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00:00Welcome back! This is Episode 5 of Better Things with Joe Bianca.
00:04On this episode, we talk to Barry Spears, who's a legend on horse racing Twitter.
00:08You might know him as UrbanHandicapper on Twitter.
00:10He's nicknamed the Sniper back from his tournament days when he would nail people late to win these contests.
00:16He's a sharp handicapper and a really smart analytical guy.
00:19He has a lot to say about a lot of things inside and outside of racing.
00:23We had a great conversation. It was awesome getting to know him.
00:26So let's check out our conversation with Barry Spears.
00:30I'm so thrilled to welcome this next guest to our fifth episode of the show.
00:37You may know him as the Sniper. You may know him as UrbanHandicapper.
00:40You may know him as a celebrity on racing Twitter and a kick-ass tournament player.
00:45Barry Spears, welcome to the show.
00:47Hey, nice to meet you. Thank you for having me on.
00:50Great. Yeah, great to have you.
00:52I really want to get to know you because I feel like I know you because, you know, on Twitter,
00:57I really feel like you're such a big personality, but I feel like I don't know that much about you and your history.
01:03But I know you're an outspoken guy with a lot of opinions, and that's one of the reasons I wanted to have you on the show in addition to being a handicapper.
01:09It's pretty cool because, you know, when you say that you feel like you know me,
01:15I try to portray that online as much as I can to be the same person I am there as I am off of Twitter and the Internet and all that kind of stuff.
01:25That's good to hear. Yeah, you're a relatable guy.
01:29So let's start from the beginning. Are you a New York guy? Did you grow up in New York?
01:32No, Boston. I grew up north of Boston.
01:37I was born in Jersey, lived up north of Boston for I can't even tell you how long.
01:43And then I moved down to Florida in 2009. I've been here ever since.
01:48Gotcha. Because I feel like I read something about you going to Belmont and Aqueduct and stuff.
01:52Oh, yeah. Yeah, definitely. My grandparents lived in the city.
01:56So we used to go visit them. We used to go to the track. And that's how I kind of got introduced or initial.
02:01Cool. Yeah. So let's let's let's start with that. Like how you got started.
02:05Like what is there an early memory in racing that sticks out to you or like an early score that you had that got you hooked?
02:10Because I feel like everybody's got that story. It was actually when I was eight years old.
02:15We used to go to Saratoga Traverse Week. So we used to go Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday.
02:23And, you know, I was eight at the time and I just loved the horses.
02:28I love the jockeys. I loved everything about it. And then, you know, I kind of figured out that you could win money playing the races.
02:38And I begged my dad. I was like, Dad, can you just you know, we go to the breakfast in the morning.
02:43They have a seminar where you can learn how to read the racing form. You know, can you take me? I want to sit in and watch.
02:48And sure enough, we went over there. They gave us a five dollar voucher and a racing form.
02:54And they just went through the past performances, how to read them.
02:58And then it just I just was hooked. It was something that I thoroughly enjoyed.
03:03It just made me feel good. I wanted to be there all the time.
03:06And and here I am, you know, so many years later feeling the same way.
03:11Yeah. I mean, five days at Saratoga, I feel like can do that and get the hook in you.
03:15So those are the old Harvey Pack seminars.
03:18Yes, absolutely. They used to have like one where they used to settle the horses.
03:22They had the DRF one. And, you know, and then Charlsey Candy.
03:28And I don't know if you remember that name, but she was doing the workouts, just pointing out the horses that were running out there.
03:35It was great. Yeah. You know, it's like yesterday for me.
03:40Do you still do you still go out to Saratoga?
03:42I'm going actually for the first time since 2009 in a couple of weeks.
03:47The last race I saw there was Rachel Alexandra's Woodward.
03:53So it was a hell of a day to be there. Yeah.
03:56Hopefully something special like that happens this time. But, you know, you never know, especially around that.
04:01That's a high bar to clear because it is.
04:04I remember Tom Durkin's call that she raised the rafters and you can feel that place shake.
04:09Yeah. Yeah. It was unbelievable. Yeah. Just an incredible memory.
04:13But so I mentioned I forgot to mention this in the open that you're also on the Going in Circles podcast with Chuck Simon, who's a buddy of mine.
04:20He's a friend of yours. How did that happen?
04:22Like, how did how did your relationship come about and how much have you enjoyed being on the show with him?
04:27I don't know. It was just strange. We kind of met online a few years ago.
