Bangladesh on Friday put Pakistan on notice by demanding a formal public apology for the "atrocities" committed by the latter during the 1971 Liberation War and raised pending financial claims during the first Foreign Office Consultations (FOC) meeting in 15 years.
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00:00Bangladesh's big demand from Pakistan
00:10Bangladesh to Pakistan say sorry for 1971
00:19Dhaka seeks 4.3 billion dollar from Pakistan
00:30payback calls after Pakistan army chiefs provocation
00:37we are two nations we are not one nation our forefathers they have sacrificed immensely
00:43and we have sacrificed a lot for the creation of this country
00:47Bangladesh puts Pakistan on notice top focus on India first
00:57Bangladesh has sought an apology from Pakistan for atrocities before the 1971 war
01:11through 1971 and the birth of Bangladesh
01:16Bangladesh has demanded 4.5 billion dollars from Pakistan
01:20over pre-1971 assets and cyclone aid money that Pakistan has not paid then East Pakistan
01:30and has been holding on to that money since 1971
01:35this is a major setback for Pakistan that sought to tie up with Bangladesh to target India
01:41but Pakistan's foreign minister he is to visit Dhaka on the 27th and 28th of April
01:49and incidentally this would be the first visit of a Pakistani foreign minister to Bangladesh
01:54since 2012 but I want to quote what has been said by the foreign secretary of Bangladesh
02:03he said and I quote we raised the historical unsettled issues with Pakistan including a formal public apology
02:11for the atrocities committed during the 1971 liberation war by the Pakistani forces
02:17and the pending financial claims unquote
02:20this is Mohammed Jashimuddin foreign secretary of Bangladesh
02:25he was quoted saying this after his meeting with his Pakistani counterpart
02:30Bangladesh has also made it very clear it wants a formal apology
02:34and 4.5 billion dollars that's pending payment
02:39and these are issues that need to be resolved says Bangladesh
02:42for laying a solid foundation for the Pakistan-Bangladesh relations
02:47but Pakistan has no money Pakistan that's begging for each billion dollar
02:52can ill afford to pay Bangladesh 4.5 billion dollars
02:57because neither Saudi Arabia nor UAE are willing to give any more zakat to Pakistan
03:02China extracts its pound of flesh
03:05it takes over one more part of Balochistan or Sindh or Pakistan-occupied Jammu and Kashmir
03:11for giving any money and Pakistan can ill afford to repay
03:15Pakistan's Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Ishak Dar
03:18is scheduled to pay an official visit to Dhaka
03:21and this would be like I said on the 27th and 28th of April
03:25the first visit by a Pakistani foreign minister since 2012
03:30so this is Bangladesh that's saying fine you want to be friends
03:35first apologize for 1971 atrocities
03:38what were the atrocities and I'll just tell you
03:40it's a shocking eye-opener
03:41when millions of women Bangladeshi women or East Pakistani women
03:46were gang raped by Pakistan army soldiers as part of Operation Searchlight
03:52they were raped because the West Pakistanis said
03:56these are dirty people
03:57let's impregnate them
03:59so that the next generation that's born
04:02are strong sturdy Pakistani men
04:05this was the mindset of the Pakistan army generals
04:08but that mindset actually stays even now
04:11the current army chief of Pakistan
04:13General Asim Munir
04:15many call him Moulana Asim Munir
04:16well he said the two nation theory
04:18he's talked about the two nation theory
04:20we'll also get you how India's external affairs ministry
04:22has responded to what he said
04:25listen in to General Asim Munir
04:27and we'll get you India's response too
04:28Pakistan ki kehani
04:31apne bachchon ko joh hai
04:33aapne zaroor snani hai
04:35taa ke woh Pakistan ki kehani na bholai
04:37well our forefathers they thought
04:39that we are different from the Hindus
04:41in every possible aspect of life
04:43our religion is different
04:45our customs are different
04:46our traditions are different
04:48our thoughts are different
04:49our ambitions are different
04:51that was the foundation of the two nation theory
04:54that was laid there
04:55that we are two nations
04:56we are not one nation
04:58so because of that our forefathers
05:00they struggled
05:01mounted that incessant struggle
05:03to create this country
05:05our forefathers they have
05:06sacrificed immensely
05:09and we have sacrificed a lot
05:11for the creation of this country
05:13and we know how to defend it
05:16my dear brothers and sisters
05:18and sons and daughters
05:19please don't forget the story of Pakistan
05:22and don't forget to narrate the story of Pakistan
05:26to your next generation
05:27so that their bond with Pakistan
05:30it never weakens
05:31whether it is the third generation
05:33or the fourth generation
05:34or the fifth generation
05:35they know that what Pakistan is for them
05:38now
05:39O'near can say, there are only two international rules that are called the religion.
