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00:00:00Manhood, brought to you in part by Reboot Sports Drink.
00:00:09Welcome to another conversation on manhood, where we discuss topics that impact all men and, of course, women.
00:00:17So we always say that we are better as brothers, and we're not speaking on behalf of all men.
00:00:23We're speaking to all men.
00:00:25Today's topic is a big one.
00:00:27And I know, again, I always say it's a big one, but it is.
00:00:31It's big topics.
00:00:32It's big topics because it has big impact, and that's what's important.
00:00:36We're talking about choice is relative.
00:00:39So you have choice, people think, from a certain position, and where they're at in life at that moment.
00:00:46And that's their choice to make.
00:00:47So without further ado, let's get straight into it.
00:00:50Johansi IODK, behavior change consultant, always a pleasure.
00:00:53To his right, the man known as Christmas List, or Chris, a journalist who's spent a lot of time in Trinidad and Tobago recently, documenting life in Trinidad and Tobago.
00:01:07And to his right, KG, a friend, an artist, a podcaster, a producer.
00:01:13So many titles here today, you know, but real pleasure, guys.
00:01:18I know the busy schedule that you all have, and the importance that you all place on manhood, because it's the message that we're trying to get out.
00:01:25So choice is relative.
00:01:27All right, well, let's dive right in.
00:01:30I've noticed sometimes people often say, I have to do something, or they say something, I have no choice but to.
00:01:38But the truth is, we always have a choice.
00:01:41Even if there's a gun to your head, you still have a choice.
00:01:44And I'm putting it out there because knowing that you have a choice, and I will say this to the audience, knowing that you have a choice is coming from a place of empowerment.
00:01:52But from the time you say, I have no choice, or I have to do this, or I have to be this way, you're coming from a place of disempowerment.
00:02:00Tell me your thoughts.
00:02:01Yeah, but the word relative is so important, right?
00:02:05The example that you provided, a gun to the head, doesn't have many options, right?
00:02:10But since we're talking about men, men growing up, even from birth in Trinidad, the options are relative to where they grew up.
00:02:20Did they have a father involved?
00:02:22Who was the father?
00:02:25I'm finding a lot of generational issues in Trinidad, in particular with the boys.
00:02:31If your father was a gun toter, your options are not going to be the same as if you grew up in the mountains in a prestigious school in Trinidad.
00:02:40Right.
00:02:41So they are very relative.
00:02:43I don't think, see, I think this is a great topic, and the title itself is perfect.
00:02:46You know, when I create videos and I read the comments, I got to put myself into each commenter's mindset.
00:02:55You know, if they see a gang member, a lot of them will say, well, he didn't have to do that.
00:03:00But my first question to them is like, where did you grow up?
00:03:03Maybe you don't have the ability to speak on behalf of somebody that didn't have the privilege that you had.
00:03:08After doing this for three years, full-time, and meeting gang members around the world, there's common denominators.
00:03:16Most of them had a difficult childhood.
00:03:19Most of them were birthed and grew up in a neighborhood that didn't give them many options.
00:03:25Right.
00:03:25I still meet doctors that grew up in bad neighborhoods, so there are opportunities, but they're a lot lesser than somebody for myself, like an example that grew up in Toronto, where I've never gone one day without food.
00:03:37Never once was I ever concerned about crossing a certain walkway and being a target.
00:03:43Right.
00:03:43Right?
00:03:44So my options are relative to my upbringing.
00:03:46So what I would say is for those people that are watching this content or watching my content, you've got to take yourself out of your current shoes and walk, like they say, walk a mile in a man's shoes to really understand that not everyone has the selection of options that myself, I had.
00:04:06That's for sure.
00:04:07And KG, you would have seen that also, you know, as a Trinidad music producer as well.
00:04:11You know, some of the things that you shared with me that was a real eye-opener is that people see it a lot of times as, you know, inciting violence and lyrics like that.
00:04:21But really and truly, the truth is they're just speaking about what they've encountered, the life that they're living.
00:04:26Yeah, what they know.
00:04:28You know, what a man know is what a man know.
00:04:30You know, as Chris say, if you grew up in the mountains, you'd have lived a life of a man in the mountains.
00:04:36You know, if you grew up in the streets where bear crime, bear corruption, most of the times that is what you would be experiencing and that is what would reflect, you know, through your life now.
00:04:49Yeah.
00:04:49So when you're talking about choice, as we said, choice is relative to someone who, as you referred to, you know, using the analogy here, living in the mountains or living in a life that is that, you know, where you look, you can open your fridge and you can get something to eat.
00:05:05You can go home and there's a certain level of safety that you feel.
00:05:10And safety not necessarily meaning that you're not afraid to get robbed or something.
00:05:15Safety meaning that you have a family unit around, you have a community, right?
00:05:19You react and behave a certain way and you can't fathom why something else is happening because you haven't walked a mile in their shoes.
00:05:29So people aren't inherently born bad or born evil, you know, and this is in no way justifying what is occurring in, you know, our home of Trinidad and Tobago.
00:05:43And your adopted home, Chris, it is a product of the environment.
00:05:51I think that we underrate poverty a lot in this country now, you know, it's so easy to say I wouldn't have been like that if I was in that position.
00:06:06Like I've been hearing people saying that, you know, like I could grow up in the ghetto and still come out to be something.
00:06:11Okay, that's all well and good.
00:06:12We are hearing you.
00:06:13But as Chris say, he never had to go a day without eating, you know, just think about how would you think if you had to think about food every single day of your life.
00:06:24Like I just wake up in the morning and sometimes I have food there waiting for me, you know, so I didn't have to study that.
00:06:30I could just put my clothes and live my life.
00:06:32But as some people, they can't even think about the next step because the first step, which is nutrition, which is food, they don't even have that benefit.
00:06:41And then we could go another step further, KG, where you may have food in your fridge because of the lifestyle that you chose, even in those environments.
00:06:49But if you choose to be in a different environment, you know, your friend might be, you know, looking at maybe a darker side of life.
00:06:56And if you decide to choose another side, are you going to be ostracized from your community, which is your safe space, which is your pack?
00:07:03Correct.
00:07:03You know, they're friends after all.
00:07:05Or are you, you know, in terms of trying to move outside of that, are you going to be accepted by community, by other communities?
00:07:13Yes.
00:07:13So it's like you almost, well, I don't have a choice.
00:07:16Okay.
00:07:17In certain specific instances.
00:07:19And, you know, as I just want to quickly mention, you know, people that, you know, and I applaud what you're doing, Chris, because you're going in, you're showing the Trinidad and Tobago another view, you know, a realistic viewpoint.
00:07:32But without calling any names, persons that go in there like a fad, like a fashion, and they say, hey, you know, I could, as you just pointed out, I could go in the ghetto, I could go in these areas and use it as some sort of, you know, social media push.
00:07:50But the reality is those persons can remove themselves from that environment and go back into a nice environment.
00:07:56They could eat food.
00:07:57They can be accepted in other areas.
00:07:59And therefore, you know, they, you want to see a burn in the side of my face here.
00:08:06Well, what, what, I'm coming to what, KJ, you were saying, people think a certain, people have a certain mentality.
00:08:12What I realize is most of us, we won't taught emotional intelligence.
00:08:19We were all taught academics in school, right?
00:08:21And emotional intelligence is the ability to put yourself in somebody else's shoes.
00:08:26Now, not exact because you're not them, but to even see it from a different perspective.
00:08:31So most of us lack that.
00:08:32So I help and understand why people would even look at it in such an obtuse manner.
00:08:38Then secondly, is that the truth is knowledge is power.
00:08:44So even what you did, Chris, whether or not, because I know some people said you were doing it also for a publicity stunt.
00:08:51You were doing it for your own selfish reasons.
00:08:53And it's okay, even if you're doing it for selfish reasons, all of us do things for reasons that we want, which is fine.
00:09:00But the fact is, knowledge is power.
00:09:03Some of those places that you went to, many people never even see the living right here in Trinidad and never even see it.
00:09:09And it was interesting because when you went to Belmont, I grew up in Belmont.
00:09:13So some of the places you went, I was playing as a child.
00:09:17So I was like, okay, I know this is real because I could see these things.
00:09:20And then some of the other comments that I read and even people spoke to, they grew up in St. Paul Street.
00:09:25They grew up in Tunapuna.
00:09:27I think even Tunapuna.
00:09:28They grew up in this area.
00:09:29So they know it real.
00:09:31But for someone else, they didn't know.
00:09:34But the good thing is, many people, even though some people would say, well, if I grew up in a ghetto, I would never be like that.
00:09:40There were some people say, wow, I didn't know it was really like this.
00:09:44So, of course, you'll have the naysayers.
00:09:47But I'm glad because knowledge is knowledge.
00:09:49And once you have knowledge, you're able to make a better choice.
00:09:52So even if it's choice of the person who's living in the situation or the choice of the person who's seen it from outside,
00:09:57they are now better informed whether to help or just to ostracize those guys.
00:10:04For me, if I have a moment, I could share a story.
00:10:09You know, as somebody that walks into different communities around the world, I've been to 128 countries now.
00:10:14I've learned to not bring in my own opinion all the time.
00:10:18I'm always an open book.
00:10:20I know I don't have the ability to go into somebody's shoes, but I try my best to picture if I was in that position.
00:10:26Right.
00:10:26And I couldn't guarantee I would have gone the right route.
00:10:30There's a pretty good chance that I would be doing the same thing they're doing.
00:10:33Right.
00:10:34So I'd just like to share a quick story.
00:10:36I was in Haiti right before this current disaster that's happening.
00:10:41So let's say about 12 months ago.
00:10:43And during my time there, it was eight days.
00:10:45There was 200 murders in the city.
00:10:47Okay.
00:10:48And there's one man that I met.
00:10:50I went into a neighborhood and he called himself the Inspector.
00:10:53I don't recall his real name, so the Inspector is his name.
00:10:56Right.