04:33I went down. We met up at Goldstream Park and just hung out and we hit it off.
04:37I mean, we're like brothers now at this point.
04:42And during the pandemic, you know, he just had the idea. He's like, maybe we should do a podcast.
04:48And I was like, OK. And then he's like, I got my iPad. We could just start doing it.
04:51And that's what we did. And a couple of years later, here we are.
04:54You know, it's actually a lot more popular than we both originally thought it was going to be.
05:01But, yeah, it's a great time. We do it every Monday.
05:04And then we have like Chuck does a lot of writing with the Saratoga blog and things like that.
05:09So, yeah, it's such a great time and, you know, keeps us both involved.
05:14And, you know, things are looking up.
05:18Yeah. Well, I love I love your show. I am hesitant to ever shout out other podcasts because I host the writers room.
05:24But I think you guys do a good job in terms of like one of the things we pride ourselves on that show is straight talk and not sugarcoating things.
05:32And I think that's something that you and Chuck do really well, too.
05:35So, yeah, that was that was like the basis of what we you know, we were both on the same page.
05:40We want to just talk the real, you know, nitty gritty about things in the industry.
05:46You know, no sugarcoating. We don't have really any ties to any big corporations,
05:51any anyone specifically. I mean, you know, obviously we have friends across the whole industry,
05:57but we don't have anything that we have to be worried about as far as saying things candidly.
06:04So it works out really good for us in that way.
06:07What must that be like? It's such a you know, it's always like a high wire act with the industry because, you know,
06:17you don't want to make anybody mad, but you also want to get the real information out there as best you can.
06:23So we walk that fine line. It's tough. It's not always easy.
06:28I mean, as long as you're making the right people mad, like that's that's how I always look at it.
06:32You got to piss the right people off. Yeah, I have that ability.
06:37I have an uncanny knack to do that. For sure.
06:41So in handicapping, in handicapping circles, you know, you I think you made your name in contest play.
06:46I remember you as a Derby Wars guy. Is that still the way you mostly play or do you do play more daily?
06:52What's your what's your your split like now? I actually don't play contests anymore.
06:58I stepped away from it. I one of my friends, he's trying to get me to go back into it to qualify for the BCBC and then head out to the British Cup for that.
07:10So I might do that, you know, the second half of the year.
07:14But, you know, it was something that helped me actually be a better player through the windows is the tournaments,
07:23because the way you play and the style you have to play in order to be successful, you can't pick favorites.
07:33And, you know, when I first started, I'd say probably 2014 ish.
07:41I was kind of just, you know, trying to feel my way around the tournament scene.
07:45And then I kind of figured out, watched how other people play and then incorporated their styles into what I was doing.
07:53And then it just helped me progress with with picking horses that not everybody is going to have.
08:00And that proved very, very successful when I made the switch back over to, you know, a majority of my play through the windows.
08:10Because in this game, you have to be different.
08:13You can't have the same ideas as everybody else because that's how chalk happens.
08:19And I say that all the time. But, you know, being just, you know, zigging when everybody else is zagging is real big,
08:26because that's how you win those big multi race bets.
08:30You know, where horses just knock people out that are big prices when, you know, only a select few have.
08:37So that's really the goal with what I do, especially with playing multi race bets.
08:41Was there a specific reason you stopped playing tournaments?
08:45No, not in particular. I not that I got bored of it, but it was just, you know.
08:53It was it was a little bit more time consuming than I needed it to be.
08:57So I kind of wandered away from it slowly and then I just totally didn't play anymore.
09:05Yeah, I mean, that's that's the thing that people don't realize is especially if you have early success, it is a commitment.
09:10It is absolutely a commitment to try to qualify for those those big contests.
09:15And it can really wear on you. So in your day to day play, what what's your typical strategy?
09:20You have a big multi race player when play sky exact as what do you usually do?
09:25Doubles and pick threes are where I concentrate a lot because those pools tend to be pretty even as far as, you know,
09:35the payouts are usually fair, you know, but I look for times when you can get away from favorites.
09:42And instead of going, you know, four or five legs, even six with a pick six, it's tough.
09:49But I'll play those two in addition to, you know, with my strong opinions kind of center around those and then kind of build tickets around around the plays that I really like on a specific day on a specific card.
10:05So what's how's Saratoga going for you?
10:07How's the summer been to you so far? It's been a little tough for me so far, but you hang in there.