05:44Pohy was called the Riaast of the Taiba because the Prophet has been called the Islam.
05:51And in the Quran there was a name called the Yisra.
05:54Ya Ahla Yisraba.
05:55La Muqameleakam Farjiru.
05:56What about the Quran?
05:58What about the riaast of the religion?
06:00And another one, the 13th century after that Allah has been called the religion of Islam.
06:06The religion of Islam.
06:08How can anything foreign be there in a juggler vein?
06:13This is a union territory of India.
06:20Its only relationship with Pakistan is the vacation of illegally occupied territories by that country.
06:27So what was Operation Searchlight all about?
06:31And for the benefit of this generation, you must know what Pakistan did to then East Pakistan or current Bangladesh.
06:39Three million people were massacred by the Pakistan army.
06:43Between 2 lakh to 4 lakh women were gang raped.
06:48They were brutally raped by Pakistan army soldiers.
06:51There were reports of 1,70,000 abortions of raped women.
06:5930,000 women died by suicide.
07:035,000 war babies were born.
07:06And these are statistics which India did not provide.
07:10This was a commission that investigated Pakistan army's war crimes and this was their report.
07:17There were 10 million refugees.
07:19Because when Pakistan army's atrocities during Operation Searchlight in March of 1971 became unbearable,
07:2610 million people came into Indian territory.
07:2840 million Bangladeshis or Bengalis, then of East Pakistan, they were displaced.
07:35This, there were 942.
07:39942 killing fields that were found in Bangladesh.
07:43There were people, East Pakistanis, the Bengalis, they would just be lined up.
07:48And they would just be shot dead.
07:49And before they would be killed, they would be made to dig their graves.
07:54And then they would be buried in the same graves.
07:56The survivors would be told, you bury the rest there.
07:59Lefton General Syed Atta Hasnain joins me on this special broadcast.
08:02He's a military historian.
08:04He's a former co-commander.
08:06Ambassador Veena Sikri, Zindya's former high commissioner to Bangladesh, joins us on this show.
08:10Arzu Kazmi is a journalist who joins us from Pakistan.
08:13Ambassador Sikri, you were a high commissioner in Bangladesh and this was a very sore issue with people in Bangladesh.
08:21They wanted an apology from Pakistan.
08:24Now, when there's an establishment that's seen as very close to Jamaat-e-Islami or radical Islamists in Bangladesh and they demand an apology.
08:31Is this perfunctory or are they serious about it?
08:35This is complete eyewash.
08:37Let me tell you, Gaurav, this is complete eyewash.
08:39You are very right.
08:40You have narrated the facts accurately about what happened in 1971.
08:45And it is also very true that for the last 54 years, this has been at the forefront of the demand of the people of Bangladesh.
08:52That they want apology from Pakistan.
08:54They want $4.3 billion in reparation.
08:58All that is absolutely true.
09:00But today, the Mohammed Unis' unconstitutional illegitimate regime is putting this as eyewash.
09:05They know that the people of Bangladesh will not accept a reordering of the relationship with Pakistan.
09:13They will not accept friendship with Pakistan unless these things are done.
09:17So, they have put it on the table in the talks with the foreign secretary and they will repeat it in the talks with the deputy prime minister.
09:22But the end outcome is going to be, yes, we have made the demand, but we will continue to talk on that.