00:10:57So calm with his tone, with his gestures, even like opening doors for me, like the most polite man in the world.
00:11:06But I know he's a guy that carries a gun.
00:11:08And I know he's used the gun before.
00:11:10But I try to let that all sit aside and just listen to his story.
00:11:14Right.
00:11:14And through a translator, he said, you know, Chris, when I was eight years old, I was at the church collecting donations.
00:11:21But that church right now is burnt to the ground.
00:11:23There's very little remnants of the columns of that church.
00:11:26So in between now at 28 and eight years old, that 20 years has been a war, not unlike an Iraq or an Afghanistan war.
00:11:33And during that time, his brother at 13 years old was murdered.
00:11:37Now that changed the direction of his life.
00:11:39Could he have up and moved to a new neighborhood like a lot of people suggested in the comments?
00:11:44Like, no, that's not possible.
00:11:46Once you're labeled a certain neighborhood, it's more dangerous to leave.
00:11:51OK.
00:11:52So he was given arms by the local gang and saying, your job is now to protect the senior citizens that don't have anywhere to go.
00:12:00And if you don't, their house is going to be burnt down, which is all they own.
00:12:05There's a good chance they'll die from local gangs.
00:12:07Right.
00:12:08So he doesn't look at himself as a gang member.
00:12:10I do because I'm an outsider coming in.
00:12:12He looks at himself as an appointed soldier here to protect.
00:12:16Now, some people that watch my videos will get that.
00:12:19Some people won't.
00:12:20There was a time I only met him for two days.
00:12:22I spent two days with him.
00:12:23I had a bag with a drone and some extra batteries in it.
00:12:26But nobody knew what I had in my backpack.
00:12:29They just saw me with a backpack.
00:12:30There's a time where we split up because there was a gunfight while I was there.
00:12:33And he told me to go hide.
00:12:35And when I was hiding, one of his gang members came up and started wanting to go in my bag.
00:12:40Now, he stopped what he was doing to come over and protect me like a brother, somebody I just met.
00:12:45He was willing to die that moment for me against one of his own gang members.
00:12:50He said, this is my guest.
00:12:52Don't touch my guest in his language.
00:12:53Now, you know, when the video was released, he has died since.
00:12:58He was killed since.
00:13:00So I put out a tribute to him and I said, rest in peace.
00:13:03From what I knew of him, he was a good person put in circumstances that caused him to do what he did.
00:13:11But a lot of the comments are burn in hell.
00:13:14You could have been a doctor.
00:13:16You could have been this, which I don't believe is true.
00:13:18I think your surroundings will dictate your future.
00:13:24And again, I look at that as if I was born in Haiti and my little brother was killed, I might be exactly the same.
00:13:31And what he's saying is absolutely correct because I remember when I came out of university, my first clientele were addicts, right?
00:13:40Both drugs.
00:13:40So I worked in Baltimore and it was meth, heroin along those lines.
00:13:45I remember my first thought was these guys are delinquents.
00:13:48But after hearing their stories, I realized if I was in their situation, I'd probably do the same thing.
00:13:54And I'm saying that because you raise some valid points there because, again, many people choose and it's sometimes psychologically safe for them just to think, you know what?
00:14:05I'm not even putting myself in anybody's position.
00:14:08I am here and they are there and let me just keep them on that side.
00:14:12And because even if I start to think about their situation, it probably would shine a light even on their own inconsistencies, their own, for want or better, would lack of empathy to realize that, you know, maybe they could be doing more.
00:14:30And again, I'm not saying it's anybody's responsibility to help others because live your life how you want.
00:14:34But you yourself know sometimes you could be doing a little better even for your country.
00:14:39So really rich conversation, powerful conversation.
00:14:44There's so much more that we need to get into.
00:14:46We're talking about is choice relative.
00:14:48We'll be back after this break.
00:14:49Yes, welcome back to Manhood.
00:15:03My name is Chris Muslist.
00:15:04Today we're talking about is choice relative.
00:15:08And, you know, at the break, you know, we always say that we share whatever we talk about off camera, on camera.
00:15:14And a couple of things that we want to, you know, sort of get into, you know, where we spoke about Trinibad, some of the experiences that both KG and Chris have had with regards to that, about why is the expectation of death such so early in life, you know, where it's between 20 and 25 years old.
00:15:33And coming back to really break it down granular when we say is choice, you know, choice is relative.
00:15:38Because you might look at someone and say, well, they have a gold chain, so therefore they could afford to eat or they could have chosen to do something different.
00:15:45But what about before that?
00:15:47What about at the stage where they're just hungry, where they're scared?
00:15:51They're humans at that point.
00:15:53And what about that point where there is no choice but to join a pack?
00:15:57And by joining that pack, there are certain things that have to be done in that pack to simply survive.
00:16:04Before you come in, Chris, remember the last time I was on the show,
00:16:07we talk about my experience with my high school, you know, and I spoke about me going to this school for the first time.
00:16:15I went to a school before, and it was a regular school, you know, everything was nice.
00:16:20And I do come in entrance and I went to this school.
00:16:24And this school, well, to me, it was horrible compared to what I was accustomed to.
00:16:28So I was accustomed to if somebody do you something, you could have go to the teacher and be like,
00:16:33Miss, this boy hit me, you know, he will get in trouble.
00:16:36Well, this school now where I realized from the time I went to the principal's office and say,
00:16:41Sir, this man, that was the worst thing I could have done.
00:16:45And that was like a culture shock to me because my mother was teaching me,
00:16:50if somebody do you something, go and tell.
00:16:52And where that school, it was snitching.
00:16:56That was the first time people used the word, he's a snitch.
00:16:59So telling was frowned upon.
00:17:03So I couldn't even tell.
00:17:04So what I had to do, I had to defend myself because every time I tell, it making my situation worse and worse and worse.
00:17:12You surviving.
00:17:13Yeah, correct.
00:17:13And growing up, getting old and meeting friends in the streets.
00:17:18And it was like the exact same lifestyle.
00:17:21It's like if somebody take my chain or take anything of value from me, if I went to the police or I went to anything of that sort,
00:17:32it was just making it worse for me.
00:17:34And I would try to explain that to the elders around me because, like I say, I get in fights.
00:17:39They'd be like, why are you fighting?
00:17:40I'd be like, because you hit me.
00:17:41And if I come and I tell and I say you hit me, I's a baby.
00:17:44I's a imps, as they call it in Trinidad.
00:17:46So it kind of forced me to be this person where I had to just defend myself everywhere I go.
00:17:51Everywhere I go, I had to defend myself without no going to make no police report, none of that.
00:17:56While the regular citizens of this country, they were able to do these things so easy, you know,
00:18:02because they weren't around the environment I was around.
00:18:05They were around people that they agree, yes, go and tell the police if somebody do this to you.
00:18:10Go and tell your parents.
00:18:11I ain't grew up around that.
00:18:13I grew up around somebody.
00:18:13Do me something, I had to defend it.
00:18:15And me being on this defensive side for so many years, going through high school or through my early 20s,
00:18:22having to be defensive, I had to be real.
00:18:25It turned me into a monster.
00:18:27It turned me into somebody where, before you even do me something,
00:18:31I done looking at you as you are going to do me something.
00:18:34So I come in here to defend it.
00:18:36So if I go to the party, I not going to a party with me.
00:18:39I'm a one-bredgering.
00:18:40I go into a party to about 15 men.
00:18:43And people watching me like, KJ, but why you come in the club with 10, 12, 15 men?
00:18:47Because I feeling like once I come out here, somebody is going to harm me.
00:18:52So I have to protect myself.
00:18:53I'm going through, going through, and just going through life thinking that this is okay, this is okay,
00:18:59to the point where now you're moving around the place with firearms.
00:19:03You understand?
00:19:04Now you're moving like a gangster.
00:19:06Not knowing that I don't want to be a gangster.
00:19:08Men just don't want to die.
00:19:10Men just don't want to get valuables taken from them.
00:19:13People just don't want to be hurt.
00:19:15Even if I go out there with my girlfriend or go out there with my little cousins or I feel like I have a duty to protect them.
00:19:21Because the things I see in society, all right, for instance, once I go out in public, I am thinking about the worst.
00:19:31I don't know about other people, but I am thinking about the worst.
00:19:34Because I know what could happen.
00:19:36I have experiences of staring up on a corner, see a car pull up, next two seconds, two men dead.
00:19:42These are things that I see, right, without even being in crime or being a criminal.
00:19:51Just being, just playing the cards that I was dealt.
00:19:54You know, growing up in the area that I grew up in, going to the school that I went to, you know, choosing the friends that I probably chose at an early age.
00:20:04I had to experience some of the darkest things in my life, you know, and that created a lot of anxiety.
00:20:10That created a lot of trauma.
00:20:13And through that, I could never be normal again.
00:20:17You know, I have a chop on my hand with the camera.
00:20:19Which camera?
00:20:20This camera here.
00:20:21Feel it on my hand.
00:20:21I have a big chop on my hand.
00:20:23That is from me going to a party and just standing up outside the party.
00:20:27Somebody see me, probably envy me for whatever reason.
00:20:31And now we're in a altercation and I almost lost my life.
00:20:35You understand?
00:20:35So these are things that created so much trauma in my life to the point where, as I say, now I don't even feel normal.
00:20:43Now, now, now, now I'm a grown man.
00:20:45So obviously, I kind of tried to break.
00:20:48Remember, I talked to you.
00:20:49I said, I want to come to therapy.
00:20:50You still didn't come, eh?
00:20:51I'm waiting on you, right?
00:20:52But these are things that I want to do because I know the trauma I have to deal with because of the life that I came from or because of the experiences I experienced.
00:21:05You know, and I just want people to understand that a lot of us, a lot of the youths, a lot of the people that came from these lifestyles, they are dealing with serious mental issues.
00:21:17It's not just a man want to drive around the place with a gun because he like gun.
00:21:22He feeling like if he leave home, that gun is like when you leave home your cell phone.
