40to point out.
13:41He's made accusations
13:41against Maxine,
13:43she's made accusations
13:44against him,
13:44so have you.
13:45But let's say he's right,
13:46doesn't it actually show something
13:48that he wants to do to them?
13:49Fair enough.
13:49If he is the father,
13:51then fair enough,
13:51have access.
13:52I would want him to be there
13:54to support Maxine and the baby.
13:55What would being a father
13:57mean to you?
13:58A hell of a lot.
13:59It's like,
13:59I love that little boy
14:00in modern life itself
14:01and I'd love to be his dad so much.
14:03And what will it do
14:04for how you behave?
14:05I mean,
14:06will you be able to separate
14:07insult or romance
14:09towards the child's mother
14:10and just concentrate
14:11on being a dad?
14:12No, just purely being a dad
14:13towards Callum.
14:14And you'll stop sleeping
14:14with people
14:15without using contraception?
14:16You'll stop breaking the law
14:17and going to prison, yeah?
14:18I've stopped breaking the law,
14:19I've come off A-class drugs,
14:20I'm not smoking cannabis
14:21or nothing like that
14:22and I want to stay like that
14:23for Callum.
14:23Do you still love this lady then?
14:25I never loved her
14:25in the first place.
14:28I used to like her,
14:28I used to care about her
14:29but the way she's been
14:30towards me recently,
14:31I just don't get her.
14:31At least that's honest.
14:32The thing here is
14:33we have to find out the truth
14:34and then we have to do
14:34what's right by Callum.
14:35Now if he's the father,
14:36is he going to have
14:36a role to play?
14:38Yeah,
14:39I do want Callum
14:40to have a dad in his life.
14:41So the most important thing today,
14:43right,
14:43is to get the truth,
14:44yes?
14:44And then if he is the father,
14:46we'll sit down
14:46with the aftercare team
14:47and we'll work out
14:48a plan that works
14:49for all parties
14:50but you're going to have
14:50to prove to her if you are.
14:51Do you think you're the dad?
14:52What percentage?
14:53You say 90%?
14:53Yeah, I say about 90%.
14:54What do you say?
14:5650%.
14:56What do you say?
14:5750-50.
14:58Who do you want to be the dad?
14:59To be honest, Chris.
15:00Right,
15:01and you'd prefer Chris,
15:02right?
15:02What about you?
15:03You, obviously.
15:04Let's do those all important.
15:05It was a great question.
15:06DNA results, please,
15:06shall we?
15:07The DNA test results show
15:14that Martin
15:15is not the child's
15:24biological father.
15:25I'm sorry,
15:25sorry,
15:26it's my...
15:26Sorry,
15:28Martin.
15:32Can I be really honest
15:33with you?
15:33This is living proof
15:37yet again
15:37that people
15:38get drunk,
15:40have sex,
15:41there are consequences.
15:42The consequences is callum.
15:43It's not for me to say
15:44that you've done a good
15:44or bad job.
15:45Certainly,
15:46you should always try
15:46and raise the bar,
15:48concentrate on being a mum
15:49and attract the right
15:50sort of people.
15:51In a way,
15:51I admire the fact
15:52that you came out here
15:53and you showed
15:53that you wanted to do
15:54what's right by this kid
15:55and I'm sorry
15:56that you're not
15:56the child's father.
15:57I have to tell you
15:58something that you won't like.
15:59You should have
16:00absolutely nothing whatsoever
16:00to do with each other
16:01from here on in.
16:02I totally agree with you on that.
16:03And I know
16:03that's going to be
16:04heartbreaking for you
16:04in terms of Callum
16:05but I don't think
16:06it's healthy for him
16:07and I think it's healthy
16:08for you too.
16:09I feel so sorry for Callum
16:10with Chris being his dad
16:11because he doesn't care
16:12about the five kids
16:13he's got already.
16:13Well, you know what
16:14you have to do,
16:14my friend?
16:15You have to take
16:16the way you've turned
16:17your life around
16:17and the desire
16:18to be a father elsewhere,
16:19get into a proper
16:20relationship,
16:21plan it,
16:21and I'm sure
16:21you'll make a great dad,
16:22alright?
16:23And we will help
16:23all of you move on
16:24from this.
16:25Martin,
16:25Maxine and Sarah,
16:26give them a round
16:27of applause.
16:28Be honest.
16:33OK, now next up today
16:36we meet Steve
16:37and you might just
16:37recognise him
16:38from a previous show.
16:39Take a look at this.
16:40I'm with Blue
16:41a month ago
16:42on a social networking site.
16:44Angela.
16:45Yeah.
16:45How old is Angela?
16:46She's 26 now,
16:48I believe.
16:49She contacted you
16:50and started asking questions.
16:52Yeah.
16:52We have to be careful
16:54as we always try
16:55and be on the car show
16:56for people who are not
16:56here to answer
16:57but basically this girl
16:58made a claim
16:59that she believed
17:01that she was your daughter.
17:02She did, yeah.
17:03Now, you know,
17:04a father of six
17:05just on this social networking site
17:07out the blue, right,
17:09this girl says
17:09I think you're my dad.
17:11What does that do
17:12to your head?
17:13It's totally shocked me.