10:12What's it looking like? Spotsman treat me well.
10:15I had a couple of really, really nice horses at good prices that came in for me at the right time, you know.
10:22And, you know, whenever I'm right on an opinion, I'm usually going to have it up and down side to side any way possible.
10:31You know, the double into that horse, double out of that horse, rolling pick threes, pick fours if it's in the sequence, pick five, you know.
10:40So if I'm right on a couple of times and, you know, I'll usually have it up and down.
10:47But again, I still play one place, stuff like that.
10:51So, you know, we're trying to, you know, I want to make them pay when I'm right.
10:55Yeah, no, absolutely. That's a trap that I fall in.
10:58Sometimes it's like spreading too deep and you got it. You really got to hone in on those strong opinions.
11:03But I want to ask you about racing Twitter because it is such an interesting place.
11:07You know, it's unlike any other Twitter subset I've seen ever.
11:12And, you know, there's a lot of good, bad and ugly.
11:15I think one of the good things that it does is that I think it holds people accountable in a way that people in the industry aren't normally held accountable.
11:23I think it brings attention to a lot of things usually that are screwing over horse players that, you know, people normally would not report on or talk about.
11:30But of course, there's a lot of vitriol, too, and a lot of ugliness.
11:34You know, what's been what's been your experience?
11:36You know, you know, especially as one of the few people of color that is, you know, a prominent guy in the business and on racing Twitter.
11:43Just overall, what has been your experience with that little Twitter community?
11:47I can tell you it wasn't easy to navigate it first because, you know, like you said, as a person of color, the perspective that I have is a lot different than the average horse player or typical horse player.
12:06And I wouldn't even say average because there's a lot of people of color who play horses.
12:11And I think that's that's understated on horse racing Twitter.
12:16But, you know, I think that's that's where I kind of step in and I try to be that voice for for those kind of people.
12:25And, you know, early on, I wasn't I wasn't really accepted.
12:30I can tell you that right now. It's been a work in progress.
12:34It's still a work in progress. But like you said, there's a lot to learn from Twitter in all aspects of things, just even beyond horse racing and the stuff that affects the betters.
12:46You know. There's there's certain aspects of life that incorporate into horse racing that sometimes people don't understand, and sometimes I'll end up pointing that out.
12:59Well, yeah, I mean, usually it led me into my next question because I saw a great thread that you did.
13:04It was about a month ago, I think, where you were you there was this guy who was making these very subtly racist comments and then you called him a racist.
13:12And then he got really mad that he got called a racist. That's a big thing for white people sometimes.
13:16I think it's worse to call racist than to actually be racist.
13:19But, you know, I think there is a discussion to be had. I think you did a very good job of very of explaining like why these things are racist and offensive, as opposed to just like blocking someone or, you know, just shutting them off completely.
13:32And it looked like, you know, maybe you came to an understanding a little bit towards the end of it.
13:37So like what you know, what what kind of motivates you to call that out and to bring that to the light to the light of racing Twitter?
13:44Well, I think, you know, among the horse racing industry in the community, there's a lot of misconceptions because there aren't as many prominent black people in the sport.
13:56You know, from the history of the sport, which is really important to me, where black jockeys and trainers and everybody were kind of forgotten.
14:09But with that, you know, kind of disseminating of the black culture that was involved in racing, it gets a little bit, I don't know if this is a good word for it, but whitewashed a bit to the point where, you know, people forget that people of color are around.
14:30And sometimes things may come out. And, you know, one of the really big things I like to point out is, you know, if somebody is what I would deem have done something that that would be considered racist, it's not always animus behind it.
14:47Sometimes it's the culture and how this this country kind of portrays itself that brings out these sort of things. And most of the time, to be honest, most of the time, people just don't realize it.
15:02And if nobody's there to point it out, then they'll never know. And that's where I've kind of assumed that responsibility a little bit, because I don't want to embarrass somebody to the point where, you know, they can't function or, you know, kind of doxing them and have them lose their job or anything like that.
15:19I just want them to see what's going on. And the reason I do things like that, and I point things out, it's not all the time, but when I do it, I find that some people learn from it, maybe not the person that I'm talking about or to, but other people can see it.
15:35I've done things on Twitter, like there was a segment I used to do every once in a while, like once a month, called Ask a Black Dude, where anybody that follows me or sees it can just ask me something that they may have been afraid to say to their black friend or anybody, just to understand the culture. And I'm all for it. So, you know, it's more about education than it is about trying to make somebody look bad.