09:28And we will also continue to develop our good relations with Pakistan.
09:31So, what is going to happen is that this will give them the freedom to develop the relations with Pakistan by saying that we have put the demands on the table and we are talking to them.
09:39And we will get it for you by tomorrow day after, tomorrow day after.
09:42So, this is a complete eyewash, just a sanction.
09:44Eyewash, you say.
09:46I want to bring in General Hasnain.
09:47General Hasnain, this generation in Bangladesh may not know, and especially if it's a generation that's being brought up on, you know, which is feared by radical Islamists who now run that country.
09:59You also heard what Pakistan's army chief said and we played that out.
10:03I'll come to that in just a moment.
10:04But what do you make of this?
10:06What were the atrocities and how grave were those atrocities that were carried out by West Pakistanis on then East Pakistanis or as many say, by the Punjabis, the Pashtuns on that side, on the Bengalis this side?
10:22Gaurav, thank you, first of all, for inviting me for your program.
10:25No doubt, I was an 18-year-old in 1971 and I still remember night after night watching television or hearing All India Radio at that time.
10:35And we used to hear of this all the time.
10:37You have just related the truth, the stark truth completely for this generation to understand.
10:43Because not many people are aware of what Operation Searchlight was all about.
10:47You have just given the facts.
10:48But the current linkage to what is happening in Bangladesh, I couldn't agree more with Ambassador Veena Sikri.
10:57I was myself wondering as to what will be the stance that people will take on this program.
11:03And I'm happy to see that there is no doubt about it that this has become an aberration suddenly.
11:09A stark aberration in the cascading build-up of the relationship between the illegal government in Bangladesh at the moment and Pakistan,
11:20which has been happening for the better part of the last four or five months.
11:23And suddenly you find a stop being put suddenly there, an unnatural stop being put there by raising this issue of 1971.
11:32Obviously, as Ambassador Veena Sikri very correctly says, it seems to be that it's been put there as an eyewash.
11:40A red herring to take out the complete, you know, allegations which are being put against the current government in Dhaka
11:49that they are hand in glove with Pakistan and the ISI's presence there is all about creating a third front against India.
11:57So, obviously, we'll have to wait and watch these events as we go along.
12:01But I entirely agree with Ambassador Veena Sikri.
12:04Okay, I want to bring in Arzu Kazmi.
12:06Arzu, are people in Pakistan aware of what the generals then who were leading Pakistan army,
12:15General Tikka Khan, before he was called the butcher of Balochistan,
12:19was actually the butcher of Bengalis in Bangladesh.
12:22The massacre that had been carried out.
12:25Can you imagine, Arzu, 3 million people, 30 lakh people killed.
12:31Can you imagine between 2 lakh to 4 lakh women being raped?
12:37And by Muslim women, Hindu women here in Bangladesh or then East Pakistan being raped by people who came from West Pakistan.
12:46Can you even imagine that? 2 lakh to 4 lakh women being raped?
12:511 lakh 70,000 abortions after these rapes.
12:5530,000 women who committed suicide because they were sex slaves, Arzu?
12:59Exactly, Gaurav. You are right. But unfortunately, Pakistan will not accept it.
13:05And I don't even know this or sorry about this.
13:09Because I think 2 years ago, a brigadier of my show came to me.
13:14And when I asked this story, they said that it was an Indian army that was wearing Pakistan uniforms.
13:22And I can send you the clip, the show you can send me, which I have told you, and after that, my show didn't come again.
13:28They said that what happened in Bangladesh, the Indian army was responsible for that, not Pakistan army.
13:35So, how did they ignore that thing and reject that thing?
13:39So, what do you think?
13:40That the history that we have learned from our generation, you think that it is true.
13:45We have learned that the whole fight was won, and you started it, and what happened in Bangladesh was responsible for it.
13:53And there was no mistake from our side.
13:55So, I don't think anybody will accept this.
13:58Okay, Pakistan army continues to do that, but for this generation, Ambassador Sikri,
14:03I want you to tell this generation what actually happened.