00:21:25You know, it's a must, it's something that you have to carry this firearm around because I will lose my life.
00:21:34And that alone, that alone is the worst feeling ever.
00:21:38So when you said, you said something really profound there about you just simply don't want to die.
00:21:43You just don't want to die.
00:21:44And if the criminal elements are carrying around firearms because they also want to return to a home, whatever that home is.
00:21:52And by returning to that home, we place a judgment on that because we determine home to what we know home to be.
00:22:01But if their home is in a particular environment where it's called on, when you come back, you had to come back with a certain amount of things or you've had to, you'd have had to do something.
00:22:10Right.
00:22:11Again, you're coming back to that fundamental, I need to eat.
00:22:14I want to live.
00:22:16I want to live.
00:22:16But what happens is at some point, KG, at some point, Chris, at some point, Johanse, there is now you've gone from the basics of wanting to eat to now there is a choice.
00:22:28But is it by the time that you have that choice where you know really everybody has a moral compass?
00:22:34I don't, it doesn't matter who you are, you have a moral compass.
00:22:37And when you're now doing things for whatever reason, you enter somebody's home, you kill them, you kidnap them.
00:22:44These are, these are innocent parties to any sort of gang association.
00:22:49Say, for example, at what point do you then say, is it that you've become so numb by that point and you've crossed over?
00:22:58Or is it, is it still that we're looking at it for your product of your environment?
00:23:04Yeah.
00:23:04I think, I think, yes, we numbed it.
00:23:07You know, like me, for instance.
00:23:08I know Chris, you know, Chris been going all over the place and seeing it.
00:23:14And I believe that the reason why he is so fearless too is because he, he saw it so much.
00:23:20It's like he understands the culture and understand exactly what it is.
00:23:25A lot of people don't understand what it is.
00:23:26So people would pass remarks like, Chris, you're a brave boy.
00:23:31Why are you going in these places?
00:23:32You ain't afraid to do you something.
00:23:34But Chris very well, he understands what is the culture of these people.
00:23:39These people not going to do Chris nothing.
00:23:41You know, once Chris go in these communities with respect and, and, and, and, and principle and love,
00:23:46these people are going to treat him the exact same way.
00:23:49You know, you know, so I think is, I wouldn't say numb, numb, probably not the word, but you, you do develop a sense of understanding of what is this whole thing.
00:24:01Even, even the back side of it, where it comes to the, the corruption with the governments and all these things, you tend to understand what is going on.
00:24:09So when you watch people robbing or shooting or breaking into houses, the way how the regular person might look at it, we probably just might.
00:24:16Just a touch on that point that KG is bringing up there, where you accept your, your, your, the communities are accepting you.
00:24:28How are the communities then, Chris?
00:24:30Because we're looking at, we're looking at one, one side of the coin and saying about, you know, where people grew up and their communities and whether they become numb,
00:24:39because that's what's impacting persons who have forums and persons of a certain class and ilk, et cetera.
00:24:46Right.
00:24:47And persons who may say, yeah, but I'm minding my own business.
00:24:49I'm not harming anyone.
00:24:51But is it that they, is it that those communities see it as, yeah, but because of that way of thinking and because we feel almost ostracized and we, we, we are looking for some,
00:25:02we're looking for something more than a handout or, or pity, right?
00:25:06How, how, how, you know, their reaction is a, is a particular wizard.
00:25:10How, how are they, how are those communities looking at it?
00:25:12I'd love to touch on two things first in regards to being numb, uh, you know, normally with a career, let's use this podcast as an example, season by season, your audience grows.
00:25:21You get more opportunity, you know, the life of a gang member is the opposite doors close.
00:25:27You know, once you've committed your first robbery, um, or you've been seen with certain members of a group, doors are closing.
00:25:35You're now targeted, so you actually have less options opposed to more, uh, could you imagine being in a shootout?
00:25:42Like now you're targeted for the rest of your life, no matter, uh, what you like.
00:25:46So it's not like they can grow out of this.
00:25:47So are they numb to it?
00:25:48They have to be.
00:25:50Nobody can live in complete fear, right?
00:25:53Nobody will, will admit that.
00:25:55Now, now in regards to me as a stranger coming and getting the opportunity to go into these neighborhoods,
00:26:00I believe there is definitely a lot of mental health issues.
00:26:04People tell me stuff that they haven't told their closest friend.
00:26:07It's like they want to release this, and this is a form of being released.
00:26:11And I also truly believe that if enough people say the same thing is wrong, that there could be change.
00:26:17You know, these gangsters want simple things like Beatum, for example.
00:26:21The river that runs through the middle of their, their neighborhood, the smell of it is so, I don't know if anybody has smelt it.
00:26:28As you walk by, you feel like you're going to vomit.
00:26:31And to imagine there's homes, and every single person walks through, um, that area every day.
00:26:36So when somebody welcomes me to the neighborhood, they want to make sure that these type of things are featured with hopes that somebody's going to see this.
00:26:44Uh, the government's going to be so embarrassed that they're going to send somebody in to fix the problem.
00:26:49Right?
00:26:50It's not all about gloating.
00:26:51There's definitely an aspect of propaganda.
00:26:53For those that want to show guns, they're showing strength.
00:26:56They're trying to, yeah.
00:26:57It's like a bad, it's like a boxing match.
00:26:59If you watch a boxing match before the fight, even if they're friends, they got to hype it up.
00:27:03They got to create fear to sell the match to get you excited about it.
00:27:08Right?
00:27:09Um, I feel that I sort of touched upon it when I spoke to somebody else.
00:27:14A lot of these people, in comparison with Haiti or other places, they're very young and they're still innocent.
00:27:22They're still innocent in the sense when the camera's not on, they talk to me, sir, is everything okay, sir?
00:27:28Would you like water?
00:27:28The same ones that are toting guns.
00:27:30I don't feel like they're so far gone that they can't change.
00:27:33But because of the predicament that they're in, they really don't have the option.
00:27:38It's not like they can go get a job somewhere.
00:27:41You know, if they get a job at the hospital, they'll be killed.
00:27:44The word will get around that they work there.
00:27:47They're very limited to their choices.
00:27:49So when we say choice, that choice, as you said, is like, do I get killed or do I stay alive?
00:27:56And as you said, you simply don't want to die.
00:27:59I don't want to die.
00:28:00You also had a good perspective on Triniband.
00:28:02Yes.
00:28:03What I've seen is most of the biggest artists I've interviewed on my channel as well.
00:28:10I'm obviously not going to name names, but they're really kind-hearted people.
00:28:13You know, there's bigger people in the community that are, I can't say forcing them to say certain lyrics,
00:28:20but every community wants to be the baddest.
00:28:22Like, that's the truth.
00:28:23That's the hype around the whole music.
00:28:27So a lot of these people have given a pen and paper and just asked on their own to write lyrics.
00:28:31They're not writing the type of lyrics that they are.
00:28:34But when put in, I don't know if you ever watched, like, Mexican wrestling,
00:28:37they put this mask on, and then there's somebody completely different.
00:28:40They can go crazy in the ring and act a different way, right?
00:28:43That's part of this Triniband.
00:28:46Yes, there are things that they see in their day-to-day life that they're singing about,
00:28:49but there are a lot of very exaggerated-type things,
00:28:52especially when you see it in the beginning of any Triniband song,
00:28:55which you'll see it's like all the weaponry in this video are toys or not real.
00:29:01Like, they feel like they're in a movie.
00:29:03They're going to over-exaggerate.
00:29:04Like, give me some fake guns, and you're going to see me doing poses
00:29:07that I never would normally do in regular life.
00:29:10So with the Triniband music, I've seen both sides.
00:29:13I've seen guys that sing it, and they live it, but the majority of them,
00:29:17they're very soft-spoken, yes, sir, no, sir.
00:29:20They don't want to die.
00:29:22But they're so far in now.
00:29:23There's no turning back.
00:29:25Once you're a visible person representing a certain neighborhood,
00:29:28there's no turning back.
00:29:30That's it.
00:29:30You've made your choice.
00:29:32Johan, say, you know, I know you have a point that you wanted to make just now,
00:29:35but if you could add to it by, you know, people, the psychology behind,
00:29:39no matter who that person is, you put a guy in a suit,
00:29:43they immediately, their shoulders come out, they feel better.
00:29:47You know, they say, dress for the job that you want.
00:29:49So putting a gun of a certain level, you know,
00:29:53everyone's watching the video games, et cetera,
00:29:54and you put that in their hands, you feel a certain strength.
00:29:58Yeah.
00:29:59All right.
00:29:59So I'll go first with KG.
00:30:01Those who may not be familiar, there's a framework called Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs,
00:30:09right, where it says before you reach any type of self-actualization,
00:30:14you have to have your basic needs covered, which is food, shelter, love, or belonging.
00:30:20And I remember looking at your videos, because I think I looked at almost all now.
00:30:25The common theme was a lot of the guys were missing some of the basic needs.
00:30:32And that sense of belonging, because when I was listening to these guys,
00:30:36I was actually thinking, these guys need love, you know, right?
00:30:39I was thinking, if you just hold someone, these guys, and give them a hug, right?
00:30:43And as we've seen it, this is manhood and this is men.
00:30:46Sometimes we look at hugs and things as soft.
00:30:48But if you just hold someone, these guys, and give them a hug,
00:30:50I'm sure it will bring them to tears.
00:30:52But there are communities in Africa that do that.
00:30:55You know, when they are stray, so to speak, when they come back,
00:31:00instead of reprimanding them, the community comes together and embraces them.
00:31:04But you know what?
00:31:04When I was in a certain neighborhood, we were going uphill,
00:31:08and rather than walk, everybody jumped in the back of a pickup truck.
00:31:11And I was in a car behind the pickup truck.
00:31:13Now, as they were going up the hill, all of the men held each other in an embrace.
00:31:19And I noticed it, but the driver of my car was in the gang.
00:31:23He said, look, we're not a gang, we're a family, we love each other.