16:01Yeah, well, and I think that seems like totally the way to approach it. And I think the discussion becomes so binary sometimes where it's like, well, you're a racist or you're not a racist. And it's like, there are a lot of people that are in the middle, you know, that have racist thoughts that don't even register them that they're racist. And that's why I think it's a good conversation to have. And, you know, you have to have a lot of patience, I think, to have those conversations. But for sure, they're definitely worth having.
16:30But I wanted to hammer on that point about the subtleties of racism, because there are so many small things that people do that they don't, you know, I think a lot of white people have a problem with the idea of being called racist for anything less than screaming the N-word. You know, unless you're doing that, you know, you can't be obviously racist.
16:48So what are some of the subtle things that you or maybe other prominent black people in the business have to deal with that, you know, can be perceived as racist that white people don't necessarily think of when it's happening?
17:01Well, it's hard because, you know, Twitter isn't technically a real place. So it's hard because you see these. It's hard because, you know, you see people in their digital selves. Sometimes people don't understand what something they might say online could be construed as racist or kind of heading that path.
17:28Especially when it's like comments on social issues, you know, like during the George Floyd thing or, you know, when riots and Kaepernick was a big one. You know, it's hard to reach out to people because they can just close their phone or their computer and be done with it.
17:50So it's definitely harder to reach somebody online to kind of educate them on things. I can't tell you how many DMs I've got just asking me questions and I'm all for it. I mean, my DMs are always open. You can ask me anything and I'll give you a candid response. I mean, sometimes it's not always what people want to hear, but I'm not going to sugarcoat it because there's no point in doing that.
18:13You know, it's just what it is what it is. And I really don't like that saying, but in certain situations it applies. But, you know, and I appreciate when people try to learn. It makes me, you know, feel like I'm getting through to somebody or people are seeing this and they're trying to learn and, you know, kind of make things better for everybody.
18:36And that's really the goal here is to get everybody on the same page and we can all have fun at the track and do what we love to do without any of the, you know, nonsense that can and does get in the way sometimes.
18:51Well, it's a way that you can make a difference, you know, just as a regular guy, you know, you might be the only black person that someone interacts with on that day or in that absolutely you can make a difference in the way they think, you know, and the way they look at stuff.
19:04So just kind of the last question on that to wrap it up is you talk a lot about the lack of minority representation in the business. And I think that's a huge problem.
19:13We were on the writers room we were talking about. I was like, I feel weird. We're four white guys talking about black minority representation. But so let me ask you, like, what do you think is holding that back?
19:24Do you think it's something like the old, you know, blue blood ideologies in racing? What is it?
19:29Well, I know in this industry, there's a big hurdle that they have to come over as far as, you know, this is the way we've always done it.
19:41It's from a lot of aspects of this game, particularly with minorities, you know, nobody's ever used to seeing a black person giving out handicapping analysis on a track because they've never been there.
20:01I was lucky enough to get the opportunity to do it with Tampa Bay a few times this past winter. I'm going to hopefully do it again this year.
20:10But as far as, you know, we kind of tried to trace back things and everybody we talked to didn't know anyone that actually did what I was doing for Tampa Bay Downs.
20:25And it's 2020. Well, it was 2021. Now, 2022. You know, it just goes to show you like, where's the gap? Why? Why is this not happening?
20:36You know, and those are the questions. And, you know, it's tough because I have a lot of people that do a lot of things in the industry that are my friends and they understand, but they're not the decision makers.
20:49So it's just a work in progress, just like a lot of things in this country, as far as racism goes.
20:55You know, but. Hopefully we can make some strides, get more black people involved in the game, and then we can branch out from there and have some some public handicappers, too.
21:08Yeah, I mean, like you're saying, there are plenty of black horse players, too, like when I go to the track at Belmont Aqueduct, I'm the only white guy in my group.
21:15You know, hang out with a bunch of like Caribbean or Western dudes. I'm the minority in that group.
21:20So like there's there's certainly plenty of black horse players out there. It's just about being able to put them in positions of prominence.
21:26So I don't know whether that's like we should have like more like internship programs or, you know, it's a complicated thing to kind of solve because it's been festering for decades, you know?
21:36Exactly. And, you know, I guess at least from my perspective, it's just about opportunity.