17:14It's like freaked me out.
17:15OK.
17:15Should we bring her out?
17:16Yeah, please.
17:17This could be your daughter.
17:18You haven't seen her
17:18for a quarter of a century.
17:19Angela, ladies and gentlemen.
17:20What do you say
17:33to the guy
17:34who could be your dad?
17:35Welcome to the show, Angela.
17:37I mean, we're on our 930th show
17:39and I don't think
17:39this has ever happened.
17:40The DNA test was done.
17:43It was sent off
17:43to the laboratory
17:44and the result
17:46that came back
17:47and I know you've been told
17:47this was inconclusive.
17:50What that means is
17:51is that
17:53for whatever reason
17:54cells
17:56a process
17:58whatever
17:59sadly
18:00and rather tragically
18:01this is going to necessitate
18:02a second test.
18:03But as a show
18:04that is committed
18:05to delivering the truth
18:06however good, bad
18:07or indifferent that is
18:08we will obviously
18:09have to do this
18:10and want to do this again
18:11as soon as possible.
18:13So as you saw
18:14Steve and Angela
18:15met for the very first time
18:16on the last show
18:17but sadly those DNA results
18:18came back as inconclusive.
18:19So today
18:20they have returned.
18:21We've done that second DNA test.
18:23Today they will get
18:24those all important results.
18:25Let's get Steve back
18:26on the show, guys.
18:34You're one of those people
18:35that smiles
18:35when they're nervous
18:36aren't you?
18:37No, not really.
18:37I smile a lot.
18:39You must be quite nervous
18:40though, isn't it?
18:40Yeah, I am, yeah.
18:41I thought you were
18:42very dignified last time.
18:44You admitted
18:45that there is
18:46a plausible chance
18:47that Angela
18:48is your daughter.
18:51In terms of
18:52how this has caused
18:54you to react
18:55in the last few weeks
18:56you've got six kids
18:57it was via a social
18:58networking site
18:59as we saw.
19:00What's it done to you
19:01and your family?
19:04Well, really
19:05what I have done
19:06is
19:06I've depended a lot
19:09on one of my family members
19:11my sister a lot
19:12who's helped me
19:13through a lot
19:13but I
19:15sort of holding it back
19:17from the other children
19:18because I don't really
19:19want them to be involved.
19:23I know there was
19:23an undercurrent
19:25certainly from you
19:25and Jackie
19:26who was in the audience
19:26last time
19:27and this wasn't
19:27in any disrespectful
19:29way to Angela
19:30that it was all
19:31a bit quick.
19:32She was on the internet
19:33on the phone
19:33going,
19:33Daddy
19:34Yeah, it's a bit
19:35quick.
19:36I don't know
19:36how to react to it
19:37because
19:37is she, isn't she
19:39and it is a big shock
19:42and
19:42You sort of understand it
19:43though, it's the end
19:43of her long journey
19:44and her long road
19:45to finding her dad
19:46and for you
19:46it's the beginning
19:47and so
19:48as the twain meet
19:49it's how we
19:50try and make that work.
19:52Do you in your heart
19:53of hearts believe
19:54having met her
19:55that she is
19:55your daughter?
19:56I hope so
19:59I hope so
20:01for both of us
20:01I hope so
20:02more for Angela
20:03I also hope
20:05for myself
20:05of course
20:06but I do hope
20:08for Angela
20:08that her search
20:09has ended
20:11but I mean
20:12even if it hasn't
20:13then I am prepared
20:14to stay in contact
20:15Very nice
20:16I have to say again
20:18and I say it every morning
20:19it would be
20:19wrong and unfair
20:20for me to know
20:21any sets of results
20:22on this show
20:23because you would
20:23approach it
20:24in the wrong way
20:24I think that's
20:25a very nice thing
20:26that you've said
20:26and for her
20:27you know
20:28it has been
20:29a long long road
20:30and hopefully
20:32she'll get the answer
20:33that she wants today
20:34but there is
20:35that warning
20:35about just taking
20:36it must have been
20:37awful as well
20:37last time on the show
20:38when that inconclusive
20:39result came through
20:40It was
20:40because I've had a week
20:41sort of like
20:41dealt in my head
20:43and I haven't really
20:44been able to concentrate
20:45really on a lot
20:46just looking forward
20:48to this finding out
20:49and not closing the case
20:52but possibly closing the case
20:53and opening the case
20:54opening the new
20:55friendship
20:56and helping someone
20:58Okay
20:59so she's had to wait
21:00as well
21:00let's get her back
21:00your potential daughter
21:01Angela is here
21:02ladies and gentlemen
21:02Welcome back
21:13as I said
21:14to your potential
21:16dad Steve
21:16it's been a difficult
21:17time I know
21:18for you
21:18because not only
21:19of you were hoping
21:20last time
21:21that we would get
21:21a result
21:22it was inconclusive
21:22but you've wasted
21:23a long long time
21:24you were told
21:26at what age
21:27that Steve
21:28was potentially
21:29your dad
21:29on my 16th birthday
21:31it's been a nine year