14:09Who was General Tikka Khan?
14:11Who was General Yahya Khan?
14:12General A.A.K. Niazi, of course, a lot of people know because he was the one who surrendered,
14:17who signed that instrument of surrender on 16th of December 1971 to General Arora.
14:22But why was General Tikka Khan known as the butcher of Bengalis in Danish Pakistan, madam?
14:28Well, you know, the entire history of what happened in 1971 boils down to the West Pakistani distaste for the people of East Pakistan.
14:40A complete distaste, a complete abhorrence, a racist approach to the people of East Pakistan.
14:47And combined with that, they think they have racial superiority and intellectual superiority,
14:52and they do not want to give any rights.
14:54I am saying this because the entire problem arose because in the 1970 elections,
14:59perhaps the only fair elections held in Pakistan in the last 75 plus years,
15:06that in those elections, it was Sheikh Mujib, Sheikh Mujib Uraibhan,
15:10who won an overwhelming majority, and he should have been the Prime Minister of Pakistan.
15:14That was absolutely the purpose for which the elections were held.
15:17And he won the overwhelming majority if you take both West Pakistan and East Pakistan together.
15:22He should have been the Prime Minister.
15:23But Bhutto, Zilfakar Ali Bhutto in the West would not allow it.
15:27And he said, no, he cannot be the Prime Minister of Pakistan.
15:30So, you know, you be in the West and we be in the East, that kind of thing,
15:33telling them, telling Sheikh Mujib, you do what you want in East Pakistan, I will be here, etc.
15:38Obviously, it's not acceptable to Sheikh Mujib Uraibhan.
15:41And there were talks held on it.
15:43And, you know, there was, Yaya Khan was in Dhaka for talks.
15:48And the talks broke down because they were not ready.
15:51After promising to hold the Assembly, the Parliament, with all the elected leaders,
15:57that the Parliament was never held, the talks with Sheikh Mujib Uraibhan broke down.
16:01And Yaya Khan left Dhaka on the 23rd of March 1971 and ordered Operation Searchlight.
16:09And that is where the genocide started.
16:12I mean, this story of saying the Indian Army did everything, the Indian Army was not there for nine months.
16:17It's only in December that the actual war broke out.
16:20Before that, it was, you know, where the absolute, you know, the rape, the killings, the lynchings,
16:26the intellectuals, murder, and the absolutely horrendous genocide perpetrated by the army of West Pakistan
16:33on the people of East Pakistan.
16:34This is something absolutely that should be written in the annals of the world history
16:38as one of the worst events of its kind to ever take place.
16:41And, but the people of Bangladesh fought back.
16:44They declared their own independence.
16:46There was a proclamation of independence on the 11th of April, 1971.
16:50And that proclamation, that constitution was drawn up later.
16:55And we know that how in the, although 10 million refugees from East Pakistan came into India,
17:00but the Indian government fought and, you know, the Indian Army and the...
17:03You know, I want to, I want to stay on that issue, General Hasnain, of Pakistan Army ordering the rape of Bengali women.
17:15Because they said the next generation should not be like these dirty Bengalis or words to that effect that was used.
17:22They wanted the next generation to be strong, tall, like the West Pakistanis.
17:27And this was state-sponsored, a Pakistan Army-sponsored rape of millions,
17:33lakhs and lakhs of Bengali women raped and killed General Hasnain.
17:38State-sponsored, wasn't it, sir?
17:41See, Gaurav, I think today's generation, what they need to know
17:44and what they need to get reiterated to them
17:47is the aberration that was the Pakistani nation.
17:50Separated by 1,500 kilometers of Indian territory,
17:56a Bengali nation, Muslim, so-called, joined together by the Islamic faith.
18:02Proven thereafter that there was no such thing as a linkage within Islam or within a religion.
18:08And it's the Western Pakistan, the West Pakistani elements,
18:12who consider themselves superior, their language Urdu superior to Bengali,
18:16who wished to put it down to the Bengalis that they were an inferior people.
18:22And that was why the whole human rights,
18:24the entire human rights campaign started against the Bengalis
18:28to exterminate the intellectuals.
