Visit our website:
http://www.france24.com
Like us on Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/FRANCE24.English
Follow us on Twitter:
https://twitter.com/France24_en
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:00We're going to take a deep dive into reports that the Trump administration is mulling a
00:04massive shake-up in the U.S. military commands.
00:07According to NBC News, the potential restructuring could see the Pentagon give up its role as
00:13NATO's supreme commander in Europe.
00:15Well, today, the top two Republican lawmakers who lead the Pentagon's oversight committees
00:20in the U.S. Congress are sounding the alarm.
00:22In a joint statement, the chairs slammed the potential overhaul, saying they will not accept
00:27the changes without coordination with Congress and other agencies.
00:30Well, let's bring in James Townshend.
00:33He's the senior advisor at the Scowcroft Center for Strategy and Security at the Atlantic
00:39Council.
00:40James, great to have you.
00:41Thank you so much for joining us.
00:43So this joint statement issued yesterday by the two Republican chairs is one of the first
00:49major instances of Republican lawmakers pushing back against Trump.
00:55Talk to us about how significant that is.
00:57And is the administration likely to listen to the concerns?
01:00Well, it's very important that we're hearing Republicans from the Congress finally pushing
01:09back on some of these unilateral things that the executive branch is doing.
01:13So the good news is that the legislative branch, which is the balance to the executive, is
01:19actually doing their job and pushing back on the executive.
01:23The bad news is I don't think the president cares.
01:26I think the president is proceeding forward.
01:29He doesn't even seem to care about what the judicial side says, the judges.
01:33So I'm not sure how much of an impact this will be.
01:36But it's good to see at least some of the Republicans trying to stand up to Trump and
01:41exercise their authority as part of the congressional branch.
01:45Well, James, the U.S. has held on to this role of overseeing all NATO military operations
01:51in Europe for nearly 75 years now.
01:54Tell us exactly what that job entails and what the potential impact of the U.S. walking
01:59away from this role.
02:01What impact could that have?
02:03Well, it's got two major impacts.
02:06One is that having an American as the supreme ally commander for Europe, particularly at
02:12a time when most of the forces that are there are U.S., it's important that an American
02:18is commanding that.
02:19I know the U.S. Congress and the tradition in the United States has been that U.S. forces
02:24are commanded by ultimately a U.S. commander.
02:27And so having the U.S. be the SACEUR, as he's called, is important for that respect.
02:34Secondly, having an American be the head of the NATO military in Europe shows an American
02:41commitment to NATO, an American commitment that goes back to General Eisenhower, who
02:47was the first SACEUR.
02:48So this is heavy on symbolism, but also important in terms of command and control of NATO militaries
02:56when a lot of those forces in Europe right now are U.S.
02:59One of the implications, potential implications, from the U.S. potentially walking away from
03:05this job could be that it loses access to some of those key naval and air bases that
03:10are in different parts of Europe, particularly in places like Poland.
03:15This is at a time where Russia seems to be getting more aggressive, obviously negotiations
03:20for a ceasefire is underway for the war in Ukraine.
03:24What does the U.S. stand to gain from walking away and withdrawing from this job, withdrawing
03:29from those key naval bases, a time where security in Europe seems more and more vulnerable?
03:35Well, there seems to me zero-sum game here.
03:40The U.S. is to disengage from NATO, whether it's through pulling our commanders away or
03:45U.S. forces begin to go away, it's just a loss for the United States, it's a loss for
03:51NATO.
03:52You know, you mentioned the bases that are there.
03:55The bases are there based on a bilateral agreement between the United States and the country,
04:01like Poland, that hosts that U.S. base.
04:03But the rationale for that base that the Polish government uses to tell its people why the
04:09U.S. base is there, the rationale is it's got a NATO mission.
04:13And so if that NATO mission goes away, it's harder for the Poles to have a reason to have
04:18U.S. forces in their country.
04:21So it becomes a bilateral problem between us and the European nations that host us,
04:28and it becomes a military security issue for NATO if we begin to walk away, we're not as
04:33engaged there, and Europe isn't quite ready yet to take over for us.
04:38It gives an opportunity for the Russians to make a lot of mischief.
04:42So you don't think that somebody could, or any of the other countries, could fill that
04:46role that the U.S. could potentially leave behind?
04:51Not today, and not in the short term.
04:54Europe right now is undergoing a massive change in terms of funding for defence, as far as
05:01the European defence industry, the EU is doing this, individual nations are doing this, France
05:06is leading Europe to do this.
05:09And I think under French leadership, with the UK as well, and Germany, I think Europe
05:15eventually will be able to do this.
05:17But right now, today, it's still early days for the rearming of Europe.
05:23But Europe's underway, it's doing it, but it's going to take some time.
05:27Well, some analysts are suggesting that a step like this could be the first step towards
05:31the U.S. leaving NATO altogether.
05:33Give us your assessment of that.
05:35Well, I mean, that's, you know, that's been a fear for a while because of things that
05:42Trump has said over the past year, as well as what he almost did during his first term.
05:48He almost left the alliance then.
05:50He was talked out of it.
05:52So right now, I think there is some nervousness that we are starting to see signs that there'll
05:57be a disengagement in terms of military forces on the continent, perhaps withdrawal of some
06:02U.S. troops, making the SACEUR no longer an American, but a European officer, the head
06:10of that, that this could be a prelude to the U.S. maybe at the summit in June in The Hague.
06:18There's an announcement by the U.S. that we're going to downgrade our representation at NATO
06:23headquarters in Brussels from an ambassador to something less.
06:27We don't know.
06:29But these signs are worrisome that that's some thinking going on in Washington.
06:34But it's still too early to say.
06:35Well, as part of this potential overhaul, the outlet NBC is also reporting that the
06:41administration could consider consolidating the U.S. European command, as well as the
06:46U.S. command in Africa into one single unit.
06:50Logistically, could one body, I mean, one unit oversee over 100 countries and also oversee
06:57all the issues pertaining to each of those regions?
07:01Is a plan like this even feasible?
07:03Well, it's an important point you're raising.
07:06And when I was in the Pentagon, I spent about 35 years in the Pentagon doing Europe and
07:11NATO.
07:12And when I was there, the European command and the African command were consolidated.
07:17But at that time, the European command was mainly doing training.
07:20There wasn't Russia on the march.
07:23There wasn't the potential of warfare, you know, down the road.
07:27So the European command was able to work with the Africa offices, and they were able
07:33to manage it.
07:34Today, it would probably be different, because the European command has so much on its plate,
07:41and so does the African command.
07:42So having them together under one commander who also is double-hatted as the NATO commander,
07:49that could be too much.
07:50And that's one of the reasons why they're thinking about giving up that NATO hat, giving
07:56it to a European ally, and then having the American just do the European command and
08:01the African command.
08:03I hope that's not what they do.
08:04They need to have the Americans as the SACEUR, and they need to have European command and
08:09African command split, both headed by a four-star.
08:13That makes the most sense.
08:15Well, we have to wait.
08:16If there's any confirmation on all of these plans and all this speculation, we'll have
08:21to see how this all plays out.
08:24James, thank you so much for joining us on the programme.
08:26It's great to get your analysis and insight on what is a very important issue and a developing
08:31story it seems like.