21:33ten year track down
21:35really hasn't it
21:36what does today mean
21:37I just really hope
21:41that the test turns out
21:43that he's my dad
21:44then I don't have to
21:46keep looking for him
21:47you've had
21:48by anybody's standards
21:50a hard life
21:51and this is
21:52an important
21:53point for you
21:55I have said already
21:56to Steve
21:57and this is what
21:59this job is
21:59I know not
22:00what is in that envelope
22:02but I have to ask you
22:03about each
22:04eventuality
22:05obviously it would be
22:07the best thing ever
22:08if he was
22:08do you accept
22:10that you've jumped
22:11in a bit quickly
22:12when
22:13I know I was
22:17writing to him
22:18quite rarely
22:19like most of the time
22:21and everything
22:22but
22:22I think I was
22:24going a bit too quick
22:25but now
22:26I mean it's easy
22:27isn't it
22:28from outside
22:28to say don't
22:29run before you can walk
22:31but let's deal
22:32with the definitive proof
22:33I have to ask you this
22:34what if he's not
22:35then I've just got
22:38to stay strong
22:40and probably look
22:41keep looking
22:43for my dad
22:44and as you said Steve
22:45if she wants any help
22:47in that department
22:48I'll be there
22:49it's nice to hear
22:51if she wants to talk
22:53about anything
22:53I'll be there
22:54just desperate to know
22:56aren't you
22:57alright darling
22:59take a breath
23:00the tissues on the way
23:01and those all important
23:02DNA results
23:02finally on this show
23:03they're coming right next
23:04the DNA test results
23:06show that Stephen
23:07you are prioritising
23:23alcohol
23:24above
23:24this
23:25daughter
23:26change
23:27you need to want
23:36it so badly
23:37you need to heal
23:40I'm going to show you
23:41a different view of it
23:42now just to make it
23:43easier for you
23:44you want our help
23:45yeah
23:46Theresa, Emma, Gina and
23:48Graham on the solo
23:48start communicating
23:57with each other
23:58about what the problems
23:59really are in this
24:00relationship
24:01thank you very much indeed
24:10welcome back
24:11so before the break
24:12I was talking to Steve
24:12and Andrew
24:13a massive day
24:13for both of you
24:14just want to touch
24:15upon your sister
24:15Jackie Wright
24:16she's been involved
24:17in this as well
24:18Jackie
24:18I know you might
24:19she don't have to
24:19jump up
24:20I know you had
24:21two reservations
24:22like Steve
24:22it was all a bit quick
24:23but you can sort of
24:24understand it in a way
24:25I do
24:25I do
24:25when Stephen phoned me
24:28he sort of said to me
24:29I've got news for you
24:30and I said
24:30oh you know
24:31what is it
24:31somebody died
24:32and he said
24:33oh no
24:33somebody's claimed
24:35my daughter
24:35was on the net
24:36and said
24:36they're my daughter
24:37and I said
24:38oh okay
24:39and I spoke to Stephen
24:40and I said to
24:41I found Angela
24:42and I had Angela
24:43and I spoke to her
24:44and I said
24:44do you mind
24:45if I call you
24:45and we had
24:46quite a lengthy conversation
24:48and we talked to each other
24:49and found out
24:50about each other
24:50what this story
24:52obviously proves
24:53is that these situations
24:54that do happen
24:56and can happen
24:56you do have to get fact
24:58and you do have to
24:59tread carefully
24:59because people get set
25:01in their ways
25:02in terms of what they believe
25:03and obviously last time
25:04you know
25:04it was just so upsetting
25:05that we couldn't
25:06give the conclusive result
25:08alright darling
25:08thank you very much
25:09I know it's been two shows
25:10I know you've waited 25 years
25:11should we do the truth
25:12alright darling
25:13let's do this all important
25:14DNA results please
25:15thanks Will
25:17the DNA test results
25:24show that Stephen
25:25darling I'm really sorry
25:32he's not your biological father
25:33you're still there yeah
25:43sorry
25:44alright
25:45didn't see that coming
25:49strong yeah
25:52don't give up
25:54listen let's
25:55you come with me
25:56let's go backstage
25:56come with me
25:57come this way
25:58come here sweet
26:08come here
26:10I desperately desperately
26:13feel for you
26:14look at me
26:14I know
26:15that's not what you want
26:17to hear
26:18but
26:18the truth is always better
26:20now I'm going to add
26:21some in here
26:22okay
26:22I think this guy's top
26:25what he said
26:25alright
26:26I know that's not
26:26what you want to hear
26:27right now
26:27because
26:28but anything
26:30that this show
26:30will throw its full weight
26:32we will discover
26:32the truth for you
26:33I promise you
26:36we have a particularly
26:37good track record
26:38in finding
26:38the truth
26:40okay
26:40horrible for her
26:43horrible situation
26:53for you
26:53Graeme's going to come in
26:54and give his bit with you
26:58after the show
26:59listen
26:59I don't even want you
27:01to
27:01I don't
