Catch up on the latest political news from across Kent with Oliver Leader de Saxe, joined by Cllr Vince Maple, the Labour Leader of Medway Council and Andy Richards, KMTV's Channel Director.
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00:00Welcome to The Kemp Politics Show live on KMTV, the show that gets
00:29Kent's politicians talking. I'm Oliver, leader of the Saks and today we're swapping Union Jacks
00:35for Stars and Stripes as we talk about the biggest political comeback story in modern history. Donald
00:41Trump is set to return to the White House, making him the first convicted criminal in history to
00:47take control of the land of the free. And of course, we can't ignore some of the big stories
00:52from people here in Medway, where tuition fees and approval of a brand new redevelopment could
00:58change the future of the local economy. To make sense of it all, I'm joined by KMTV's channel
01:03director Andy Richards and Vince Maple, the leader of Medway Council. But first, we have to talk
01:10about it. On Wednesday, there's a very different kind of red wool sweeping our politics. Let's take
01:17a look at what happened. Four years ago, after being impeached twice and denying losing the
01:24election, Trump was out, with a mountain to climb to regain the trust of the US electorate.
01:30A capital insurrection and criminal conviction later, and you wouldn't be wrong for thinking
01:35that mountain was getting steeper. But as today's win shows, the love for Trump is rife in the states.
01:42This was a movement like nobody's ever seen before. Frankly, this was, I believe, the greatest
01:49political movement of all time. There's never been anything like this in this country.
01:54Back here in Kent, there's been a mixed reaction to Trump's comeback.
01:59I was hoping for a different result, to be honest.
02:02My preference was Donald Trump, anyways.
02:03Devastated. I just can't believe somebody that's a felon has got in.
02:10I think the main thing I've taken from it is that Trump doesn't care about women.
02:14It's going to be bad for Americans. It's going to be bad for Europeans.
02:17I think Putin and China are rubbing their hands at the moment.
02:21Meanwhile, our politicians haven't stopped to give their views, with the Liberal Democrat MP
02:25for Tunbridge Wells, Mike Martin, calling on the government to increase defence spending
02:30after he called Trump a threat to liberal democracy.
02:33Whilst others, namely the leader of the opposition at Medway Council,
02:36were more welcoming of the result.
02:38We have a special relationship between ourselves, between our peoples,
02:42and of course economically as well. So of course we send congratulations to Donald J Trump.
02:47So with Trump back in the White House, the world waits for just how this era will unfold.
02:53Well, Andy, I want to go to you on this one first,
02:57because you run a local TV station here in Kent.
03:00And it raises the question about why we should actually care about what's happening across
03:05the world. It's quite a far way away. Why does it actually matter to people here in the county?
03:09I think you can see just from all the various media coverage across the,
03:14not just the election night the other day, but over the last 12 months really,
03:19how important it's been to everybody.
03:22I can remember being sat on this very sofa in 2016 with the former political editor,
03:26just being, I think we were laughing really that Donald Trump had got in.
03:30We weren't laughing four years later, and certainly not the other day.
03:34And I think that's what has been the reaction.
03:36But in terms of it being important to people here, I think America, you know,
03:40it's got 25% of the world's economy, all the different types of decisions it makes.
03:46It really does have a knock-on effect here.
03:48Clearly, there's a lot of American students here as well in Kent.
03:52We even have an American member of staff within the KMTV ranks who's from Pennsylvania.
03:57So it really does have a long reach.
03:59And it is important of what's going on over the pond.
04:02Well, Vince, we heard there from George Perfect, your opposition member,
04:07that he welcomes the new president-elect.
04:10Do you echo the same calls?
04:11Do you think it's a good thing that Donald Trump's got another four years in office?
04:15No, it's not the result I would have wanted.
04:18Look, democracy happens.
04:20And sometimes you really welcome the results, as I did last May and this June, July.
04:26Other times you don't welcome the results.
04:28And for me, this is not a result I welcome.
04:30George is right.
04:31And Keir Starmer has said this as well.
04:34We have a special relationship with the US.
04:37So regardless of who the president and prime minister are,
04:41the relationships between our two countries is really critically important
04:45for a number of reasons Andy laid out a moment ago.
04:49So look, is it the result I would have wanted?
04:52No, I think Kamala was a very strong candidate.
04:54I think the Democrats will look back and go,
04:56maybe they should have made some different decisions earlier on.
04:59Trying to run a presidential campaign in just under 110 days is pretty difficult.
05:07Is that the primary thing that you think went wrong for her?