18:31The operational searchlight was not only about targeting women,
18:34not only about targeting others,
18:36but targeting the intellectuals of Bangladesh.
18:39And hundreds and thousands of them were killed.
18:41I want to congratulate Arzu ji.
18:44I was hearing her program also today
18:46and she has given reference to the Hamadur Rahman Commission,
18:51which is necessary in Pakistan for people to know and understand.
18:55It's been put under wraps
18:56and no one in Pakistan in current generation
18:59knows what actually happened.
19:01It's all there, given in the Hamadur Rahman report.
19:04Absolutely.
19:34Two-Nation Theory and Muslim Superior Race
19:37and Hindu and this kind of stuff they do.
19:39We have already said that the bank freeze
19:43or documents freeze are already made
19:45and they have already launched me.
19:45And F.I.R.
19:47We have already launched it.
19:49But the rest of it is that the new generation
19:52is our generation, which is now known as the truth,
19:55the truth has been found.
19:57And now they follow the same thing.
19:59And this is why we are frustrated.
20:00This is why we are two-Nation Theory and we are concerned about it.
20:02And this is why we are concerned about it.
20:04And this is why we are concerned about it.
20:05And this is why we are concerned about it.
20:06What is happening in Balochistan and what is happening in KPK.
20:09So they accept it or not.
20:11But the new generation coming in,
20:12they are definitely more smart and they know everything from us.
20:16And this new generation, because, you know, Pakistan army like a leopard cannot change its spots,
20:22Ambassador Sikri.
20:24Considering General Tikka Khan carried out that same brutal rape, murder, mayhem in Dain East Pakistan.
20:33And they did exactly the same in Balochistan just a couple of years later, 1973 onwards.
20:40So the butcher of Bengalis became the butcher of Balochistan, madam.
20:44And that continues till date under Asim Munir.
20:46Yeah, you know, I mean, this is amazing because it's so gobilism.
20:50You think that you can repeat a lie a thousand times and it will become the truth.
20:53It does not become the truth.
20:55But the amazing propensity of the Pakistan army to delude themselves and delude their own people that, you know,
21:03the history is not what it is.
21:04And believing in the two-nation theory, we all know that the two-nation theory fell to smithereens
21:09when Bangladesh was created.
21:11And now they are trying to re-establish it because the people who have done the regime change in Bangladesh,
21:18they are the ones who were the losers in 1971.
21:20The Pakistan army was a loser.
21:22The Jamaat-e-Islami was a loser.
21:24The Radhakars were the loser.
21:25And they think that now in August 2024, they are now one.
21:29And now they're trying to obliterate the memory of 1971 and teach something else to their children.
21:35But as our very distinguished panelist from Pakistan is correctly saying,
21:38the younger generation is too smart to be fooled.
21:41And they know they have access to social media.
21:43They have access to the internet.
21:45They have access to opinions in all countries.
21:48So they cannot be fooled by just one, you know, chief of army staff who is actually known as even a maulana
21:54by many people in his own country.
21:56And, you know, and so that they know it.
21:59And I think the people of Bangladesh are equally smart, the younger generation.
22:02And they know it.
22:03They will not be fooled by what the UNIS regime and his foreign affairs advisor and others are trying to do with Pakistan.
22:10You know, in India today, we'll be putting out those details.
22:13Those details of Operation Searchlight.
22:15But go on, madam.
22:15Complete your point, please.
22:16Please go ahead.
22:17I was just saying that Pakistan is all set.
22:20Pakistan, China and Bangladesh to create this three-front attack on India.
22:25And they think that they can get away with it, but they should know they cannot.
22:29India's security lines are very, red lines are very clear.
22:32We know what those red lines are.
22:34The UNIS regime is trying its best to cross every security red line, whether it is Lal Munir Hart, new modernization of air force base by China and Pakistan, whether it is giving the TISTA water management project to China instead of to India, giving the Mongla port development project to China instead of India.
22:51These are all trying to reverse both Mongla and TISTA decisions of the previous Sheikh in our government.