27:02I don't want you to
27:03feel that you've got to
27:04say anything
27:04I know we offer
27:04cancelling after the last show
27:06you okay
27:08yeah
27:09you promise
27:11yeah
27:12my promise is the show
27:13we will be there for you
27:14alright
27:14actually I'm so sorry
27:16you okay
27:18alright darling
27:20I'm going to leave you with Graeme
27:20but thank you for coming on
27:21and we will do all we can
27:22to support you
27:23okay
27:23give her a round of applause
27:24those men
27:25right next this morning
27:35we meet Aaron
27:36who's on the show
27:37to give his mum Cindy
27:37an ultimatum
27:38give up the gas
27:39and the drink abuse
27:40or risk losing him
27:41now Aaron has spent
27:42his entire life
27:43watching his mother
27:43slowly killing herself
27:44and he claims
27:45that he hates his mum
27:46and is embarrassed
27:47and ashamed
27:48of her squalid existence
27:49this really is
27:50one of the most
27:51terrific stories
27:52I've ever done
27:52on this show
27:52let's get son Aaron
27:53out ladies and gentlemen
27:54thanks for coming on
28:02I said in the introduction
28:04terrific this story
28:06this is about solvent abuse
28:09and this is about
28:09your mother
28:10and a 20 year habit
28:12Cindy
28:12can you just
28:12for us
28:13outsiders
28:14tell us
28:15what goes on
28:16basically
28:17it's just like
28:18you look
28:20you look
28:20and you want
28:21a mother
28:21figure in front of you
28:22but looking at her
28:23you just think
28:24what am I looking at
28:26you know what I mean
28:26it's not even
28:27I'm so embarrassed
28:28to even say that
28:29it's my mother
28:29let's talk about
28:30what she does
28:31let's talk about
28:32the abuse
28:32because we've done
28:34plenty of people
28:35on this show
28:35who are addicted
28:36to booze
28:37how much is she drinking
28:37and say from cans
28:41to bottles
28:41she's drink like
28:42whatever she can get
28:44her hands on
28:44really
28:44if she's drinking
28:45Stella
28:45she'll drink about
28:46say 10 cans a day
28:48she'll fall asleep
28:49conk out
28:50drunk
28:50wake back up
28:51and then finish off
28:52Stella
28:52on her side
28:53that's alcohol
28:54let's talk about
28:55the solvent abuse
28:55now
28:56what is it
28:57that she inhales
28:57it's gas butane
28:59it's what you
29:00refill your lighters with
29:01she inhales
29:03the gas
29:04that we refill lice
29:06with butane
29:07and this is unbelievable
29:08how much a day
29:10at least 12 cans a day
29:11now this is a
29:17constant abuse
29:18every day without fail
29:20and you grew up
29:22seeing this
29:22let's just
29:25I sent
29:26Graham and the team
29:27out
29:27to just
29:28try and gain
29:29some sort of
29:30understanding
29:30about something
29:31that we've never
29:32covered on this show
29:33before
29:33let's take a look
29:34at this VT guys
29:35well thank you
29:38for inviting us here
29:39that's fine
29:40thank you
29:41for coming
29:41I wanted to come here
29:43specifically to find out
29:45what your daily life
29:46is about
29:46just tell me
29:47what your daily life
29:48is about
29:48just getting up
29:50well nothing really
29:51it's just getting up
29:52in the morning
29:53what time
29:54well I only have about
29:55more or less an hour
29:56of sleep
29:57every night
29:58one hour
29:59yeah
29:59I'm not sleeping
30:01I'm not eating
30:02why now have you
30:04decided to stop
30:05using butane
30:05because I've got
30:06another grandkid
30:06on the way as well
30:07my daughter's
30:08on another baby
30:08and you know
30:10they're both scared
30:11that they're not
30:12going to see me
30:12next year
30:13you know from
30:14what I read
30:15about butane gas
30:16it's absolutely
30:18horrendous
30:19I'm sorry about
30:21taking this now
30:22but I need it
30:23I really do need it
30:24okay
30:25do you buy this
30:31in bulk
30:32yeah
30:32how many cans
30:33do you buy at a time
30:34twelve
30:34what would you do
30:37if you couldn't
30:39get hold of this
30:39I get very aggressive
30:41it just chills me out
30:43this chills you out
30:44yeah
30:45when did you start
30:46using this
30:47twenty years
30:47butane gas
30:49yeah
30:49from what I read
30:50not from what I've
30:52experienced
30:52but butane gas
30:53can kill
30:55after just
30:56one inhalation
30:57it could be
30:58instant death
30:59and I don't want
31:01that do I
31:01and it doesn't
31:03matter how many
31:04years you've been
31:04using it
31:05yeah
31:05you could run
31:06the same risk
31:07as a first time
31:08user and that
31:09could be instant death
31:10to be quite honest
31:11I'm quite lucky
31:12really aren't I
31:12then I've just
31:12left for twenty years
31:13when you say
31:16you're lucky
31:16after twenty years
31:17can you imagine
31:18the physical damage
31:20this has done
31:20no
31:21no
31:22I don't even know
31:23what it is
31:23I mean
31:23I get really bad
31:25headaches
31:25as well
