In individual sport, Viswanathan Anand is probably India’s greatest; the grandmaster has gone where no Indian has ever been before. In his book Mind Master: Winning Lessons from a Champion’s Life—part autobiography, part about the lessons he has learnt from chess—the five-time World Champion unveils his battles over 64 squares. In this interview to G.C. Shekhar he discusses the book, his game, being the nice guy and the future of Indian chess.
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Follow this story and more: https://www.outlookindia.com/magazine/story/sports-news-there-is-great-depth-in-indias-young-chess-talent/302515
#OutlookBibliofile #OutlookMagazine #OutlookGroup
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00:00 Certainly chess gives you a lot of lessons that I think you should relate to.
00:05 Whether it's easier, I would assume that most professions you should be able to find something
00:12 of interest that you can then communicate out.
00:14 But certainly chess, especially in the context of learning and how to cope with artificial
00:22 intelligence, well these are themes that chess players have faced first if you like or it's
00:28 right in the front end of it.
00:30 So perhaps that's interesting for us to hear.
00:33 Thank you Anand for speaking to Outlook on the occasion of your book launch.
00:46 First question is, a memoir or autobiography usually happens when one hangs up the books
00:52 but you are still an active player in the top 10 even though you turned 50 this December.
00:58 Can you explain the rationale for doing this book at this stage in your career?
01:05 I would say the 50th birthday provided a very convenient deadline or timeline if you like.
01:12 So the project has been around for a long time and this seemed like a good moment to
01:19 clinch it.
01:21 I don't see that I have to retire for it to happen.
01:26 I think since the book is really about my life lessons, I felt I had a story to tell
01:32 already and I could say it.
01:35 And it doesn't really matter if I choose to play a few years more.
01:43 So I don't see that as being terribly…
01:46 But the 50th was a nice road.
01:49 Has any chess player done this?
01:51 A top player done this before but when he is still active, written a book or something
01:55 like that?
01:56 Yes, but they have tended to be autobiographies so we decided to frame it differently and
02:05 extract life lessons rather than chronologically going through all the events.
02:09 Take what was most significant and what I might have learned.
02:13 Your co-author Susan was telling us that you decided the format, how it is going to be
02:18 and any particular reason why you chose this kind of format because trying to extract life
02:24 lessons from your famous matches is a new approach for a sportsman.
02:29 Is it easier for a chess player to discuss tactics, preparations, schematics and post-match
02:34 analysis and draw wisdom from there than say for a tennis player?
02:41 That many of your nuggets of wisdom can actually be used, applied in company boardrooms or
02:46 in management courses or simply in real life situations.
02:50 Do you think for a chess player it is far more easier to access these issues?
02:57 It depends how you view your life.
02:59 I mean I have done a fair amount of public speaking so maybe it flowed from that also.
03:04 I have already been in IT for a month.
03:07 In IT but also I give talks in companies and so on.
03:14 So I do quite a fair amount of public speaking and I have already been taking lessons from
03:19 my career and discussing them.
03:22 So maybe the format suggested itself like that.
03:27 Is it easy for a chess player to do this?
03:29 To bring out nuggets of wisdom about his moves, his strategies, the tactics he has applied
03:36 and the opponents that he has faced?
03:40 Certainly chess gives you a lot of lessons that I think you should relate to.
03:45 Whether it is easier, I would assume that most professions you should be able to find
03:51 something of interest that you can then communicate out.
03:54 But certainly chess and especially in the context of learning and how to cope with artificial
04:02 intelligence, well these are themes that chess players have faced first if you like or it
04:08 is really the front end of it.
04:09 So perhaps that is interesting for us to hear from you.
04:12 We need to enjoy as anyone can access chess data available in the cloud and they have
04:18 dented the human ego in chess players.
04:20 You also observed that in spite of self-heat of data one often has to play by instinct
04:25 and improvise on the way.
04:26 Will a day come when computers will determine how chess has to evolve in the future or are
04:31 they doing that already?
04:33 They are pretty much doing that already in the sense that everybody is sitting with their
04:37 computer.
04:38 I don't know anyone who analyzes on his own for any sustained period of time.
04:42 You may analyze on your own just to simulate a real world environment of a tournament but
04:49 you are not going to do this in sustained basis because you work with software.
04:53 So already almost all the new parts, all the analysis are being driven by computers and
05:02 so first that has already happened.
05:04 I think egos is no longer an issue in chess because that already happened.
05:09 There was a period when we were surprised and we had to rejig our expectations but now
05:15 everyone is over it and we have passed that stage.
05:19 As for geography, I think it still helps to have a chess community in your town.
05:24 It certainly doesn't hurt but my point is it's no longer the sort of the insuperable
05:30 obstacle it once used to be.
05:32 I mean once upon a time there are many people who may have been talented but they happen
05:37 to live in countries where there was no chess culture and they tried for a while but they
05:43 are always fighting the odds.