05:09Because demographics show that basically across the board,
05:13everyone was more Trump than they were in the previous election.
05:16It can't just be the fact that it was a short-term campaign.
05:20That's an element of it.
05:21I think there'll be people dissecting this result for probably years and decades to come.
05:26There's no doubt it's a remarkable comeback from someone who, frankly,
05:31in the kind of political norms wouldn't even be allowed to stand in many cases.
05:37As a convicted individual, there's an argument whether he would even be allowed into the UK.
05:42Now, I'm sure he's not going to be barred from coming here,
05:44but the fact we're even asking that question is in itself pretty unusual.
05:49I'm slightly worried about the people around him.
05:51Someone like Elon Musk, who has traded on false information, fake news.
05:58For me, it makes me very proud to have someone like KMTV in my community,
06:03making sure that there's a trusted voice,
06:05when at a time we've seen so much misinformation in this particular election.
06:11But I do think the Democrats will have to look long and hard about what happens next.
06:15I think there's some important messaging and probably some lessons for UK politics.
06:20The economy is doing well, but if people aren't feeling it,
06:23if people don't feel that the GDP is relating to their bank account or their shopping bill,
06:30then you're going to be looking for something different.
06:32A warning for Labour, perhaps, in the next five years.
06:36Obviously, this is the second female candidate we've had run for president.
06:40Do you think it's the end for Kamala Harris?
06:42Do you think misogyny played a part in this?
06:45I'm not sure.
06:48I think lots of people still didn't know much about her.
06:52I think that was a really important aspect.
06:55I think if you listen to all the different...
06:56This is what's been quite interesting to watch,
07:00is that all the different podcasts, all the different broadcasters are trying to work out why.
07:06The polls, we're all obsessed with polls and journalism and politics and what they say.
07:13They said it was all going to be so close and it just wasn't in the end.
07:17The results are still coming out today and that Trump's done so well.
07:20I think a lot of people still didn't really know much about her.
07:24And I think also in America, they really treat their vote as something really special.
07:30I think there was maybe a feeling of it maybe being undemocratic
07:34in the way that Biden was pulled and Kamala Harris was immediately put forward.
07:39I think if there'd been a full and proper primary,
07:42that could have had a different result for her as well, to have that scrutiny.
07:46Obviously, it's having ripples here in the UK.
07:48A very fiery PMQs this week with the new leader of the Conservative Party,
07:51Kenny Balanock, bringing up David Lammy's record.
07:54He called Trump a woman-hating, neo-Nazi-sympathising sociopath.
07:59He spoke to Lord Craig McKinley about today in an exclusive interview.
08:05Here's a clip getting his reaction to what was said at PMQs earlier this week.
08:09I really rather wish David Lammy and others, when they were in opposition,
08:13had said nothing because they're now in government and they've now,
08:16perhaps unexpectedly from their point of view,
08:18got to deal with the most powerful man on the planet in the shape of Donald Trump.
08:23I don't think it was a very good idea for Britain more than anything else.
08:26I'm more worried about Britain than the reputation of David Lammy.
08:29For obvious reasons.
08:30I would have gone for De Santis if I'd been in those early caucuses
08:34to try and find a candidate.
08:36But I really hope I can meet the man.
08:38I mean, the Don.
08:39It's going to be great fun.
08:40And if he comes to London, which I'm sure he will,
08:43he'll be getting a great reception from the Conservative Party, I'm sure.
08:47I'm sure he'll get a great reception from David Lammy.
08:49He's got to eat a bit of humble pie.
08:52But it'd be great to meet him.
08:53Someone evidently happy about Donald Trump being elected there.
08:56But it raises the question,
08:58Labour's kind of dropped the ball here, haven't they, on their foreign policy,
09:01given their Home Secretary's...
09:02I mean, the Foreign Secretary's historic statements could hurt our special relationship.
09:06Well, let's be clear.
09:07Obviously, those statements were made at a time when David Lammy wasn't the Foreign Secretary.
09:12He's been very clear this is old news.
09:14As I said earlier on, this is about the relationship between our two great nations.
09:18And I thought, actually, the new leader of the opposition in Westminster,
09:23you know, not respecting, actually,
09:25that we want to have that kind of cross-party support for our international relations.
09:29The relationship between the US and the UK is critically important,
09:34particularly at a time where, of course, we've left the European Union now.
09:39So actually, I think Keir, David Lammy, the whole team,
09:42I know that Angela Rayner's been engaging in dialogue with JD Vance in the last couple of days.