31:26and I get
31:27like
31:28sometimes
31:29I get lumps
31:30on my head
31:30inside my head
31:31and then they keep
31:32they come in
31:33and they're coming
31:33and they're going
31:34so I don't know
31:34whether that's
31:35you know
31:35one day
31:36it might just explode
31:38give me this can
31:40look at this can
31:41here
31:42extremely flammable
31:44yeah
31:44yeah
31:45and I smoke
31:46as well
31:46and you smoke
31:47as well
31:48surely you never
31:49smoke when you're
31:50using this
31:50yeah
31:50you do
31:51yeah
31:52but I don't put
31:54the cigarette
31:54in me
31:54I don't actually
31:55put the
31:55you know
31:57the cigarette
31:57I don't put
31:58the light
31:58in me
31:58but I light
31:59it like that
32:00how dangerous
32:02is your lifestyle
32:03I know
32:03the process here
32:08is
32:08you inhale
32:09this gas
32:10it goes into
32:11your lungs
32:12from the lungs
32:14it goes into
32:14your bloodstream
32:15from the bloodstream
32:16it goes to your
32:17brain
32:17yeah
32:18and then you
32:19have to get
32:19rid of it
32:20can you imagine
32:22the damage
32:23that's doing
32:24to all of those
32:25organs that I've
32:26just mentioned
32:26you have to stop
32:28because it's
32:29damaging you
32:30physically
32:30whilst we've
32:31been talking
32:31you must have
32:32been using
32:33that
32:33butane
32:34twice
32:35every minute
32:35yeah
32:36is that
32:38the pattern
32:38throughout the day
32:39yeah
32:39constant
32:41and it's 12
32:43cans a day
32:43yeah
32:44maybe sometimes
32:45more
32:45if I've got
32:46any more money
32:46left I'll get
32:47more
32:47what do your
32:48kids say to you
32:50they love me
32:51and that
32:52my son
32:53shouts at me
32:53but
32:54he's only
32:54because his
32:55sick is coming
32:55home
32:56and he said
32:56he can't bring
32:57anybody here
32:57because you know
32:58the state of the
32:58house and things
32:59like that
32:59and
33:01my daughter
33:02my daughter
33:02she's brilliant
33:04I wish there was a mum like her
33:06because she's a good mum
33:07and I'm not
33:10bless you for being here
33:15that's your mum
33:15I've sat here for four years
33:17I'm absolutely
33:18gobsmacked by that
33:20is that a constant thing
33:21with a can in her
33:22yeah
33:22ever since you can remember
33:25I think Graeme's
33:27spot on
33:27I was born
33:27to be honest with you
33:28and she's a grandmother
33:31now
33:31that's my main
33:33worry now
33:33if she's got
33:34grandchildren coming up
33:35now I don't want
33:36them looking at her
33:38seeing the same thing
33:38I've seen all my life
33:40you know what I mean
33:40have you tried every
33:42which way to try
33:43and make this one
33:43everyone's always
33:44put something in
33:45put effort in
33:45to help
33:46it's always
33:47have a back in your face
33:48or she won't
33:49she ain't got the
33:49motivations to do
33:50anything herself
33:51so everyone's just
33:53given up on her now
33:54and it's like
33:54I'm old enough now
33:56so I'm thinking
33:57which way is going
33:58to help her
33:58so I've tried other
34:00things and it's
34:00just not working
34:01did you ring this show
34:02yeah
34:02the truth is
34:05of course in anything
34:06you can't help yourself
34:07until somebody wants to
34:08you can't
34:09you can't be helped
34:10I should say
34:11unless you know
34:12you want to help yourself
34:13and you see a woman
34:14there who says
34:15I mean
34:15I actually genuinely
34:17can't just believe
34:18she's sat there
34:18with a can
34:20that's for a cigarette
34:20lighter and is inhaling
34:21how do you get into
34:22something like that
34:23I couldn't tell you
34:24what sort of mum
34:25has she been
34:26has she been a mum
34:27I wasn't even a
34:27carnival mum
34:28I wasn't
34:28I wasn't
34:29when I look at her
34:30I'm ashamed to say
34:32that's my mum
34:33do you know what I mean
34:33she's not a mother
34:34she's just
34:35she cook for you
34:36and look after
34:36I wouldn't let her cook
34:37I wouldn't let her cook
34:38clean
34:38do anything
34:39do me washing
34:39because she can't
34:40she's not capable
34:41of doing it
34:42and if she does do
34:42something
34:43it's not done properly
34:45it's not even worth
34:46doing it
34:47so you brought yourself
34:48up almost
34:49I want to say something
34:50before I get your sister out
34:51and I want you in years
34:53to come to watch this
34:54because you
34:56are living proof
34:57yet again
34:58on this show regularly
34:59we get people
35:00who say
35:00I've had a bad upbringing
35:01my mother didn't do this
35:02and my father didn't that
35:03and I'm in prison
35:04and I'm drinking
35:05yeah
35:07you've got it right
35:08haven't you
35:08you're not doing these things
35:10you're trying to make
35:11something of your life
35:12and I support you for that
35:13sister Stacey as well
35:14you've grown up together
35:15going through this