21:43Like I got the opportunity to be on TVG, you know, and working with them and hopefully that can progress into something more because we don't really have too many people in this industry, if any, other than like grooms, assistant trainers, people behind the scenes that are of color that are doing good things.
22:04But nobody ever sees it. And especially on the handicapping side, you know, that's where I take pride in what I do.
22:11And, you know, that's my forte. So when I don't see anybody of color doing anything, it makes you wonder and think.
22:21But, you know, I've been making strides behind the scenes, talking to people, networking, stuff like that. So, you know, maybe we can make progress.
22:28Awesome. Yeah, I mean, that would be great. I wanted to ask you about this. I was reading about you and you said you wanted to be a jockey until you grew out of it and then you became a basketball player. What was your basketball career like?
22:41Oh, yeah, I can't complain. I played overseas for a little while after college. I, you know, obviously played in high school, went to Virginia Union, played with Ben Wallace for a couple of years.
22:53I had my first daughter when I was in college, so I transferred up to Merrimack College, which is up in north of Boston, a Division 2 school.
23:01Played there, ended up going overseas for a couple of years, bounced around there, you know, England, Ireland, Australia.
23:08And, you know, just once I figured out that I wasn't going to make it in the NBA, I was like, well, time to do something else.
23:16And, you know, then my attention turned to racing and this is where I am. I love it. I can't complain. It's actually probably more my thing than the actual basketball. It's funny enough.
23:28Yeah, I mean, it definitely worked out for you. You got a soft landing place here in racing, or maybe not soft, but a successful place here in racing. Do you still ball?
23:38No, no, no, no, no. I'm too old for that. Yeah, bad knee and stuff like that. So, you know, I kind of hung it up and leave it. Maybe my daughter will pick it up and run with it.
23:50Gotcha. How about watching basketball or betting on basketball? Have you gotten into sports betting at all?
23:55No, you know, people ask me that all the time, and I really haven't gotten into sports betting. I will kind of foray into DFS, like fantasy football. I tried a little bit of that last season. I think I'm going to do some more this year, but it's tough, man. Sports betting is tough.
24:18I mean, I guess if I was going to do something like that, I'd probably play basketball or mostly NBA. But it's tough because, you know, one thing can happen the wrong way, and it just ruins everything.
24:32Well, you have to have such volume, you know, to make money. Like, unless you, you know, inevitably, unless you, like, improbably cash some 12-team parlay, you got to keep betting and betting and betting and betting to make a little bit of a profit. Yeah.
24:45Yeah, it's tough. It's tougher than racing in that regard, because you're getting better odds at racing. A lot of times, the way I play, you know, I'm not going for chalk. So I can see those small payouts all the time that somebody who may be a sports bettor would love.
25:03Yeah.
25:04You know, so it's just a different sort of mentality.
25:07Yeah, well, I was talking to Nick Tamero on this show a couple episodes ago, and he was saying, like, there would be this huge upset in the NFL, and everyone would be like, wow, that team was plus 450 at that circa or whatever. It was like, plus 450? Like, you're really getting that excited about that? Like, I could find you better than that.
25:23No odds there, especially with a team that probably shouldn't have won, probably should be like 20 to 1.
25:28Yeah, like, would that win the game 10% of the time? Maybe. Yeah, it's like you said, it's a definite grind. Another question I had is, do you take people that normally would not go to the track to the track? Like, have you introduced people into the business? Because that's always a hard thing for me, because I have friends that ask me, like, I want to go out because I know I'm in business and that I'm passionate about.
25:52And they ask me, like, I want to go out to the track with you. And I'm like, do you really? Like, because I'm going to try to take you over and over and over again.
25:59I'm going. Yeah, you know, what's funny is, I was just this past weekend, I gave a few of my old teammates some winners. One of them lives in Jersey near Monmouth, and the other guy lives in Tampa. So I see him whenever I go out there. But yeah, you know, I kind of was talking about it when we were in school. And they, you know, at the time, when I transferred to Merrimack, which is in Boston, north of Boston,
26:29Rockingham Park wasn't too far away. So we venture up there and make some bets. And I try to introduce them to the sport, and they picked it up. So a lot of my Facebook friends are always curious, because I'm putting up pictures of horses and me at the track with my family and so on.
26:47And they're like, that looks like fun. And then I kind of give them the lowdown on how things work. And then they eventually try it. So yeah, I mean, I'm very passionate about bringing people in sport, especially people of color, because, you know, again, that's an area that's lacking a little bit. You know, I have a cousin that went to the races last year, she lives 20 minutes from Saratoga, and really never went.