09:48So look, our government is making sure that that happens appropriately.
09:51Yeah, and I think if you look at Donald Trump's track record,
09:55if someone's not very nice to him one day and then nice to him the next,
09:58he seems to change his tune.
10:00Piers Morgan infamously fell out with him not long ago and stormed out of a meeting.
10:05And apparently, it was one of the first phone calls that he made,
10:07and they were best of friends again.
10:09So Donald Trump, people think that he is not particularly intellectual,
10:16but he's a brilliant politician.
10:18He understands what he needs to do.
10:20He understands the importance of the relationship with the UK.
10:26I think he'll hear what he wants to hear.
10:28Very quickly, just before we go, what will the next five years look for us now?
10:32Because obviously, Donald Trump's going to be in for four years, as far as we know.
10:35What will this mean for our relationship with the US going forward?
10:39Look, I think Keir and Angela, as the leadership of our country,
10:42have done the right things this week, reaching out.
10:44We need to have those conversations,
10:45but I think there will be some tough choices along the way,
10:48particularly around things like NATO.
10:50I think the UK will have to show a leading role,
10:53and with John Healey as Secretary of State for Defence,
10:55I'm confident that will be the case.
10:57Absolutely, and I think the same as Vince.
11:01It's going to be an interesting four or five years.
11:04I think it's, from a political nerd's point of view,
11:08I'm interested to see what the Democrats do to rebound.
11:10Who's going to run in four years' time?
11:13Is J.D. Vance the president-elect now?
11:16Can they even rebound, though, given what's happened?
11:19Well, the Conservatives are starting to already.
11:21I refer you to December 2019,
11:25and the fact that Keir Starmer is now in number 10.
11:28Any political party with the right focus can do that job.
11:30But also, some polls are saying the Conservatives
11:32are coming back strong against Labour.
11:34Exactly, so quite an interesting debate,
11:37and lots of impact for people here in Kent.
11:40But to localise it a bit, after the break,
11:42a little closer to home,
11:43big decisions on planning in the north of the county,
11:46and the future of tuition fees
11:48are Kent's universities under threat.
14:46Welcome to the Kent Politics Show live on KMTV,
15:11the show that gets Kent's politicians talking.
15:14I'm still joined by KMTV's channel director, Andy Richards,
15:18and Vince Maple, the Labour leader of Medway Council.
15:22But now, an application for a business hub at Chatham's last working docks
15:26has officially been approved,
15:28despite a heated fight to prevent the development.
15:31Rochester and Strewd's ex-MP Kelly Tolhurst
15:35had asked the government to intervene
15:37over the Basin 3 development over fears of job losses,
15:41meaning the decision would rest with government.
15:43But the Secretary of State for Housing, Communities and Local Government,
15:48Angela Rayner, has decided not to call the decision in.
15:52And it comes amongst other controversial news,
15:54as the government have ripped away Swell Borough Council's ability
15:58to decide on more than 8,000 whole house developments near Sittingbourne.
16:03Well, obviously, Vince, this is something you know quite a lot about
16:07because you were actually part of the Save the Chatham Docks campaign.
16:11Do you welcome the decision that's been made this week?
16:14There's a couple of bits in this.
16:15So, let me firstly say it's absolutely right and appropriate
16:17for the Secretary of State to look at these matters.
16:21So, I had no problem with it being passed for call-in.
16:26They've done that due process.
16:27They've decided there's nothing to call in.
16:29And therefore, the original decision, made in a quasi-judicial way,
16:33so not a political decision, but effectively a legal decision,
16:37stands the test of the government department.
16:40That's the right thing to do.
16:41And on the case of Swale, again, from a quasi-judicial legal perspective,
16:45it's absolutely right and appropriate for many different reasons.
16:49I don't know the exact reasons, but it could well be around infrastructure,
16:52impact on the wider environment, whatever it might be.
16:55It's right for the Secretary of State, again, to look at that.
16:58Now, when it comes to the specific issues of the docks,
17:01obviously, it's well documented that the owner,
17:05who are the planning applicants who have had their plan processed,
17:10I've wanted them for some time to come to a conclusion
17:13with the current provider of services there, ArcelorMittal.
17:19It's around nearly four years ago that Mittal wrote to the council
17:23to say they were preparing, very close to having an offer to put to Peel.
17:28That's never happened.
17:29So, I would encourage ArcelorMittal to have that conversation,
17:34you know, have that kind of traditional negotiation
17:36between landlord and tenant.