35:16we're going to get her out
35:16this is Stacey on the show
35:17welcome to the show Stacey
35:30you two said to my researchers
35:33this is all I remember
35:35I mean you grow up
35:36with a mum who
35:36is that what life's like
35:42even if someone has to see it
35:46he's only two year old
35:49do you live there as well
35:51no I moved out
35:53I'm scared that she might be dead
35:57by the next baby's born
35:59which is in 10 weeks
36:00she won't listen to anybody
36:02nobody
36:03she's hit me when I've had
36:08my two year old son
36:09on my knee
36:09she just lashes out
36:12anything
36:13she lashes out as well
36:14if he takes
36:16like when we're at home
36:17when I
36:18while he goes around
36:19or something
36:19and he takes a can
36:20out of her hand
36:21she'll start lashing out
36:22and screaming
36:22and kicking at him
36:23your brother said something
36:26that I would have thought
36:26most people would
36:27would recoil at
36:28I don't know
36:29where she's at
36:30but he's embarrassed
36:31by her
36:32do you share that sentiment
36:33yeah
36:33I guess you must worry
36:38about him staying there
36:39as well
36:40yeah she don't buy
36:41no shopping
36:41if he wants anything
36:43to eat
36:43he has to go buy it
36:44himself
36:44strong man
36:48all she lives off
36:49is a gas and a beer
36:50she eats
36:52gas and beer
36:53that is her diet
36:54yeah
36:54if she eats a piece of toast
36:56it won't stay down
36:57she's straight in the toilet
36:58how does somebody's life
37:02come to that
37:03that's just
37:04what do you want to achieve
37:05today darling
37:06just to get her off
37:08what she's doing
37:08to be a better mum
37:10it's extraordinary
37:11you two
37:11extraordinary
37:13that you can sit here
37:14having turned your lives
37:15around yourselves
37:16I'm really proud of you
37:17both for that
37:17but the fact that after
37:1820 years of nothing
37:19from your mum
37:20you're both actually here
37:21saying we want to help her
37:22do you know what
37:24if she stopped putting
37:25that rubbish inside her
37:26she might look and realise
37:27a couple of amazing kids
37:28she's got
37:28right after the break
37:29we're going to meet Cindy
37:30the big question is
37:31is this lady ready to change
37:32because today is D-Day
37:33we're right back
37:34don't go anywhere
37:34you smoke
37:36yeah
37:36I mean you know
37:37in layman's terms
37:38from Mr. Carr
37:38you could blow yourself up
37:39yeah
37:40I'm being serious
37:41I've nearly done that before
37:42when I forgot that
37:42I put a cigarette in my mouth
37:44and it's like
37:44have you been the victim
37:57of the ultimate betrayal
37:58as a friend got too close
37:59to your partner
38:00and now you're riddled
38:00with suspicion
38:01that something is going on
38:02between them
38:02maybe you feel it's your lover
38:04you can't trust
38:04with those close to you
38:05and you're demanding answers
38:06now if you need our help
38:07and you want to be considered
38:08for the show
38:08text the word talk today
38:09with your name
38:10to 63334
38:11text costs 25 pence
38:13plus one standard
38:13network rate message
38:14to call the team today
38:15it's 09011123456
38:19calls will cost you 25 pence
38:21from a BT landline
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38:23may be higher
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38:26and you must be 16 or more
38:27if you want to contact the show
38:29thank you guys
38:37welcome back
38:38so before the break
38:38I was talking to Aaron
38:39and Stacey
38:39I have to say
38:40just a shocking shocking story
38:42a woman who doesn't eat
38:43your mother
38:43a woman who
38:44for 20 years
38:45has inhaled
38:46butane gas
38:48that we refill lighters
38:50with 12 cans
38:51cans that big a day
38:52drinks 10 to 12 pints
38:54of Stella
38:55and exists just on that
38:55has been
38:56by your admission
38:57absolutely nothing
38:58of a mother
38:59no
39:00do you think she'll listen?
39:01she won't listen to me
39:05I don't know
39:05I hope so
39:06just hope it all gets through to her
39:09and she gets back to the normal self
39:11how she
39:11well it's been her life
39:13because she's 39
39:14and from what you guys
39:15have been saying
39:16for half of her life
39:17this is what she's been doing
39:18now bear in mind
39:19and I always do say this
39:20you know
39:20if somebody comes on this show
39:21they're brave enough
39:22to actually want to confront
39:23what's going on
39:23let's get Cindy on the show
39:25ladies and gentlemen
39:25I love you
39:42well done for being here
39:50I have to be really honest with you
39:52that's completely shocked me
39:55more than most things I've done
39:56there's two or three moments
39:57I can pull from four years
39:59but
39:59that's awful
40:02I know
40:03how do you start
40:05inhaling
40:06gas
40:07lighter fuel
40:08how did I start it?