00:31:26They were holding each other in a manner that in my side of the world,
00:31:29men would not hold each other that way.
00:31:31They'd be accused of doing something different.
00:31:33But that love that they do want, because it's so difficult to get,
00:31:38I find that being a participant in what some would call a family,
00:31:43some would call a movement, others call a gang,
00:31:45it's very easily, it's easy to get enticed into that lifestyle
00:31:49when you don't have that love at home.
00:31:52And again, I've never been in a gang,
00:31:54but through talking to thousands of gang members,
00:31:57love is something I think is so important.
00:31:59Even the ability to communicate and simple things like touch
00:32:02and regular conversation is something that they yearn for,
00:32:05no different than anybody that's in this room or anybody watching this.
00:32:09The humans.
00:32:09That's the truth.
00:32:11Because, Chris, I was thinking,
00:32:13I was thinking, why are these guys being so open and honest with Chris?
00:32:17And I looked at people's comments.
00:32:19Some people say, it's because of your race, right?
00:32:21People talk about colonialism.
00:32:23They say all kinds of things.
00:32:24And I was like, okay, maybe that could be a point of view.
00:32:27But I think as Trinidad and Tobago unions,
00:32:31we love our culture, you know?
00:32:33We're proud of it.
00:32:34Even, they want to say the Trinidad side of it
00:32:37because all of us have something rich that we want to share.
00:32:40So meeting someone who is like starting from a blank slate, right?
00:32:44This guy don't know us, right?
00:32:46He don't have the stereotype or the stigma.
00:32:49So let me start speaking to him.
00:32:51And I'm sure, of course, as he started the videos,
00:32:54it started getting popular.
00:32:55So people see, you know, this guy, he went in St. James.
00:32:58I remember he went in St. James, he eats some doubles, et cetera, et cetera.
00:33:01This guy actually wants to listen to us, but everybody else may not want to.
00:33:06So let me bear my heart.
00:33:08And I was listening to even some of the little boys,
00:33:09and, you know, it just seemed that love,
00:33:13and that love are coming from because, Robert, you said,
00:33:17you don't think anybody is born inherently bad or evil.
00:33:20And I agree with that because we just want to belong.
00:33:24We just want love.
00:33:25We just want a place to live that is safe, and we just want food.
00:33:29I know we have to go to the break, right?
00:33:31So this is Manhood, and we're speaking about his choice relative.
00:33:35We have Robert, we have Chris, and we have KG.
00:33:38And my name is Johansi, and we'll be right back.
00:33:51Welcome back to Manhood,
00:33:53and the topic that we are on is choice is relative.
00:33:56We are talking off camera, basically, about what they want.
00:34:03And, you know, as you say, no millionaire is going to come and just drop half of the millions on all year,
00:34:10wherever this scene is.
00:34:11From my experience, these youths and these people,
00:34:16they basically just want a little bit of love, a little bit of opportunity.
00:34:20I went to a radio station, I think it was last week.
00:34:24And one of the things I was speaking about was,
00:34:26from my observation in this country as a youth growing up,
00:34:30I realized that once you look a certain way, we treat you a certain way.
00:34:35And that is how it always has been.
00:34:36And one thing that I noticed when I started to go into these inner cities and help them out
00:34:42is that they were so appreciative that someone was literally taking them serious.
00:34:49So, for instance, in my field of work, let's just say music,
00:34:52once you look a certain way, back in them days, the industry in Trinidad and Tobago,
00:34:57them in helping you.
00:34:58You know, if it wasn't from the west side, it wasn't from the uptown,
00:35:01or you wasn't rubbing shoulders with certain people in the industry,
00:35:06they're not taking you serious.
00:35:07They don't worry in the studio, they don't worry in the radio station,
00:35:10they don't worry on the TV show.
00:35:12It was only a certain type of person you were seeing.
00:35:16I mean, they will have you one or two that will break the barriers,
00:35:18but the majority was from a certain class of people,
00:35:21at least from my observation, right?
00:35:23And with the Trinidad industry,
00:35:26it was almost like for the first time in years,
00:35:29because obviously it's not the first time you see Get2Youth get a chance.
00:35:33You know, with the Reggae All-Stars, it was the same type of thing,
00:35:35you know, the Get2Youth get a chance.
00:35:36But the Reggae All-Stars was a short stint, and then it stopped.
00:35:39And then it went back down the soaker alley,
00:35:41where it was just who you know and who know you.
00:35:44And the Trinidad industry kind of was like the first time in years
00:35:48that you see the Get2Youth,
00:35:50the boy that never had the father to tell him,
00:35:53pull up your pants, son, so your pants still under,
00:35:55he gain a chance.
00:35:56You know, the youth that didn't have the mother to say,
00:35:59you finish your homework, he gain a chance.
00:36:01You know, and so on and so on and so on.
00:36:03And I just think that that is all these people really want,
00:36:07like Chris Finstons.
00:36:08When Chris come in there with his little camera,
00:36:11they're happy because they know they're going to get to go on YouTube
00:36:13and see themselves with thousands of views.
00:36:17So basically, all they want is to be seen,
00:36:19and all they want is to be heard.
00:36:21A lot of these youths will come to places around certain people,
00:36:25and you'll realize they will stand to the back.
00:36:27They will stay to the back.
00:36:28And you want to know why they're always just in the back.
00:36:31Because when they come to the front,
00:36:32they don't feel appreciated.
00:36:34They don't feel like the camera want to look at them.
00:36:37They want to look at the others.
00:36:39We need to break out of that, you know.
00:36:40We need to continue to help.
00:36:43And each one teach one,
00:36:44and just spread that love in these communities.
00:36:47Like, I'm a cameraman.
00:36:48I'm a producer.
00:36:49So I will go into these communities and lend my work.
00:36:52Chris is a journalist,
00:36:53so he will go into these communities and lend his work.
00:36:56You don't say,
00:36:56you could go into these communities,
00:36:58counsel.
00:36:58You say,
00:36:59you have a platform.
00:37:00You could go into these communities.
00:37:00So anything that we could do,
00:37:02we should go into these communities more.
00:37:04We should have that mindset a little more.
00:37:07It's not trying to power with the ones who already make it.
00:37:10We power with the ones that need help.
00:37:12You know what?
00:37:12I believe that is the only...
00:37:15Yeah.
00:37:15But there are some rules.
00:37:17We know this, right?
00:37:17Not everyone is welcome in the neighborhood.
00:37:20It could become dangerous for them as well.
00:37:22I'll jump in if you're complete.
00:37:24By no means am I an expert,
00:37:25no degree or anything along that lines in helping people.
00:37:28But what I can tell you is what I have seen to work before in Jamaica.
00:37:34I think the first step in gaining the ability to have some sort of relationship
00:37:39with these families or gang members
00:37:42is the government has to go in and listen to their problems.
00:37:47They have...
00:37:47Every community has problems.
00:37:49Belmont, for example.
00:37:51Two of the gentlemen here from Belmont.
00:37:53The stairs are long and old.
00:37:56And there's elderly going up every day.
00:37:57And there's big cracks.
00:37:58It's very dangerous.
00:37:59Would not take much for the government to go in
00:38:02and make that first priority.
00:38:05Get it done this week.
00:38:06Show a sign that,
00:38:08hey, I'm going to listen to your problems,
00:38:09especially when they're very minute problems
00:38:12that can be fixed in a day or two
00:38:14and last the next 30 years, right?
00:38:17Using B-tum, for example.
00:38:19Not unlike any human on planet Earth,
00:38:21they deserve an area to live in
00:38:24that's free from bacteria
00:38:26and the liquids that are flowing in there
00:38:29just is not humane.
00:38:30And as I was there, the dogs were licking it.
00:38:32Then the dogs will go urinate on the...
00:38:34Like, it's just contaminating the whole neighborhood.
00:38:36I think the first step in building a relationship,
00:38:39and some people might think I'm crazy,
00:38:41but I truly believe there should be conversation
00:38:44between police, government,
00:38:46and members of the community,
00:38:48even if they are gang members.
00:38:50There has to be some kind of communication.
00:38:53And I think once that relationship is built
00:38:55to a certain extent,
00:38:56the second step,
00:38:58which I found to work very well in Jamaica,
00:39:02anybody who knows the artist?
00:39:03Sizzla, he lives in a place called August Town.
00:39:05Now, August Town was ranked
00:39:07as one of the most murderous neighborhoods
00:39:09year after year after year.
00:39:10So even when I went there about six months ago,
00:39:12people said, don't go there.
00:39:14But when I got there,
00:39:15what I've never seen before
00:39:17and done impeccably,
00:39:19if that's the word, impeccably,
00:39:20yeah, you know what I'm trying to say.
00:39:21It's the word, it's the word.
00:39:23What they had is they had
00:39:24people wearing vibrant color vests,
00:39:27all elders from the community,
00:39:28all volunteers, nobody gets a penny.
00:39:30But every single day,
00:39:32they have 12 people in the community
00:39:33doing their chores with this vest on.
00:39:36These are,
00:39:37some of them might be previous gang members,
00:39:39some of them might be just
00:39:39the little old lady that,
00:39:41she cooks stuff for the community.
00:39:45Now, they're the mediators
00:39:46in the community.
00:39:48A lot of people don't feel safe
00:39:49going to police.
00:39:50I don't blame them, right?
00:39:52They could put themselves in danger.
00:39:54But they do feel safe
00:39:55going to these community leaders
00:39:56that are elders, right?
00:39:58And the murder rate in August town
00:40:00when I was there six months ago,
00:40:01they went 365 days without a major crime.
00:40:04So they went from like worst of the worst
00:40:06to this.
00:40:07So this is like a perfect case study
00:40:09that it can work.
00:40:10Now, if you just went into
00:40:11the regular community now
00:40:13with 12 people wearing vests,
00:40:14it would not be welcomed.