17:38That's perfectly acceptable.
17:40I'll continue to talk to both sides.
17:42They have operated.
17:43There's been a problem with the lock gate.
17:44So, they've been operating for some months now without use of the dock.
17:47But, to cut in, Vince,
17:50you were part of the Save the Docks campaign.
17:52It's gone through.
17:53I know, as leader of the Medway Council,
17:55you have this kind of partiality due to potentially damaging
18:01potential high court bids, stuff like that.
18:03But, as a person, as an individual, you have an opinion on this.
18:06What is it?
18:07Do you think that this is the right decision?
18:09Do you think that this is going to benefit Medway,
18:12or do you stand where you did in previous years?
18:15Look, I think it's really clear from my perspective
18:18that a planning application has got in.
18:20That's a legal process.
18:21It's gone through that process.
18:23I want to retain those jobs.
18:25So, I want Mittal, if they're going to make a bid,
18:28and they said four years ago they were going to,
18:30they've had plenty of opportunity to do that.
18:33I've done my role as leader of the council
18:35to bring those two parties together,
18:37to have a constructive dialogue.
18:39They've chosen not to put in that bid.
18:42So, I'd encourage them to do that.
18:44I'm also very willing to work with them to find alternative sites,
18:47whether that's here in Medway or elsewhere in North Kent.
18:50As I say, at the moment, they've been operating for a number of months
18:53without the lock gates working
18:55and working closely with colleagues in Gravesham.
18:57So, look, my door continues to be open.
19:00I do want to retain as many of those jobs as possible.
19:03But I recognise entirely, ultimately,
19:05this is a commercial decision between Peel and Mittal.
19:08And if Mittal don't make Peel an offer...
19:10So, you think jobs are going to be lost then?
19:12Well, no, I'm not saying that at all.
19:13I'm saying Mittal should be putting that offer to Peel.
19:16They said four years ago they were going to do that.
19:19And they haven't.
19:20So, ultimately, Mittal needs to answer that question.
19:23Why haven't, in four years,
19:25they put a single bid for the land to Peel?
19:28Andy, we've covered devolution a lot here at KMTV.
19:32One of the big buzzwords is Kent is such a big area.
19:35And we're seeing, with call-ins,
19:37such as the one we saw in Sittingbourne recently,
19:40and obviously with the decision
19:42not to actually have a call-in at all on this decision,
19:45a bit of debate around the role of government
19:49in these housing developments.
19:50Do you think that what's happening at the moment
19:52bodes well for potential devolution
19:54and for the role of central government in local government?
19:58I think, well, the aspects I'll talk about
20:00is holding these decisions to account, right?
20:04These are fantastic examples of ourselves here at KMTV
20:12and colleagues at ILIF,
20:14maybe certain sections of the more mainstream media,
20:17are here to ask these questions
20:18that you're asking right now, Vince,
20:21who is clearly in a difficult political position with this,
20:24having been on both sides,
20:26both in opposition and in power as the councillor.
20:30And I respect that he's got to take a different take with that,
20:35but it's up to us to make sure that it's covered in detail,
20:39to tell people, even explain what call-it-in is.
20:42Maybe the type of viewers watching our current programme
20:45will understand those terms,
20:46but for organisations like us and the local media,
20:49it's really, really important that we get to these issues
20:53and help people understand
20:56what the implications of these types of moves will happen.
21:00And making sure we make Vince feel quite tricky sat there today.
21:04Because, obviously, someone like Angela Rayner
21:06calling in these decisions,
21:08there have been some alarm bells raised that it could impact,
21:11like, if a government is making decisions
21:13on local housing developments,
21:14is it a question, perhaps,
21:16that government knows better than local people
21:17when it's making these decisions?
21:19Is that a real concern?
21:20No, and this is for standard practice.
21:22I mean, since the 70s, effectively,
21:25with the Local Government Acts then,
21:27it's been absolutely part of that process
21:29for central government to be able to,
21:31wherever appropriate,
21:32and it's used lightly, it's not used on a regular basis.
21:36It just happens to be that in two neighbouring council areas,
21:41similar things have happened in the same week.
21:44We'll have the next several weeks, if not months,
21:47where none of that will happen.
21:48It just happens to be a coincidence in this particular time.
21:51But it's right for those powers to sit with central government.
21:54The point you made, Oliver, very importantly,
21:57is around devolution.
21:58And actually giving that, perhaps,
22:00to an individual looking after 2 million people,
22:03rather than 70 million people,
22:05I think many people could say
22:07is an interesting development to consider.