27:13And I got her to go and she ended up getting goggles from Jose Lascano. And yeah, she loves it. And she's making it a thing. So she's going every year now. So it, you know, you never know where you can make a fan. And I'm always on the lookout, because, I mean, I'm sure you know, but a lot of other people might not. But horse racing is everywhere, whether it's an owner, you know, somebody like Mike Rapoli's Vitamin Water.
27:43It's in the business. Like, oh, yeah. And I pointed out to my wife and my family all the time. It was like, oh, well, that person owns a bunch of horses. You know that? I was like, no, no. It's like, oh, it's a big thing. And then it just escalates from there. And it's all positive.
27:57It's definitely true. Like, we were watching the Stanley Cup final, and Eric Johnson was like celebrating. That guy's been on our show a couple of times. So yeah, you'd be surprised. I think most people would be surprised where owners pop up and where horse betters pop up throughout the rest of sports and the rest of society. So I totally agree with that.
28:16The other thing I tell people is like, you know, it's not for people who have a short attention span. You know, I mean, it is in the fact that the race itself is short. But in terms of handicapping, it's not something that you just want to do like that. It's something that's going to require a lot of work and a lot of studying to be successful at it. And I think that that is the snag for a lot of people is, you know, it's nice to go out to the track for a day, you know, get a cup, bet a couple of winners, have a couple of drinks.
28:43But then, you know, it's hard to get them to be their own handicappers, at least in my experience.
28:48Yeah, I'm sure it's easier the younger you get people involved because they have that time. I mean, even with me, you know, as much or as long as I've been doing, you know, been involved with horse racing, it took me a long time to get decent at this game.
29:08And, you know, the challenge for me, it's intellectual. So it's the puzzle. It's putting all that together and then and then seeing everything kind of come together in the plan that you had in your head on how the race was going to be run, who's going to be where and then the outcome and then you get paid off.
29:26I mean, there's really nothing better than that. As far as I as far as I'm concerned, I'm sure you probably agree. But, you know, once you get that taste, I think people really, really tend to get involved more. And that's hard because you get people that go to the track and they may get a couple of two dollar bets.
29:45And they're like, oh, it was fun. But, you know, get somebody to win a couple hundred or a couple thousand dollars. And then you're like, hey, there's something to this. And that's it's tough, but it may constitute them coming out more than once.
29:59Yep, for sure. All right. Last question, because I have been dying to have a hip hop head on one of my shows. Bill, my co-host on the Writers Room doesn't even know who The Weeknd is. So you can kind of extrapolate from that what I'm dealing with.
30:15I saw you posted a video of Jay-Z's Where I'm From, which I had never seen the video before. I love that. Love that song. Obviously, I'm from Brooklyn. I had never seen that before. But like, who did you grow up on? And then part B of that question is, do you mess with any of the new rappers? Because I really, I don't know. I really don't. But let's hear what you got to say.
30:33Oh, man. Jeez. I mean, honestly, I can remember my older sister bought a cassette tape. I'm dating myself right now. Cassette tape of Run-DMC and Roxanne Shante way back in the days, like when the beginning of rap. But, you know, Run-DMC was always one of my favorites. Public Enemy, Chuck D, who actually follows me on Twitter. I was like starstruck when he followed me.
31:04Man, it's just, I love it all.
31:06And you're a rapper and racer. So it makes sense.
31:09Yeah, yeah. Actually, he kind of retweeted something I had that was talking about how come we don't have, you know, music videos with horse racing in it? How come there's not many black people? He's actually asking the same sort of questions that we were asking.
31:26And, you know, I kind of went back and forth with him really briefly. But yeah, it was really cool to see that people notice. But I mean, as far as rap goes, man, I love it all. I mean, I like the new people. I like 21 Savage. I like all of them.
31:44You know, it's all good. It's all creative to me. And I really identify with that kind of creativity on any kind of level. I know things, it's like when people talk about the NBA, you know, the 90s were the best and this, that and the other. For me, same thing with the NBA.
32:02They don't get worse over time. It's just different. You know, it's just a different feel, a different angle, different perspective, because the world changed. So, you know, the rappers adapt, and I appreciate all of it.
32:16So what you're telling me is that I'm old, and that's why I don't like any of the new rappers.
32:21Yes, maybe.