22:57But this is not going to have any impact because it's hurting our security such a lot that there are going to be serious consequences.
23:06Okay.
23:07General Hastane, what do you make of what General Aasem Munir said about the two-nation theory, about Kashmir being their Shehraga or their Jagala Vane and India's response?
23:18Does he sound very, very desperate given how popular Imran Khan despite being in jail is?
23:26How youngsters are against him and how overseas Pakistanis have been targeting General Aasem Munir's regime?
23:33See, Gaurav, General Munir, the way he has spoken, his body language itself and the reception and response which the audience has actually given him,
23:46all goes to show that the confidence of the Pakistani nation is at its lowest step at the moment.
23:55It's breaking up virtually, its economy is in shambles completely.
24:00There are terror attacks in the West, there are terror attacks from the PLA in Balochistan.
24:05The streets have been taken over by radical elements everywhere.
24:10This is the kind of message which Munir is sending out that despite all this, Pakistan continues to remain the other state almost as if it is a replica of the state created by the prophet in Medina way back in the 7th century AD.
24:29I think this could be the biggest sacrilege and he should be taken to task by a lot of people in the clergy because Pakistan, comparing Pakistan as a state which is parallel and something equivalent to the state created in Medina by the holy prophet,
24:47I think to my mind is the ultimate disgrace you can bring to Islam anywhere because Pakistan, you know what it is.
24:55It's a state which respects nothing.
24:58There is no state existent as such.
25:00There is terror everywhere and it's a state which is completely breaking up.
25:04He is attempting to try and appeal to the Kashmiris.
25:10On this line, he is trying to appeal to the Kashmiris to think of looking at Pakistan.
25:15Imagine that kind of a state which India has created and how Kashmir is joined with India.
25:24Yeah, that's a very, very pertinent point he is making that he is insulting Islam by calling Pakistan or comparing Pakistan to Riaasat-e-Madina.
25:32Of course, Imran Khan did the same.
25:35It landed him in jail and Arzu, I want to understand from you.
25:39Riaasat-e-Madina is what Imran Khan also wanted to make Pakistan.
25:42He ended up in jail.
25:44Aasim Munir is also now using the same line.
25:46So both resorting to religion as a very desperate measure.
25:50Lekin dono ke beech toh 36 ka akda hai.
25:52Dono toh ek dousre ke jani dushman hai.
25:54Pakistan mein, ek mayan mein dho talwar nahi rahsakta hai.
25:56Ya Aasim Munir, ya Imran Khan.
25:58Kia yeh sach hai?
25:59Oe sach hai, dhun-a-dun-e-dun-e-dusre ke guleoye ko pukade rahe sas mamay?
26:04Lug toh aise hi raay kiis wa�Cu jay wao armi eo armii aur imran Khan ke bischen biou biigongul baat ni ban pari yeh lekin iaha par kuch bhi ho saktahe.
26:11You never know kis vakt imran Khan in ki kone si baat man jaae.
26:14Ya e imran Khan ki kone si baat man jaae.
26:16Lekin kyanne waal ee toh yeh kehatta hai.
26:18Kis vakt armii jo hao imran Khan sa hinaroo mang raya hai.
26:21Mugger yeh kahan tahak sahhi hee hee, yeh nahi pata.
26:22but it is necessary that it is in both problems.
26:24It is in both problems and one can live in Pakistan.
26:29So either Aasim Manir or Imran Khan,
26:33this is a story that Bangladesh must know.
26:43This generation of Bangladesh must know what happened with their mothers and their grandmothers
26:47and their great grandmothers at the hands of Pakistanis.
26:49So when Muhammad Yunus ties up with the Pakistanis,
26:52he's putting their future generation exactly down the same path that they once have already been
26:59and I'm sure the end will not be very good for them.
27:02And we'll be tracking that story very, very closely as good neighbours should.
27:07To all my guests, many thanks for joining me.
27:09Ambassador Sikri, General Hasnain and Arzu Kazmi.
27:11Thank you for joining me on this India Today special.