00:40:16Let's give back to some of these communities
00:40:18the very basic needs,
00:40:19as you talked about in the beginning,
00:40:20you know, food, shelter, love.
00:40:22Those are probably the three most basic,
00:40:24but hey, let's fix some very simple problems
00:40:28to show we're willing to work with you.
00:40:31And I think the next step, again,
00:40:32is putting in a group of people
00:40:34that maybe they sit down once a month
00:40:36with somebody like yourself
00:40:37and say like learn how to listen,
00:40:39learn how to give proper advice
00:40:41because how it's used in the community
00:40:44is like I don't like this guy, right?
00:40:47I want to harm him.
00:40:48He's done something.
00:40:49I think he stole something from my car.
00:40:51Let me go talk to an elder
00:40:52and at least gives you a cool down moment
00:40:55to decide, you know,
00:40:57is there a different way?
00:40:57Maybe the elder will go speak.
00:40:59So there's a mediator, right?
00:41:01And can you imagine if that was implemented
00:41:03in the communities that are willing to implement it?
00:41:06Because like we said,
00:41:07we're not going to solve
00:41:08this current problem overnight.
00:41:10But if this becomes regular,
00:41:12that if I have a problem,
00:41:13I have nobody to talk to
00:41:14and I don't want to talk to a priest,
00:41:15let me talk to an elder.
00:41:17Let me talk to somebody
00:41:18that might have done what I'm doing now
00:41:20and lived through it.
00:41:21So those are my two take-homes.
00:41:24And again, those are not my ideas.
00:41:26Those are things that I've seen
00:41:27that have been implemented
00:41:28in different countries
00:41:29that were very, very murderous
00:41:30and it's worked.
00:41:32So it comes down to, Chris,
00:41:33you know, when people say like,
00:41:35you know, two things.
00:41:36One, if you treat someone like an animal,
00:41:39if you see them like an animal,
00:41:41then you can't expect them
00:41:42to behave any differently.
00:41:43For sure.
00:41:44And so a lot of it has to start
00:41:47with how do we view persons?
00:41:50How are we being viewed?
00:41:52Because in the same way,
00:41:53you know, in a lot of the,
00:41:55let's put it, the mountain,
00:41:57people living in the mountains,
00:41:58the communities, right,
00:41:59are looking at these communities
00:42:02with disdain, with disgust,
00:42:04because again,
00:42:05it's coming back to survivability.
00:42:07I just don't want you
00:42:08to come into my environment
00:42:09and upset the apple cart, right?
00:42:11And therefore, I'm really not,
00:42:13I'm not interested
00:42:14in what you've done
00:42:15in your documentary
00:42:16is now expose, you know,
00:42:18people don't have to put,
00:42:19bring up that looking glass
00:42:20and see what is happening
00:42:22in the country.
00:42:23And you can't hide
00:42:24behind the carnival
00:42:24and the parties
00:42:25and the nice lives
00:42:26and all the rest of it.
00:42:27You now have to see
00:42:28what other persons
00:42:30who you're driving by
00:42:31on a regular basis,
00:42:32up and down the highways
00:42:33in these communities,
00:42:34hearing about the crimes,
00:42:36see what they're going through,
00:42:38see what they're experiencing
00:42:39and therefore understand
00:42:41why as a product of that,
00:42:46these other things are happening.
00:42:48And we're not saying
00:42:48that all of them
00:42:49are as a result of poverty
00:42:52and not having food
00:42:54in the fridge.
00:42:55Some of them are really
00:42:56a choice that you've gone to
00:42:58now where you want
00:42:59to now live a certain life
00:43:01without doing the necessary
00:43:02to live that life.
00:43:05You understand?
00:43:05Because there are persons
00:43:06that decide,
00:43:07okay,
00:43:07when they're given
00:43:08that moment
00:43:09that they can make
00:43:10an honest living,
00:43:11they might never get
00:43:12the bends,
00:43:13they might never get
00:43:14the nice house,
00:43:14but they're choosing
00:43:16at that point
00:43:17to live an honest life.
00:43:19But that's not the case
00:43:21for the majority
00:43:22and that's being exposed
00:43:23by documentaries
00:43:25that you're doing.
00:43:26I do have one third point
00:43:28that I think I should add
00:43:29because the first two,
00:43:31I want to be very clear,
00:43:33these people were in yellow vests.
00:43:34If I see them shoplifting,
00:43:35I'm not interfering.
00:43:36I'm not a police officer
00:43:37and I don't pretend
00:43:38to be a police officer.
00:43:40I'm there for mediation.
00:43:42And I think lastly,
00:43:43there definitely has to be
00:43:44a relationship between police,
00:43:45a respect for police
00:43:46in the communities.
00:43:48And I think the very first step
00:43:49in every single community
00:43:50has said the same thing.
00:43:52The police need to be using
00:43:53working cameras.
00:43:55If they clock in
00:43:56from the moment they clock in
00:43:57until the moment they clock out,
00:43:59there has to be,
00:44:00this is what every community,
00:44:02imagine gangsters are telling me
00:44:04that why are they not
00:44:06wearing their cameras?
00:44:07If they have nothing to hide,
00:44:08you know,
00:44:09and I talked to Alexander
00:44:10and I asked him the same question
00:44:12and he said like the way it is,
00:44:14they do have to wear it,
00:44:15right?
00:44:17But he said,
00:44:17imagine you're in a shootout,
00:44:18you're really going to remember
00:44:19to turn on the camera,
00:44:20right?
00:44:21And that's true
00:44:22if you're in a shootout,
00:44:22I can't imagine.
00:44:23But in the USA,
00:44:24the battery length
00:44:25is long enough
00:44:26for one shift,
00:44:27the camera's on.
00:44:28It's documented
00:44:29and then there's evidence
00:44:29for every side.
00:44:31The police have to be respected
00:44:32in the communities.
00:44:33So you mentioned a point there
00:44:35that I also want Johansi
00:44:36to touch on.
00:44:36I still want you to come back
00:44:37to the point of,
00:44:38you know,
00:44:39why people feel different
00:44:40when they be different
00:44:41or they dress differently,
00:44:42et cetera.
00:44:43But to what you said,
00:44:44Chris,
00:44:45what you're then giving them
00:44:46by an elder being
00:44:47in the community
00:44:48is something that we said
00:44:49you might not have
00:44:50at the start,
00:44:51which is to make a choice
00:44:53because your choice
00:44:54at that point
00:44:55is simply almost Neanderthal.
00:44:57It's I need to eat.
00:44:58Yes.
00:44:58And you either eat
00:44:59or this happens,
00:45:01right?
00:45:01Or I don't want to die.
00:45:02But by going to an elder now
00:45:03when you have satisfied
00:45:05maybe having food,
00:45:07maybe having shelter,
00:45:08maybe having some love
00:45:09in your life,
00:45:10community as you suggested
00:45:11that they are family,
00:45:13once you've reached that point
00:45:15and you now want to make a choice
00:45:16as in to,
00:45:17do I now want to rob
00:45:20and kill or kidnap
00:45:21and all these other things
00:45:22to get a higher standard
00:45:24of living,
00:45:25right?
00:45:25Now I can go to an elder
00:45:26and make a choice
00:45:27to say what else
00:45:28is there for me?
00:45:29What other options
00:45:30are there for me
00:45:31to navigate
00:45:32this life
00:45:34that has been dealt to me?
00:45:38What I would say,
00:45:39one is,
00:45:40hearing this discussion
00:45:41and even being part of it
00:45:42actually have me feeling
00:45:43a bit emotional
00:45:44because
00:45:45since I'm a child
00:45:47and as I said,
00:45:48I grew up in Belmont,
00:45:49even the steps,
00:45:50the same steps
00:45:50that I run up and down
00:45:52those steps
00:45:52as a child,
00:45:53right?
00:45:53Because my mom
00:45:54used to work
00:45:55right in the school
00:45:56below.
00:45:57These solutions
00:45:58seem so simple enough,
00:46:01right?
00:46:01It seems so simple
00:46:03and
00:46:03simple yet,
00:46:05yet it have moving parts
00:46:07but it's simple
00:46:07and
00:46:08we
00:46:10depending on the government,
00:46:12I would say
00:46:13for me,
00:46:14it always has been
00:46:15a problem for me
00:46:16because
00:46:17yes,
00:46:18we understand
00:46:19what a government
00:46:19is supposed to do,
00:46:20right?
00:46:21And it doesn't matter,
00:46:22party now
00:46:23because
00:46:24I mean,
00:46:24I live long enough
00:46:25but here I have enough
00:46:26grey,
00:46:26here I live long enough
00:46:27in Chennai to know
00:46:28governments come,
00:46:31governments go
00:46:31as the same
00:46:33and
00:46:33if we
00:46:35can't
00:46:36depend on the government
00:46:37then we have to
00:46:39depend on ourselves
00:46:40and
00:46:41with what little
00:46:42resources we have,
00:46:43we could build upon
00:46:44and build upon
00:46:45and build upon
00:46:45because
00:46:45the truth is
00:46:46it has 1.5 million
00:46:47people
00:46:48in the country,
00:46:49the government
00:46:50is a few people,
00:46:51right?
00:46:52They are the minority
00:46:53and it also gives us
00:46:54empowerment
00:46:55because
00:46:55listening to the videos
00:46:57a lot of times
00:46:57you're hearing people
00:46:58like the government
00:46:58this and the government
00:46:59that
00:46:59and I agree
00:47:00you should put pressure
00:47:01on the government
00:47:01because
00:47:02we're paying them,
00:47:03right?
00:47:04But if they're not
00:47:05doing it
00:47:06then we have to
00:47:07do it ourselves
00:47:08with what little
00:47:08we have
00:47:09and then
00:47:10I would also add
00:47:11this may seem
00:47:12a bit
00:47:12utopian
00:47:13or cliched
00:47:14but
00:47:15we cannot
00:47:16escape from
00:47:16the fact
00:47:17that
00:47:17we are all
00:47:18one,
00:47:18right?