40:10I started it
40:11with
40:12we both started it
40:14and then I just
40:15just continued taking it
40:17all the time
40:17at first I used to get
40:20a buzz
40:20you know
40:20I get a buzz off it
40:21and now it doesn't do
40:22it doesn't give me a buzz
40:23or anything
40:23that's just a thought
40:24I'm just going to the shop now
40:25and just go and buying it
40:26you're drinking ten cans
40:27of a day
40:28you don't eat
40:28sometimes more
40:29no I don't eat
40:29but you are just
40:30I mean
40:30it's all shocking
40:32but Graeme said on that VT
40:33you smoke
40:34yeah
40:35I mean you know
40:35in layman's terms
40:36from Mr. Carr
40:37you could blow yourself up
40:38yeah
40:38I'm being serious
40:39I've nearly done that before
40:40when I forgot that
40:41I've put a cigarette in my mouth
40:43and it's like
40:43and I have to do this Cindy
40:46whether you like this or not
40:48you have patently failed
40:50both of your children
40:51I know
40:51I've not been a good mother
40:53only granted
40:54this guy there's no food in the fridge
40:57the house is squalid
40:58and yet look how they've turned out
41:00they're a credit to themselves
41:03love
41:03there's no part of you
41:04in the past 20 years
41:06wanted to turn your life around
41:07for these two
41:08I was always thinking of myself
41:10do you know what I want you to do
41:12without getting angry
41:13because apparently you lash out
41:14if you don't get your own way
41:15be a mother
41:17and listen to what these two
41:18want to tell you
41:19what it's been like
41:19and how awful it's been
41:20tell her the truth
41:22you know yourself
41:23we've tried
41:25we've tried our best
41:26even if we take you off
41:28it's just not going to work
41:30for you is it
41:30you just go mad
41:31and then I have a phone
41:33the police to get me out
41:34the house
41:34if I take gas off
41:36so I can't win either way
41:38this is what I'm in now
41:39it's your last shot now
41:41you've got another grandchild
41:43on the way
41:43change it all
41:45be in your little bubble
41:46all your life
41:46and you're going to be
41:48left with no one
41:48aren't you
41:49well I might not be here
41:50then I'd like to see
41:50the next day
41:51that's what I mean
41:51until you die
41:52or you end up in prison
41:53or something
41:54that's it now
41:55so hopefully
41:56just try to love your life
41:56while you can
41:57but not on your gas
41:58and your beer
41:58it's not too
42:00obviously we've been
42:01brought up with it
42:02it's not
42:02it's not too late
42:04to change it around
42:05for your grandchildren
42:05we've sort of
42:07accepted it now
42:08because we've been
42:09with it all the time
42:09that's what you've been used to
42:10aren't you
42:10but
42:11but they shouldn't have
42:12been used to this
42:13I can't
42:14I'm just finding it
42:15really hard
42:16to hear
42:17your daughter say
42:19you've got to do
42:20something about
42:20depending on gas
42:21and beer
42:22what sort of life
42:23do you think that is
42:23rubbish
42:24rubbish
42:26let's talk about
42:28a normal day
42:28what time do you get up
42:30probably about
42:32three o'clock
42:33or something
42:33in the afternoon
42:34no
42:35I only have about
42:35an hour sleep
42:36every night
42:38and you start
42:39with the gas
42:39and the beer
42:40straight away
42:40yeah
42:41you don't do anything
42:43but sit in the house
42:44and
42:44I've even stopped
42:45cleaning
42:46if she goes to the shop
42:47she goes to the shop
42:48and attacks her
42:48two minute walk away
42:51you start at three o'clock
42:54in the morning
42:55and the beginning of your day
42:56is inhaling lighter fuel gas
42:59the one thing that we do
43:02try and do on this show
43:02and I never ever
43:03you know
43:04pretend that it's easy
43:06for anybody
43:06to turn their life around
43:07but we
43:08we do try and give people
43:10the tools
43:10by which they can change
43:12but
43:12Mrs
43:13I ain't seen anything
43:14either on that
43:15or speaking to these two
43:16that says that you can change
43:17that you've got the will
43:18to do that
43:18so ultimately
43:19you know
43:19I can give you
43:20the help of Graham
43:21and the team
43:22but it has to come
43:23from inside you
43:24yeah
43:24you've got to help yourself
43:25first don't you
43:25let's get Graham on the show
43:26ladies and gentlemen
43:27can I start differently
43:33I've never been more shocked
43:34than what I just saw
43:35it is quite shocking
43:36isn't it
43:37and you were there
43:37yeah
43:38were you shocked
43:39absolutely shocked
43:40really
43:41because
43:42throughout
43:43the whole interview
43:44you were inhaling
43:46the butane gas
43:47when you speak about
43:48physical dependency
43:50and psychological dependency
43:51these two children here
43:54have told me
43:55that when you used
43:57to go on holiday
43:58you left the gas
43:59at home
43:59yeah
44:00I did
44:01so a change
44:03of environment
44:04and you didn't
44:06take the gas
44:07with you
44:07no
44:07how did you feel
44:08then
44:08I still wanted it
44:10psychologically
44:11you wanted it
44:11physically
44:12no not really
44:14I just
44:15I just wanted it
44:16but obviously
44:16you know
44:16I'm abroad
44:17I'm enjoying myself
44:18and I think so
44:19you mean you're doing
44:20something different
44:20than sat in your house
44:21with a gas canister
44:22in your hand
44:22is this not about
44:23Graham
44:24in the most basic
44:25simple terms
44:25unless I'm missing
44:26the point
44:26about a woman
44:27who's in such a rut