05:44 I mean everything which is a two minute walk in a city which is with a chess culture is
05:49 a lot of effort.
05:50 You have to phone someone, mail someone, ask for a book.
05:54 I mean every bit of contact is a thing and that friction invariably takes a toll.
05:59 Now that is heavily reduced so that is no longer a big handicap but it's still a big
06:04 help if you can work with it.
06:06 When you were crowned as India's first GM, it inspired so many youngsters to take up
06:11 chess and today India has 465 GMs.
06:14 In an interview to Outlook in September 2018, you saw at least five prospective world champions
06:19 from India but Praveen Tipsey recently said that after you no Indian GM has managed to
06:26 reach the top 20 ranking, who do you see as champion candidates from India?
06:30 Where did that happen?
06:34 Well if you take the current crop of really young players then they not only have time
06:40 on their side, a lot of time on their side.
06:43 I have already finished the GM titles which shows their promise.
06:48 So clearly Pragnath, Nihal Sarin, Gupkesh, Ranak Sardwani, so these are the three or
06:57 four who are really young, lots of time is on.
07:01 Besides that there are other promising players who are very strong.
07:07 I would rank them slightly less not because of lack of strength but because they are already
07:10 20, 22 and that necessarily compresses their time frame.
07:17 But I think we have an incredible amount of depth in this sense.
07:21 I often keep saying that Harikrishna was in the top 20 for a fair amount of time so it
07:26 wasn't that he was that far off.
07:29 But then he didn't cross, he didn't come anywhere close where you have been, in your
07:35 zone as they would say.
07:37 True but it could happen and it's also very hard to predict these things.
07:43 But Harikrishna is still playing in lots of top tournaments.
07:46 Vidit is doing well, Harimann is doing well.
07:50 And I think each of them if they tweak something or can fix some problems that they have then
07:55 there is a lot of scope for improvement.
07:58 Or it's just going to tennis league, the top three of Federer, Nadal and Berkowitz,
08:02 separate by a huge gap by the rest of the field.
08:05 You think something like that is happening?
08:07 I wanted to say that I don't think that's happening but on the other hand right now
08:10 the rating list, the gap between number 3 and number 4 is bigger than the gap between
08:17 number 4 and number 20.
08:23 Is smaller than the gap between number 4 and number 3.
08:29 But it doesn't feel, if you see tournament results I don't think it's only three guys
08:36 winning every time.
08:37 Once in a while someone else wins.
08:40 But in terms of consistency is what they are.
08:43 There are surprise winners too.
08:45 Also Magnus really was dominating last year, followed by Caruana.
08:52 Even after becoming GM, you used to be shy and reticent in your media interactions.
09:00 But Arna's arrival in your life appears to have changed you.
09:03 You are more articulate and very humble, conserved very nicely.
09:07 She is now your manager who decides your schedule, draws up your contracts and packs your bags.
09:11 How much of a difference has Arna made to your chess?
09:14 Obviously quite huge.
09:15 I mean I have become very efficient in the sense that I am able to just do the chess
09:21 and focus on nothing else and she is very good at arranging other things.
09:26 And every time you don't get distracted by small things, you can just focus on doing
09:32 big jobs.
09:33 She was, especially in the crucial years, she was travelling with me everywhere.
09:40 So she was an integral part of the team.
09:42 Not just a manager but an integral part of the team.
09:45 That was a huge help.
09:46 Trouble shooting.
09:47 Almost any adjective should work at this point.
09:52 Do you and Arna play chess?
09:56 As you say, because initially till you came out on tour with her, she had no clue what
10:00 happened.
10:01 Now the two of you even discuss employing German defence.
10:07 We played one token game once, we made a draw, I wisely offered a draw and that was it.
10:13 And we didn't play too much after that.
10:16 But for instance, when we were giving her puzzles, she is able to solve them very fast
10:21 herself.
10:22 So when he is thinking, she is able to guide him along.
10:28 She still understands the game quite easily.
10:32 You end the book on a slight note of despondency on how you and Gal fanned.
10:36 Both in their 50s now.
10:38 Find the youngsters like Carlsen, Aronian and Nakumara.
10:42 Too much to handle.
10:43 Yet you go against a woeful form and lack of confidence by winning the 2017 Rapid Championship.
10:52 But only to see a dip in the tournament in 2018.
10:56 And you say that hereafter it's more about the joy of playing than pursuit of ranking.
11:00 That's what you say in your book.
11:02 That will keep you going, that will keep you going till you retire officially.
11:06 Or as you say, would you like to spend more time with your son Akhil?
11:10 Not wanting to miss out on his growing years?
11:13 Well, I don't see the despondency at all.
11:17 I think I'm simply talking about reality.
11:19 Some things are just hard.
11:20 And why should I be despondent?