32:23No, I mean, I still listen to the old stuff, too. I mean, from Southern rap and West Coast rap. I mean, all the different sects. I try to listen to everything. But I mean, I do have to say I kind of like the older stuff a little bit, like that golden era of rap, like, you know, 2000 to 2007-ish.
32:43There you go.
32:45For me, it's like 2008, 2004.
32:48Yeah, in the air. When Jay-Z and DMX really started popping off. And then, like you said, you had the Southern Infusion in the early 2000s, like Natalie and Ludacris. That was where it was best for me, too.
33:01Yeah, I love it.
33:04It's funny because people on Twitter kind of picked up on some of it, which is cool because people that I identify with or made a connection with, you know, I'm a black guy from Boston to a white guy that's in Nebraska. So, you know, it's brought us together, the horses and the rap. So best of both worlds.
33:27All we got to do is get Bill Finley to come along eventually.
33:30We'll get him. We'll get him.
33:32That's the goal. All right, Barry, this has been so much fun, man. I really enjoyed getting to know you. And I really, truly, sincerely appreciate what you're doing in the business. And I think you're such an important voice, not just on Racing Twitter, but overall in the industry. So thanks for coming on and talking to me, man.
33:49I appreciate all the kind words. I think you're too kind, but I'll take it. Thank you so much for having me on. It's been real good to talk.
34:00Absolutely, man. I hope to see you in person one day, too. Or maybe at Saratoga.
34:04There you go. Yeah. 11th through the 14th.
34:07Good. Good.
34:11All right. So this is the Breeders' Cup Handicapping Segment, sponsored, of course, by the Breeders' Cup. The World Championships will be held later this year at Keeneland on the first weekend in November.
34:20First off, let's see how we did last week. And it couldn't have been a much better start for our handicapping partnership with the Breeders' Cup.
34:25It was one of those rare, beautiful scenarios where the race pretty much unfolded the way I expected in the Haskell with the cheap speed, pushing Jack Christopher through two fast fractions, CyberKnife saving ground on both turns and finding enough of a seam to make his off-the-pace bid before just holding off Tabon the Wire.
34:42So easy game, right? We had $70 to win on CyberKnife, who was an overlaid 7.8 to 1, which returned a juicy $616.
34:51And we cashed the pick four also with single search results coming through in the Molly Pitcher for another $152.45.
34:58Total return on $200 wagered was $758.45 for a profit of $558.45.
35:06And our $2 ROI stands at $7.59. It's going to be a little difficult to improve a ton on that ROI.
35:12And this week's Breeders' Cup Winning Year in Challenge Race, which is the Grade 1 $1.2 million Whitney Stakes at Saratoga, will be run this Saturday, August 6th.
35:21The second most prestigious and significant race out of the entire star-studded Saratoga meet behind only the Travers.
35:28The Whitney is, in my mind, tied with the Met Mile for the most important race for older dirt horses in America, other than the race it serves as a qualifier for, which is the Breeders' Cup Classic.
35:38Named after the Whitney family, an institution unlike any other in Saratoga, the Whitney's been run every year at the spa since 1928.
35:45It was originally run at a mile and a quarter before being shortened to its current distance at a mile and an eighth in 1955.
35:51It was won last year by eventual Horse of the Year, Nick's Go.
35:54And this year's renewal features a high-quality six-horse field out of which there are five Grade 1 winners, and two horses in particular who would vault to the front of the Horse of the Year debate with a victory.
36:05It's as legitimate of a Grade 1 field as you can have outside of the Breeders' Cup.
36:09So now let's figure out how to make money out of it.
36:11The likely favorite, although not overwhelming considering the quality of the field, is Life is Good.
36:16I think he'll probably end up going off at around 6 to 5 or 7 to 5.
36:19He's shown brilliant speed in all nine career starts, and he's carried it to victory in seven of those races.
36:24He successfully stretched out to a mile and an eighth earlier this year in an impressive Pegasus World Cup victory where he defeated the aforementioned Nick's Go before fading late in the mile and a quarter Dubai World Cup.
36:35He returned home with an easy five-length win in the John Nehru at Belmont, earning a career-high 112 buyer.
36:42The close second choice, I think about 2 to 1 or 5 to 2, will be Olympiad.
36:46He's undefeated 5 for 5 this year.
36:49His last four wins came in graded stakes.
36:51He pressed a fast pace in the Stephen Foster last out and scored by two and a quarter lengths with a 111 buyer.