00:47:20No matter
00:47:20how much
00:47:21f***ing money
00:47:21you have
00:47:22or you don't
00:47:23have
00:47:24that we are
00:47:24all one
00:47:25and if we keep
00:47:25trying to be
00:47:28separate,
00:47:29right?
00:47:29Everything will
00:47:30break down,
00:47:31you know?
00:47:31The beautiful
00:47:32place of
00:47:33Trinidad and
00:47:33Tobago
00:47:33and any of
00:47:34the other
00:47:34countries you
00:47:35go to
00:47:35because
00:47:36if you look
00:47:36at Haiti,
00:47:37Haiti itself
00:47:38is a beautiful
00:47:38place,
00:47:39you know?
00:47:40Right?
00:47:40These places
00:47:41you go to
00:47:42is we
00:47:43are all
00:47:44one
00:47:44and
00:47:45looking at
00:47:47it that
00:47:47way,
00:47:49we have
00:47:50to do
00:47:50something,
00:47:51right?
00:47:52And I'm
00:47:53glad that
00:47:53Chris,
00:47:54you're
00:47:54highlighting
00:47:54what you
00:47:55highlighted
00:47:55because
00:47:56again,
00:47:56knowledge
00:47:56is
00:47:57power.
00:47:57KG,
00:47:58I'm
00:47:58glad you
00:47:58also
00:47:59being
00:47:59open
00:47:59and
00:48:00can
00:48:00it
00:48:00because
00:48:00even
00:48:01when
00:48:01you're
00:48:01saying
00:48:01your
00:48:02story,
00:48:02I
00:48:02could
00:48:02hear
00:48:02the
00:48:02emotion
00:48:03in
00:48:03your
00:48:03voice,
00:48:04which
00:48:05mean
00:48:05it's
00:48:05human.
00:48:06I
00:48:06still feel
00:48:07that way
00:48:07today.
00:48:08I don't
00:48:09want to
00:48:09cut you
00:48:09again,
00:48:09but I
00:48:10tell you
00:48:10somebody
00:48:12I was
00:48:12like,
00:48:14you ever
00:48:14hear people
00:48:15saying that
00:48:15innocent
00:48:15people in
00:48:16prison?
00:48:17Like you
00:48:17always
00:48:17hear
00:48:17that
00:48:17innocent
00:48:18people
00:48:18in
00:48:18prison,
00:48:19not
00:48:19everybody
00:48:20in
00:48:20jail
00:48:20about it.
00:48:21I
00:48:21just
00:48:21feel
00:48:22like
00:48:22an
00:48:22innocent
00:48:23man
00:48:23in
00:48:23prison
00:48:24in
00:48:24the
00:48:24free
00:48:24will.
00:48:25Because
00:48:26I
00:48:26live
00:48:26in a
00:48:26society
00:48:27where
00:48:27they
00:48:29always
00:48:29want to
00:48:29chastise
00:48:30something
00:48:30I
00:48:31do.
00:48:32Or
00:48:32chain
00:48:33or
00:48:34all
00:48:34you
00:48:35know
00:48:35me,
00:48:35I
00:48:36have
00:48:36good
00:48:36youth.
00:48:37I
00:48:38went to
00:48:40his
00:48:40neighborhood
00:48:40and I
00:48:41walked
00:48:41through.
00:48:42And
00:48:43when I
00:48:44was
00:48:44walking
00:48:44with
00:48:44you
00:48:45and
00:48:45a
00:48:45few
00:48:45other
00:48:45people,
00:48:46like in
00:48:47my
00:48:47neighborhood
00:48:47we
00:48:48would
00:48:48talk
00:48:48about
00:48:48like,
00:48:48oh,
00:48:49I
00:48:49remember
00:48:49we
00:48:49used
00:48:49to
00:48:49play
00:48:49basketball
00:48:50here.
00:48:51It was
00:48:52every
00:48:52ten
00:48:52steps,
00:48:53all three
00:48:53of my
00:48:53friends
00:48:53got
00:48:54murdered
00:48:54here.
00:48:55Or
00:48:55there
00:48:55were six
00:48:56guys
00:48:56standing
00:48:56here
00:48:56and
00:48:57four
00:48:57of
00:48:57them
00:48:57died
00:48:57and
00:48:57here
00:48:58are
00:48:58their
00:48:58names.
00:48:58This
00:48:59is
00:48:59not
00:48:59normal.
00:48:59you
00:49:00cannot
00:49:00expect
00:49:01somebody
00:49:01to
00:49:02walk
00:49:02in
00:49:02the
00:49:03same
00:49:03footsteps
00:49:03that
00:49:03their
00:49:03friends
00:49:04have
00:49:04been
00:49:04murdered
00:49:04and
00:49:05for
00:49:05them
00:49:05just
00:49:06to
00:49:06be
00:49:06okay.
00:49:06You
00:49:07can
00:49:07put
00:49:07on
00:49:07a
00:49:07front.
00:49:08Some
00:49:08people
00:49:08can
00:49:08put
00:49:08the
00:49:08front
00:49:08on.
00:49:09And
00:49:11people
00:49:11again,
00:49:12I read
00:49:12the
00:49:12comments
00:49:13of every
00:49:14one of
00:49:14my
00:49:14videos,
00:49:15every
00:49:15comment,
00:49:15and it's
00:49:16sad to
00:49:16me that
00:49:17people don't
00:49:18realize that
00:49:18everybody does
00:49:19have a
00:49:20different
00:49:20choice.
00:49:20He
00:49:20didn't
00:49:21have a
00:49:21choice.
00:49:22And
00:49:22he's
00:49:23not far
00:49:23gone.
00:49:23There
00:49:24are
00:49:24people
00:49:25that
00:49:25are
00:49:25one
00:49:26million
00:49:26times
00:49:26worse
00:49:27than
00:49:28KG,
00:49:28but
00:49:28everybody
00:49:29needs
00:49:29help.
00:49:29The
00:49:30country
00:49:30of
00:49:30Trinidad
00:49:30needs
00:49:31help.
00:49:31There
00:49:31has
00:49:31to
00:49:31be
00:49:31a
00:49:32first
00:49:32step.
00:49:32So
00:49:33Chris,
00:49:33we
00:49:34come
00:49:34to
00:49:34that
00:49:35point
00:49:35that
00:49:35we
00:49:35have
00:49:35to
00:49:35wrap
00:49:36up.
00:49:37And
00:49:38again,
00:49:38another
00:49:39powerful
00:49:39conversation
00:49:40and one
00:49:41that I'm
00:49:42sure our
00:49:42viewers,
00:49:43listeners,
00:49:44et cetera,
00:49:45would love
00:49:45to hear
00:49:46a lot
00:49:46more.
00:49:48Because
00:49:49it's a
00:49:49conversation
00:49:49that needs
00:49:50to be
00:49:50had and
00:49:51is impacting
00:49:52everyone in
00:49:53Trinidad
00:49:53and Tobago.
00:49:54Not
00:49:54just the
00:49:54persons
00:49:55who are
00:49:55perpetuating
00:49:56the crime
00:49:56that's
00:49:56visible,
00:49:57but also
00:49:58the persons
00:49:59who are
00:49:59doing it.
00:50:00Everyone
00:50:00is being
00:50:01affected.
00:50:02They're
00:50:02doing it
00:50:03for a
00:50:03reason.
00:50:04And the
00:50:04persons
00:50:05being
00:50:05impacted
00:50:05are only
00:50:06looking
00:50:06at that
00:50:06because
00:50:07they're
00:50:07being
00:50:07impacted
00:50:07in terms
00:50:09of
00:50:09something
00:50:09negative
00:50:10onto
00:50:11them.
00:50:12But
00:50:12what
00:50:12is
00:50:12the
00:50:12bigger
00:50:13picture
00:50:13of
00:50:13what
00:50:14they're
00:50:14either
00:50:14turning
00:50:14a
00:50:15blind
00:50:15eye
00:50:15to
00:50:15or
00:50:16not
00:50:16doing
00:50:16themselves?
00:50:17So
00:50:17as
00:50:18you
00:50:18mentioned
00:50:18about
00:50:19it's
00:50:21government
00:50:21it's
00:50:21the
00:50:21government
00:50:22the
00:50:22government
00:50:23are
00:50:23elected
00:50:23to
00:50:24manage
00:50:24resources.
00:50:26And whether
00:50:26the government
00:50:26is doing
00:50:27it or
00:50:27not,
00:50:28citizens
00:50:29still have
00:50:30the power
00:50:31to still
00:50:32make
00:50:32changes.
00:50:33So
00:50:33the
00:50:34stairs
00:50:34need
00:50:34fixing.
00:50:35People
00:50:35see
00:50:36this.
00:50:37Someone
00:50:37in
00:50:37corporate
00:50:37Trinidad
00:50:38and Tobago
00:50:38could go
00:50:39and fix
00:50:39the stairs.
00:50:40The
00:50:40community
00:50:40could
00:50:40rally
00:50:41somebody
00:50:42around
00:50:42events.
00:50:43And
00:50:44again,
00:50:44we might
00:50:45say it
00:50:45sounds
00:50:45simple,
00:50:46but
00:50:46sometimes
00:50:46it
00:50:47is.
00:50:47Sometimes
00:50:48it
00:50:48really
00:50:49is just
00:50:49that
00:50:50simple.
00:50:50And
00:50:51it's
00:50:51because
00:50:52we
00:50:52put
00:50:52the
00:50:53complexity
00:50:53behind
00:50:54it.
00:50:54That
00:50:55sounds
00:50:56a bit
00:50:56too
00:50:56easy.
00:50:57It's
00:50:58why
00:50:58there's
00:50:58always
00:50:59these
00:50:59levels
00:50:59and
00:51:00red
00:51:00tape
00:51:00and
00:51:00all
00:51:01these
00:51:01things
00:51:01that
00:51:01can
00:51:01go
00:51:01off.