44:29her life
44:29and her very being
44:31centres on beer
44:32and gas
44:33that she needs
44:34to reinvent
44:34what she does
44:35with her day
44:36and have other
44:37interests and pastimes
44:38or whatever
44:38right
44:39so that this isn't
44:40what she thinks about
44:41it's not a physical
44:41addiction then
44:42it's a psychological
44:42one right
44:43well your own
44:44experience tells you
44:45that
44:45it's not me saying
44:46that
44:46your own experience
44:47tells you that
44:47because when you go
44:48on holiday
44:48a week
44:49two weeks
44:50you leave
44:50the gas at home
44:51there's no physical
44:52withdrawal symptoms
44:53she's not sick
44:54but she still has
44:56this psychological
44:56dependency that says
44:57my life revolves
44:59around butane gas
45:00I need it
45:00there is still that
45:01present
45:01my life revolves
45:03around butane gas
45:04you are going to
45:05kill yourself
45:06I know
45:07what does your
45:09what does your mum
45:10do best in life
45:11nothing
45:14when we spoke
45:16backstage
45:16and I said
45:19you know what
45:19yeah
45:20we're caring for
45:21other people
45:22caring for other
45:22people
45:23if she goes out
45:24of the house
45:24and she goes to
45:25her friends
45:25like if their house
45:27is a mess
45:27she'll just go
45:28I can't sit in here
45:29why it's like
45:30clean up
45:30and then care for
45:32them like until
45:32she gets a beard
45:33down her neck
45:34and then that's it
45:35then everything
45:36goes out
45:36over the wall
45:37and that's it
45:38but when she goes
45:39to those houses
45:39when she's caring
45:40for people
45:40when she's cleaning
45:41their homes
45:42does she have the
45:43gas with her
45:43yeah
45:44she has the gas
45:44it's almost like
45:45anywhere outside
45:47Graham
45:47her own environment
45:48and away from her
45:49by your own
45:50omission
45:51squalid existence
45:52beer gas
45:53and no effort
45:54when she does
45:55other things
45:56she's motivated
45:56in different ways
45:57how do we go about
45:58first time ever
45:59dealing or helping
46:01with a woman
46:01with a 20 year
46:02solvent abuse problem
46:03how do we do it
46:04just let's look at
46:05the experience
46:05that we've all had
46:06today
46:06and the information
46:07that you gave me
46:08that she does go
46:10on holiday
46:10she doesn't take
46:11the gas with her
46:12and there's no
46:12physical withdrawal
46:13symptoms
46:14I brought her
46:15to studios
46:15two hours ago
46:16and she's not
46:18used it
46:19because she's not
46:21in the house
46:21sorry
46:22because she's not
46:22in the house
46:23on her own
46:23there we go
46:24she's not in the house
46:25you know one of the
46:26basic principles here
46:27is to change
46:28your lifestyle
46:29yeah I need something
46:30to motivate me
46:31to do something
46:32to turn the days
46:32and
46:33can I ask you
46:33something actually
46:34sorry right
46:34how do you feel
46:35two hours
46:35you haven't had any
46:36gas for two hours
46:36how do you feel
46:37um I'm okay
46:38I'm just a bit
46:39I just get a bit
46:39shaky and that
46:40that's all
46:40just get a bit shaky
46:42a bit nervous
46:42and that
46:43I'm alright
46:44but I know what
46:46like obviously
46:46when I get home
46:47I'll go you know
46:48see it's at home again
46:49when I'm at home
46:50I sit on the sofa
46:51I sit there 23 hours
46:53a day sometimes
46:53and throughout that
46:5423 hours I'm
46:55inhaling gas
46:56right great
46:56seriously
46:57because of time
46:57what are we going to do
46:58it's a very complex
46:59it's a very complex situation
46:59it is
47:00and er it's not going
47:01to be solved overnight
47:02but we have to look
47:03at every aspect of it
47:05we have to look
47:05at your psychology
47:06we have to look
47:07at the environment
47:07in which you're living
47:08we have to look
47:09at all of those things
47:10and we have to create
47:11a plan
47:11which all three of you
47:12will be involved in
47:13do you want to do this
47:14yes
47:14yeah I've got to
47:16you have to for them
47:17but you have to for yourself
47:18for your grandchildren
47:19I've got to do it for myself
47:20first and then I want
47:21to do it for me
47:21because I want to
47:22I want to finish
47:23by something I said already
47:24and I know Graeme
47:25will agree with me
47:25you should be so proud
47:26of these two
47:27because they could be
47:28in the gutter
47:28I've got millions
47:30of examples of people
47:31like them who go
47:31my life's a disaster
47:32I'm in jail
47:33I'm this, that and the other
47:33I'm on drugs
47:34because my mum
47:34or my dad or whatever
47:35didn't bother
47:35they've done really well
47:37they need to look up to you
47:39you need to tell
47:40your life round
47:41this is a story
47:42I'm going to watch
47:43and watch
47:43Graeme thank you
47:44Aaron, Stacey and Cindy
47:45on the show
47:46give them a round of applause
47:47go that way guys
47:48thank you very much Steve
47:48good luck
47:49go that way darling
47:50thank you
47:55shocking and unbelievable
47:57good luck to her
47:58and the family
47:59we are out of time
48:00if you want to be on this show
48:00you need our help
48:01don't forget to visit the website
48:02the details are on your screens
48:03right now
48:03thank you to all of today's guests
48:05thank you to this lovely audience
48:06but most of all
48:07a big thank you to you
48:07for watching at home
48:08I'll see you very soon
48:09take care
48:09bye bye for now
48:10I'll see you next time
48:40You