22:09But the devolution point is important with local media.
22:14This is something, in fact,
22:15we were talking to the minister at DCMS,
22:18Stephanie Peacock, this week at a meeting.
22:21If devolution does happen,
22:23local media and the role that local media takes
22:26is so important in these types of decisions.
22:29And having our local democracy reporters
22:31at the very centre of these decisions
22:33has been very important for us, too.
22:35Well, because it's not the only news
22:37impacting North Kent, though.
22:39In particular, the education secretary, Bridget Philipson,
22:42announced that university tuition fees
22:44would rise by around £285 each year,
22:50next year, which will go from £9,250 to £9,535.
22:57Already, we see universities like the University of Kent
23:00struggling at the moment.
23:02Is this going to help universities
23:04like the ones that are in Medway or in Canterbury?
23:07I think this is a really challenging time.
23:09We've had a kind of situation post-COVID
23:12where numbers have been hit.
23:14And actually, particularly for the University of Kent,
23:18you know, an organisation that had its branding
23:20as the UK's European university,
23:23actually, the decision in 2016
23:25had a pretty fundamental impact.
23:27And that's not necessarily on that academic year
23:30or the one after.
23:32And of course, universities are not immune
23:34to all the cost-of-living issues there have been,
23:36whether it's expensive utilities,
23:40trying to make sure they've got the up-to-date equipment.
23:42So I do understand this is a challenging time.
23:46Maybe there's a more fundamental conversation
23:49around some of the terminology
23:51around whether tuition fees versus graduate tax,
23:54which is fundamentally...
23:56That's a very Liberal Democrat thing to say.
23:58But fundamentally, it's the same thing, isn't it?
24:02You're paying for something after you've used a service
24:04in that particular case, in the vast majority of cases.
24:07So, look, universities aren't free.
24:10They need to be paid for, even if you're not paying for them.
24:13But government's about choices, though.
24:15The choice is to offload the cost
24:17onto students paying their fees.
24:19The government could have stumped up additional money.
24:21They had the budget recently.
24:23It was a political choice they made.
24:24It may be a difficult one, but they made it
24:27so they spend the money onto those paying the fees.
24:30I'll simply say this, and I'm sure Andy
24:31will have something to say as well.
24:32But from my perspective,
24:34when you've got a £22 billion black hole,
24:37you have to make tough choices.
24:39This relatively small increase,
24:41because there have been much bigger increases in the past,
24:45is unfortunately one of those difficult choices.
24:47Well, Andy, I know you have a lot to say about this,
24:49because we at KMTV have lots of students with us.
24:52What do you make of it?
24:53Yeah, full disclosure as well.
24:54At KMTV, our majority shareholders
24:56are the University of Kent.
24:57So we are significantly impacted
25:02on what goes on in higher education.
25:04But I also add on to one of those factors
25:08that Vince was talking about,
25:09was the change in visa rules as well
25:11for international students.
25:12That's also had a major effect.
25:15I think the universities are in a real predicament
25:19in that I don't think the previous government
25:22or the current government particularly knows
25:24what it wants to do with higher education reform.
25:27It needs reforming.
25:28It needs to change.
25:29If I was 17 now looking at my options
25:33in terms of what I was going to do
25:35in terms of getting into journalism, for example,
25:37an apprenticeship would be probably
25:40a more attractive thing for me.
25:42No debt, learn on the job,
25:45still get my degree level qualification.
25:48I think it's become less about the experience
25:50of going to university.
25:51I think that's what students are paying
25:54their money for at the moment.
25:56And it's very difficult for the universities
25:58to stay competitive
26:01and to offer that student experience.
26:04That's the problem here in Medway.
26:05The student experience isn't near
26:08what it needs to be for the students
26:10to be attracted to come here
26:12in terms of having societies
26:13and all those types of things.
26:14But I think it does need reform.
26:16And we shall see what happens.
26:19But I still think it's a really important sector
26:22that the government really needs to get a grip of.
26:24Obviously, something we'll be following very closely.
26:27But that really is everything
26:29for us on the Kent Politics Show.
26:30We'll be back next week with all the political debate
26:32that gets Kent's politicians talking.
26:34In the meantime, there are lots of other ways
26:36you can keep in touch with politics
26:37here in Kent and at Westminster.
26:39Check out the Kent Politics podcast
26:41and of course, the Kent Politics Briefing
26:44for all the latest news and views.
26:46But for me, for now,
26:48have a lovely evening.
26:49Good night.