00:51:01Chris,
00:51:03I want
00:51:03you to
00:51:04close
00:51:05really
00:51:06just
00:51:06letting
00:51:07us,
00:51:09letting
00:51:09Trinidad
00:51:09and Tobago
00:51:10know.
00:51:10I know
00:51:11you
00:51:11return
00:51:12to
00:51:13let
00:51:15us
00:51:15know
00:51:15what
00:51:15are
00:51:16your
00:51:16thoughts
00:51:16on
00:51:17Trinidad
00:51:17and Tobago.
00:51:18Summarize
00:51:19it and
00:51:20your
00:51:21hope for
00:51:21us.
00:51:22Yeah,
00:51:23for sure.
00:51:24Trinidad
00:51:25and Tobago
00:51:25is a
00:51:26country
00:51:27like I've
00:51:27never
00:51:27experienced
00:51:28before.
00:51:28Right
00:51:29from the
00:51:29moment I
00:51:29got here
00:51:30nobody
00:51:30knew who
00:51:30I was
00:51:31or very
00:51:31few
00:51:31people
00:51:32knew who
00:51:32I was.
00:51:33From
00:51:34walking down
00:51:34the street
00:51:35from my
00:51:35Airbnb
00:51:35to getting
00:51:36my first
00:51:36double,
00:51:37four or
00:51:38five people
00:51:38talking to
00:51:38me.
00:51:38what I'll
00:51:41remember
00:51:42most about
00:51:42the
00:51:43country
00:51:43is
00:51:44the
00:51:44people
00:51:44and
00:51:45whenever
00:51:45the
00:51:45people
00:51:45are
00:51:46the
00:51:46number
00:51:46one
00:51:46point
00:51:48of a
00:51:49country
00:51:49I think
00:51:49it's
00:51:49a very
00:51:49good
00:51:50reason
00:51:51to
00:51:52promote
00:51:52the
00:51:52country.
00:51:53I know
00:51:54despite
00:51:54the kind
00:51:55of content
00:51:55that I
00:51:56film,
00:51:57a certain
00:51:57percentage
00:51:57of people
00:51:58think I'm
00:51:58like I
00:51:58have this
00:51:59agenda
00:51:59to make
00:52:00Trinidad
00:52:00and Tobago
00:52:01look bad.
00:52:02So far
00:52:03from the
00:52:03truth,
00:52:04through doing
00:52:05this I
00:52:05realized that
00:52:06highlighting
00:52:06an issue
00:52:07often comes
00:52:08with a
00:52:08resolution
00:52:08to the
00:52:09issue,
00:52:10I'll
00:52:10continue
00:52:10to come
00:52:11back
00:52:11over and
00:52:11over again
00:52:12as long
00:52:12as Trinidad
00:52:13and Tobago
00:52:14will welcome
00:52:15me,
00:52:15that's another
00:52:15topic.
00:52:17Not everyone
00:52:17likes their
00:52:18errors to be
00:52:19highlighted on
00:52:20film.
00:52:21Governments
00:52:21don't like
00:52:22that.
00:52:23Police
00:52:23don't like
00:52:23that.
00:52:24Although
00:52:24every police
00:52:25officer I've
00:52:25met has
00:52:26shaken my
00:52:27hand and
00:52:27said thank
00:52:27you for
00:52:28showing the
00:52:28world how
00:52:29difficult of
00:52:29a job
00:52:30that we
00:52:30have.
00:52:31I didn't
00:52:32come with
00:52:32an agenda.
00:52:34I've
00:52:34mentioned this
00:52:35before.
00:52:35If a
00:52:35volcano had
00:52:36erupted
00:52:36in Trinidad
00:52:37and
00:52:37a thousand
00:52:38houses were
00:52:39destroyed,
00:52:39that would
00:52:40have been
00:52:40my topic
00:52:41for journalism.
00:52:42I didn't
00:52:42come here
00:52:43to shoot
00:52:43gangs.
00:52:44When I
00:52:44came here
00:52:44and I
00:52:45read the
00:52:45news and
00:52:46I saw
00:52:46what was
00:52:46going on,
00:52:47it was
00:52:47my duty
00:52:48to cover
00:52:48the issues.
00:52:49But I
00:52:50have nothing
00:52:50but love
00:52:51for Trinidad
00:52:52and the
00:52:52people of
00:52:52Trinidad.
00:52:53Trinidad.
00:52:54I can
00:52:54put it
00:52:55this way,
00:52:55I think
00:52:56that 95
00:52:57if not
00:52:58more
00:52:58percent of
00:52:59the gang
00:53:00members I
00:53:00met that
00:53:01might look
00:53:01harsh on
00:53:02video,
00:53:03if given
00:53:03the option
00:53:04to choose
00:53:05a different
00:53:05life,
00:53:06they would
00:53:06absolutely
00:53:06change.
00:53:07It's only
00:53:08the biggest
00:53:08and the
00:53:10baddest,
00:53:11we'll call
00:53:11them the
00:53:11leaders,
00:53:12that are so
00:53:13content with
00:53:13the money
00:53:14they're making,
00:53:15why would
00:53:15they want
00:53:16to change?
00:53:17But on
00:53:17the other
00:53:17hand,
00:53:1895% of
00:53:18these guys
00:53:19are good
00:53:19people that
00:53:20just don't
00:53:21have many
00:53:21options.
00:53:22Again,
00:53:22it's relative.
00:53:24So because
00:53:24that number
00:53:25is so high,
00:53:25I have high
00:53:26hopes that
00:53:26Trinidad can
00:53:27turn things
00:53:28around.
00:53:29My
00:53:29recommendations
00:53:30once again
00:53:30are proven,
00:53:31they're not
00:53:32my ideas.
00:53:33I would love
00:53:34for them to
00:53:34take the
00:53:35first step
00:53:35and start
00:53:35fixing some
00:53:36of these
00:53:36very minute
00:53:37things like
00:53:37stairs and
00:53:38the river
00:53:39and beat
00:53:39them.
00:53:40And the
00:53:41one thing
00:53:41I can take
00:53:42home is
00:53:42when I went
00:53:42down south
00:53:43into
00:53:43Marabella
00:53:44with King
00:53:45Rilla,
00:53:45he is the
00:53:46only community
00:53:47that I went
00:53:47to that
00:53:48did not
00:53:48complain about
00:53:49the government.
00:53:50And when I
00:53:51had asked him
00:53:52what are your
00:53:52thoughts on
00:53:52the government,
00:53:53he said no.
00:53:53They give us
00:53:54contracts in the
00:53:54community all
00:53:55the time.
00:53:56See these
00:53:56trees?
00:53:57This is
00:53:57government
00:53:58funded.
00:53:58And it was
00:53:59like 12
00:53:59trees or
00:54:0015 trees.
00:54:01They gave
00:54:01very little
00:54:02in order to
00:54:02build a
00:54:03relationship.
00:54:04Further
00:54:04evidence that
00:54:05you've got to
00:54:08build a
00:54:08relationship.
00:54:09It's not
00:54:09fighting.
00:54:10You're not
00:54:10fighting with
00:54:11the community.
00:54:11Build a
00:54:11relationship.
00:54:12Go talk to
00:54:13a leader.
00:54:13Talk to
00:54:13an elder.
00:54:14Say what
00:54:14are the
00:54:15five things
00:54:15that are
00:54:15prioritized in
00:54:17order that
00:54:17you need
00:54:18fixed?
00:54:18Let's
00:54:18start fixing
00:54:19them slowly.
00:54:20And I
00:54:21think then
00:54:21the
00:54:21relationships
00:54:22will be
00:54:22built and
00:54:23you'll start
00:54:23seeing more
00:54:24peace in
00:54:24the community.
00:54:26Treat, as
00:54:26you said,
00:54:27treat the
00:54:27humans as
00:54:28they're
00:54:28humans, not
00:54:28animals.
00:54:29Absolutely.
00:54:31KG?
00:54:32Before we
00:54:33leave, I
00:54:33know Chris
00:54:34will be
00:54:35going back
00:54:35in a few
00:54:36days or
00:54:36probably
00:54:37today or
00:54:37tomorrow.
00:54:38I just
00:54:39want to
00:54:39say thanks
00:54:40to Chris
00:54:40for really
00:54:41coming and
00:54:41highlighting
00:54:42something that
00:54:42I've been
00:54:43trying to
00:54:45highlight to
00:54:45a certain
00:54:46extent.
00:54:46Same with
00:54:47where I
00:54:47just try to
00:54:47get people
00:54:48just understand
00:54:49what is
00:54:49really going
00:54:50on in
00:54:51these
00:54:51communities.
00:54:52The reason
00:54:52why I
00:54:52start my
00:54:53podcast is
00:54:54the same
00:54:54reason Chris
00:54:54is doing
00:54:54this.
00:54:55I just
00:54:55want to
00:54:55give people
00:54:56a platform
00:54:56and I
00:54:57just want
00:54:57people to
00:54:58really see
00:54:58the reality
00:54:59opportunity of
00:55:00what is
00:55:00going on in
00:55:01this country.
00:55:02People
00:55:02know the
00:55:03podcast.
00:55:04It has
00:55:04break my
00:55:05heart to
00:55:05hear
00:55:05conversations,
00:55:07naive
00:55:07conversations.
00:55:08What's the
00:55:09name of
00:55:09your podcast?
00:55:09Talks with
00:55:10KG.
00:55:10It has
00:55:12break my
00:55:13heart because
00:55:13I know the
00:55:14kind of
00:55:14things that
00:55:14we've been
00:55:15going through.
00:55:15I know the
00:55:16things that I
00:55:16went through.
00:55:17I know the
00:55:17things that
00:55:17my friends
00:55:18still going
00:55:19through.
00:55:20I just want
00:55:21to see people
00:55:21understand it so
00:55:23they can
00:55:23probably help a
00:55:24little more.
00:55:24Chris and
00:55:27KG, thank
00:55:28you very much
00:55:29for highlighting
00:55:29the truth.