11:21 I've had a full career.
11:22 That's what I say in the book as well.
11:23 But you constantly reassess your goals and what it is you want to do.
11:34 And also I don't think chess really comes into conflict with the time I spend with my
11:38 family.
11:39 On the one hand, yes, I disappear for stretches.
11:41 But on the other hand, when I'm here, I'm fully here.
11:44 I don't have to go to work.
11:45 So it matches up.
11:46 I try to do both.
11:47 I mean, I get pleasure from playing.
11:48 It's my profession.
11:49 So I can do it.
11:50 But also when I come back home, I try to spend as much time with everyone.
11:58 I will say that this is an important game in recovering chess.
12:02 So it's not only some sort of personal indulgence.
12:06 It's healthy to have.
12:08 But I think what I'm really talking about is the struggles I'm facing.
12:17 And look, age is a factor.
12:20 I cannot ignore it.
12:21 But at the same time, I don't see any response.
12:24 You also said that the average is in the top 10 or how else in the 30s with you and Garfan
12:29 in the free.
12:30 No, I'll tell you the figures.
12:31 I checked about four years back for the year 1983.
12:32 And I pulled out some old rating list and I looked.
12:33 It was something in the mid 30s.
12:34 35 or 36.
12:35 And then I looked at the average.
12:36 And I said, "Oh, I'm not sure.
12:37 I'm not sure.
12:38 I'm not sure."
12:39 And I said, "Well, I'm not sure.
12:40 I'm not sure."
12:41 And I said, "Well, I'm not sure.
12:42 I'm not sure."
12:43 And I said, "Well, I'm not sure.
12:44 I'm not sure."
12:46 And then I looked at the median age because there were two 45-year-olds or 47-year-olds
12:52 when I looked.
12:53 And so I checked the median age of the remaining eight.
12:56 And it was in the slightly low 20s.
13:00 I had never gone through the process.
13:04 Of course, you can see the list and see everyone's getting younger.
13:07 But when you actually see a number like that, you realize how young they are.
13:10 So are we going to get younger champions in the future?
13:12 It looks that way.
13:15 It looks that careers will happen faster.
13:18 They'll play more tournaments when you're playing and you'll go out faster.
13:22 But who knows what it will look like in 14 or 15 years.
13:26 So you said you relax.
13:29 The other sports that interest you is soccer and tennis, right?
13:33 And who is your favorite tennis player?
13:35 Well, I enjoy watching Federer, obviously.
13:39 Have I met him?
13:40 No, I've not met him.
13:41 No, I've not met him.
13:42 And you know, the Federer-Nadal rivalry was interesting in its own way.
13:48 You could frame it in chess terms in so many ways.
13:52 You know, the guy who's plotting out all the time, working for every point,
13:57 was the guy who's talented, plays with the flair.
14:01 Or the specialist was-- you could frame it in a number of ways.
14:05 Same thing, when you watch football, it's nice to see how
14:10 all these skills are evolving and how the team tries to get them together.
14:14 Things like that.
14:15 But, frankly, I don't sit and obsess about performance all the time.
14:20 Sometimes you just want to watch a good sporting match.
14:23 And are you still that strict with your training?
14:26 I never was.
14:28 I would say I'm predominantly with training,
14:30 but I've been eating fish now for 30 years.
14:36 And at some point when you're traveling,
14:38 you realize that you have to be a bit more flexible.
14:41 So I'm not a vegetarian, but--
14:44 I mean, at home, I'm mostly a vegetarian.
14:47 Being based in Europe, how did it change your lifestyle?
14:50 And how did it make it more convenient for the church?
14:54 Simply, the biggest difference it made was in terms of travel time.
14:59 Everything was a two-hour flight away instead of a 10-hour flight away.
15:02 Then, access.
15:06 Back in the day when the communications and computers
15:11 were not evolved to such a point,
15:13 I still needed to work with other people.
15:15 And when you're nearby, everything happens faster.
15:18 You call someone, he says, "Oh, I can't do Wednesday,
15:20 but I can come Thursday to Saturday."
15:23 And then you think, "Well, I can pop over for two days."
15:26 Everything works better when you're nearby.
15:29 And same thing for tournaments.
15:31 Of course, the big tournaments will invite you anyway,
15:33 but a lot of the small ones, the weekend one,
15:36 some things that are small there,
15:38 they're much more open to the idea if you're nearby.
15:41 And they kind of mentally rule you out if you're far away.
15:43 So it was very practical.
15:47 Besides that, we enjoyed living in Spain,
15:50 experiencing a different culture,
15:52 but I don't know that I changed very much.
15:57 Because you evolved.
15:59 Yeah, you have it.
16:01 You're still the Chennai boy.
16:04 Okay.
16:06 Thank you, Anand. Thanks a lot for having us.
16:08 Thank you so much.
16:09 [Music]