36:57The other two main contenders on figures are Hot Rod Charlie, who had a terrific three-year-old season that included a 111 buyer win in the Pennsylvania Derby,
37:05and American Revolution, who captured the Cigar Mile and was second behind Olympiad and the Stephen Foster with a career-high 108 buyer.
37:13Happy Saver and Zoomer complete the field.
37:15The former is a grade-one winner in the 2020 Jockey Club Gold Cup, but both are a bit too slow on paper to compete with the other four.
37:22So the key question in this race for me is how fast life is good goes early because there's no legitimate question whether or not he's going to get the lead.
37:29He drew outside, so he doesn't have to be completely gunned as he would if he broke from the rail.
37:34But a rat or tease, I think, is going to want to clear by the early part of that clubhouse turn.
37:38So does he take it to them from there and open up like Nick Sko did last year in the Whitney, potentially going too fast?
37:43Or does he try to throttle down some and save energy for the stretch while allowing the other horses to keep him in their sights?
37:50My guess is that he's going to play catch me if you can.
37:52That speed is just too much of a weapon, which I think could be bad news for Olympiad, who I'm generally a huge fan of.
37:58Though he's had a terrific year and his race in the Foster was a legitimately huge effort,
38:04Olympiad has had basically the same trip in every one of his wins this year.
38:08He sits just off the leader, gets the jump on the closers and he holds strong in the final furlong.
38:13His come home splits are terrific.
38:15He's proven himself multiple times at this distance.
38:18But I just don't know that he's going to have that same punch if he has to chase a loose leader with the level of elite speed that life is good has.
38:25So as for Hot Rod Charlie and American Revolution, I prefer the latter, who I think will be the biggest price out of all four major contenders, hopefully around five to one or so.
38:33Hot Rod Charlie has races that would win this for sure.
38:35But it's kind of the same thing as with Olympiad.
38:37They either came on the lead or pressing the lead, which I don't think life is good is going to allow him to do.
38:42I think he's just too fast.
38:44So that leads me to American Revolution as the only contender who won't be taken out of his game if and when life is good runs off to a clear lead.
38:52He has some tactical speed, but he's the closest thing to a one run closer in the field.
38:58And he completes a really strong complimentary one-two punch for Todd Pletcher, who's seeking his fourth Whitney win, which would put him one behind the record.
39:05The record is five for trainer wins in the Whitney.
39:08So my two most likely scenarios are life is good, bottoming out the field with his speed, and he just keeps going and vaults himself to the top of the horse of the year discussion.
39:19Or him at least tiring out Olympiad and Hot Rod Charlie enough on the chase to set it up all for American Revolution to mow everybody down.
39:27So I'm going to invest a little less this week because I don't think the favorites are as vulnerable as I did in the Haskell.
39:32Also, I'm not going to do a pick four or pick five because it looks a little bit chalky, and I don't want to give out a $30 pick four for 50 cents.
39:39So I'm taking my shot with American Revolution.
39:41What I hope is in the five to one range.
39:43We're going to go with $100 total.
39:45We're going to go $50 to win on number one, American Revolution, a $30 exact.
39:50Number six, life is good over number one, American Revolution.
39:53We'll do a $10 try.
39:55Number six, life is good with number two, Hot Rod Charlie and number four Olympiad with number one, American Revolution.
40:01So that's a total of $100.
40:03Good luck if you're following along.
40:05Why wouldn't you if you got a piece of Cyberknife?
40:08All right.
40:09So that's it for this week's edition of Better Things with Joe Bianca.
40:12I want to thank the Breeders' Cup for their sponsorship.
40:14We can make a little bit more money this week building on that first strong week of that partnership.
40:18I also want to thank Barry Spears for coming on and talking to me.
40:21It was a great conversation.
40:22Can't wait to meet up with him in person at Saratoga.
40:25It's great getting to know these guys, these handicappers that you might see on Twitter or you might have heard about winning contests, but you don't necessarily know them as people.
40:32That's what this show is really about, getting to know all of these people who were just so sharp and interesting and have so many different backgrounds.
40:39So it was great to talk to Barry.
40:41Thanks to Tim for coming on.
40:42I also want to thank Patty Wolfe, our producer, and our editors, Anthony LaRocca, Leah LaRocca, and Nathan Wilkinson.
40:48Thank you so much for watching.
40:50See you next time on Better Things with Joe Bianca.