00:55:30We often
00:55:31say the
00:55:32harsh truth
00:55:33or the
00:55:33harsh reality
00:55:33but what is
00:55:34really harsh
00:55:35is a lie.
00:55:36The truth
00:55:37is the
00:55:37truth and
00:55:38we know
00:55:39what we
00:55:40need to
00:55:40do.
00:55:41I'll just
00:55:41add something.
00:55:42Accountability
00:55:43is important.
00:55:44In Trinidad and
00:55:45Tobago, and
00:55:45again, I live
00:55:46here long
00:55:46enough,
00:55:47accountability
00:55:47is something
00:55:48lacking.
00:55:49Even
00:55:49something you
00:55:50are saying
00:55:50about the
00:55:51body cameras.
00:55:51Not putting
00:55:52it on is
00:55:53lack of
00:55:53accountability.
00:55:55I'm not
00:55:55even saying
00:55:56I'm perfect
00:55:56either.
00:55:57I think
00:55:57lack of
00:55:57accountability
00:55:58could be
00:55:58a cultural
00:55:59thing.
00:56:00Now that
00:56:00we highlight
00:56:01it, we
00:56:02might feel
00:56:03embarrassed,
00:56:05cool, that's
00:56:06good.
00:56:06Now we
00:56:07could do
00:56:07better in
00:56:09being
00:56:09accountable
00:56:09so that
00:56:10we could
00:56:11actually
00:56:11give the
00:56:13citizens and
00:56:14give each
00:56:14other more
00:56:16options of
00:56:17a choice.
00:56:19Huge.
00:56:19I think
00:56:20that's one
00:56:20of the
00:56:21biggest words
00:56:21that I did
00:56:22not use
00:56:22today.
00:56:23When I was
00:56:24in Haiti
00:56:24before
00:56:25this
00:56:25current
00:56:25war,
00:56:26they lacked
00:56:26accountability.
00:56:28The comments,
00:56:29all of the
00:56:29comments were
00:56:29like, why
00:56:30are you
00:56:30showing this?
00:56:31We have
00:56:31beautiful
00:56:31beaches.
00:56:32We have
00:56:33tropical
00:56:33trees and
00:56:34the butterflies
00:56:35are like
00:56:35nowhere else
00:56:36in the
00:56:36world.
00:56:36They don't
00:56:37want to
00:56:37be
00:56:37accountable
00:56:37for the
00:56:38problems
00:56:39in Haiti
00:56:39and look
00:56:40how it's
00:56:40gone.
00:56:41You need
00:56:41to highlight
00:56:42the problems.
00:56:42People have
00:56:43to digest
00:56:43the fact
00:56:44that there
00:56:45are
00:56:45communities.
00:56:46Every
00:56:47day I'm
00:56:47looking on
00:56:48Instagram,
00:56:48there's
00:56:48three murders,
00:56:49four murders.
00:56:50Sometimes
00:56:50there's
00:56:51a
00:56:51photo,
00:56:51most
00:56:51of the
00:56:51time
00:56:51it's
00:56:52just
00:56:52a
00:56:52name.
00:56:52Somebody
00:56:53might
00:56:53take a
00:56:53glance
00:56:53and
00:56:54they
00:56:54put
00:56:54their
00:56:54phone
00:56:55down,
00:56:55they
00:56:55forgot.
00:56:56Let's
00:56:56look at
00:56:57the
00:56:57face,
00:56:57let's
00:56:57look at
00:56:58the
00:56:58crying
00:56:58mother,
00:56:58let's
00:56:59understand
00:56:59that this
00:56:59is a
00:57:00reality
00:57:00today.
00:57:01I
00:57:01didn't
00:57:01bring
00:57:02the
00:57:02crime
00:57:02to
00:57:03Trinidad.
00:57:03Some
00:57:04people
00:57:04think I
00:57:04did.
00:57:04Oh,
00:57:05Chris,
00:57:05since you
00:57:05came,
00:57:06crime
00:57:06went
00:57:06up.
00:57:07This is
00:57:07how
00:57:08far-fetched
00:57:09reality is
00:57:10for some
00:57:10people.
00:57:10They don't
00:57:10want to
00:57:11know
00:57:11accountability
00:57:12is huge.
00:57:14Chris,
00:57:17you might
00:57:17know,
00:57:17I normally
00:57:18have never
00:57:20really lost
00:57:21her words,
00:57:22but this
00:57:23conversation
00:57:23has me
00:57:24more
00:57:24pensive
00:57:25than
00:57:25others
00:57:26and for
00:57:28good
00:57:29reason.
00:57:30We spoke
00:57:31about the
00:57:31topic being
00:57:32choices
00:57:33relative and
00:57:34we spoke
00:57:34about the
00:57:34varying
00:57:35degrees of
00:57:35choice and
00:57:36what is
00:57:37granular and
00:57:37not.
00:57:38So choice
00:57:39might not
00:57:39always be
00:57:40relative,
00:57:41but your
00:57:41situation
00:57:43within that
00:57:45you have
00:57:46that choice
00:57:47also is
00:57:48not always
00:57:49ideal.
00:57:51But,
00:57:51you know,
00:57:54there's that
00:57:54saying,
00:57:55you know,
00:57:55evil will
00:57:56prevail when
00:57:57good people
00:57:57do nothing.
00:57:59And,
00:57:59Johan,
00:58:00say,
00:58:00as you
00:58:00do,
00:58:01and I
00:58:02love you
00:58:02as a
00:58:03brother for
00:58:03that,
00:58:04you took
00:58:04the word
00:58:04because I
00:58:05was going
00:58:05to lead
00:58:06off with
00:58:06accountability.
00:58:08And,
00:58:09Chris,
00:58:09I'm glad
00:58:09that you
00:58:10embellished
00:58:10on that
00:58:10because the
00:58:12truth is
00:58:13we don't
00:58:14like to
00:58:15hold up
00:58:15that
00:58:15looking
00:58:16glass.
00:58:17We don't
00:58:18like to
00:58:18introspect.
00:58:19You know,
00:58:20it's a
00:58:20blame game.
00:58:22You know,
00:58:22we love to
00:58:22attack and
00:58:24always put it
00:58:25off on
00:58:26someone else
00:58:27and not
00:58:27look inside
00:58:28and say,
00:58:29what can I
00:58:31do better?
00:58:32Where am I
00:58:32falling?
00:58:33And part
00:58:33of that
00:58:33is looking
00:58:34at these
00:58:35communities.
00:58:35And we're
00:58:36not talking
00:58:36about the
00:58:36criminal
00:58:36element again.
00:58:38Criminal and
00:58:38criminality is
00:58:39a part of
00:58:41poverty,
00:58:42but not even
00:58:43just poverty,
00:58:44a part of
00:58:45humans.
00:58:46Humans
00:58:46commit,
00:58:47you know,
00:58:47regardless.
00:58:48You know,
00:58:50some of the top
00:58:51criminals are
00:58:51not poor,
00:58:52right?
00:58:53So it is not
00:58:54down to,
00:58:55you know,
00:58:56I'm talking
00:58:56about the
00:58:57communities.
00:58:57And the
00:58:58communities are
00:58:59like,
00:58:59and as you
00:58:59said,
00:59:00Chris,
00:59:0095%,
00:59:01you know,
00:59:02we're Trinbagonians.
00:59:03We're not
00:59:04inherently like
00:59:05that.
00:59:05We are loving,
00:59:07you know,
00:59:07cool people.
00:59:08We see it at
00:59:09carnival.
00:59:09We see it when
00:59:10you told me
00:59:10behind the
00:59:11camera,
00:59:11they're looking
00:59:12at,
00:59:12you know,
00:59:12bringing you
00:59:13drinks and
00:59:13water and
00:59:14things like
00:59:14that.
00:59:15That's who
00:59:15we are.
00:59:16I've seen
00:59:16grown men
00:59:17cry to me.
00:59:18Grown men
00:59:18cry.
00:59:19Right?
00:59:19We just need
00:59:20to see
00:59:20ourselves like
00:59:22that again.
00:59:23And we
00:59:23don't need
00:59:24that with
00:59:25Intranada and
00:59:26Tobago,
00:59:26that for some
00:59:27communities are
00:59:28now being
00:59:28ostracized and
00:59:29you're being,
00:59:29oh, are you
00:59:30from there?
00:59:30So you're
00:59:31this.
00:59:31And you're
00:59:32from there
00:59:32and you're
00:59:33this.
00:59:34And as a
00:59:34result of
00:59:35that,
00:59:35people then
00:59:35tend to
00:59:36behave because
00:59:36you're already
00:59:37seeing me
00:59:37like that.
00:59:38So I'm
00:59:38going to
00:59:39behave in
00:59:39accordance
00:59:39with that.
00:59:40And that
00:59:41needs to
00:59:41change.
00:59:42And that
00:59:42looking glass
00:59:43and that
00:59:43introspection,
00:59:44that
00:59:44accountability
00:59:45comes from
00:59:46every one
00:59:47of 1.5
00:59:48million people
00:59:49in Trinad
00:59:49and Tobago.
00:59:51And
00:59:51choice,
00:59:53is choice
00:59:54relative?
00:59:55Yes,
00:59:55it is.
00:59:56We still
00:59:56have a
00:59:57choice.
00:59:57Some
00:59:57people have
00:59:58more of a
00:59:59choice than
01:00:00others to
01:00:00do certain
01:00:01things.
01:00:02So guys,
01:00:02really powerful.
01:00:04Thank you
01:00:05for being
01:00:05here,
01:00:05Johanse.
01:00:06Chris,
01:00:07safe journey
01:00:07back.
01:00:08You know,
01:00:09KG,
01:00:09always a
01:00:10pleasure.
01:00:11This has
01:00:12been
01:00:12Manhood.
01:00:13Yeah.
01:00:18Manhood,
01:00:19brought to
01:00:19you in part
01:00:20by Reboot
01:00:20Sports Drink.