Jim Jackson, managing partner at Adaris Capital Partners, joined Forbes senior writer Jabari Young on The Enterprise Zone at Nasdaq MarketSite to discuss his real estate portfolio and life after playing in the NBA. In 1992, Jackson was drafted fourth overall by the Dallas Mavericks, where he played five seasons. He went on to make more than $30 million in his career, using some of the earned income to build a real estate portfolio.
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LifestyleTranscript
00:00Ask about this individual throughout Ohio and you will find nothing, and hear nothing, but great things.
00:06Smart, grounded, quiet but effective, and one hell of a basketball analyst talking business with former NBA guard Jim Jackson.
00:15You enter in your enterprise zone at the NASDAQ.
00:22Hello everyone, this is Jabari Young, Forbes senior writer here at the NASDAQ,
00:27and I'm joined by former NBA guard Jim Jackson.
00:30You might remember this guy, 1992 NBA draft, fourth overall pick with the Dallas Mavericks,
00:37Ohio State legend, now sports commentator, also in a real estate firm.
00:42Jim Jackson, man, thank you so much for joining the show.
00:44No, no, thank you for having me, I appreciate it.
00:46Thanks for the kind introduction.
00:47Now, you can go back through Ohio, I'm sure some people there might have something different to say.
00:51Nah, man, ain't gonna say nothing but good things about you.
00:53Nah, it's all good, I appreciate it.
00:55Yeah, is this your first time at the NASDAQ?
00:57A long time ago, early in my career, I came with a gentleman, and we were on the actual trading floor.
01:05Okay.
01:06So this was probably early 90s.
01:08Nice.
01:08When I came in, I was still young, kind of looking around.
01:11Yeah.
01:11Bright-eyed, starry-eyed, like, man, that's when you had papers, people writing down trades and everything like that.
01:17It's surreal, right, man?
01:18Well, it's different, you know, technology, of course, has changed how NASDAQ operates and the floor operates.
01:24Right.
01:25Back then, you saw movies before about how hectic it was.
01:28Now, I'm not saying it was that crazy, but you got a sense and feel of the people and the passion, sometimes overly passionate.
01:35That's right.
01:35But it was a good time to kind of feel it.
01:39Yeah, it's like that movie Boiler Room.
01:40Yeah.
01:41I was in the middle of it, man.
01:42I mean, it's like, when I first saw that movie, I'm like, man, I want to do that.
01:44You want to do that, right?
01:45Yeah, you want to do that, man.
01:46I don't know if you could do it from a stress level every day.
01:49No.
01:49You know, I knew why people kept a little cabinet and a little something.
01:53Yeah.
01:54Well, let's get it.
01:55You know, you had to calm down.
01:57You had to calm down.
01:58Hey, listen, you know, as we talk, you have two important months.
02:01One, Women's History Month, right, in March and in Financial Leadership.
02:04Let me get your take, Women's History Month.
02:06Game that individual, maybe in the business landscape, who has maybe had an impact on you as you built your business empire now.
02:13It's interesting because, from a man's perspective, we're shaped by a lot of women's and their emotions, their thoughts.
02:22My mother.
02:23Yeah.
02:24Simple.
02:25Secretary.
02:26Went to work.
02:27Yeah.
02:28Sandra.
02:28Yeah, Sandra Jackson.
02:31Vicki Lawshe, who was my mentor's wife in Toledo, Ohio.
02:38Linda Colt, another mentor's wife.
02:41Pete.
02:41Pete.
02:42So, the strong black men that I grew up with had strong black women.
02:47So, I got a chance to see it not just inside of my family, but from a day-to-day interaction.
02:52Yeah.
02:53Kind of who they were, what they did, and how they handled their business, how they raised their family.
02:57And, to me, they didn't have to be entrepreneurial successful to be successful.
03:02That's right.
03:02They were successful in what they did.
03:03So, they kind of showed me, kind of, when you eventually get to the point where you mature and get you a wife, exactly what a real woman is.
03:13Yeah.
03:13And I saw that growing up.
03:15Yeah, man.
03:15I mean, my aunt's is the same way, man.
03:17If they pulled me out of cook and clean.
03:19Exactly.
03:19And I have a daughter, I'm like, you know, it teaches you to love better when you have a girl.
03:23So, you got a boy?
03:24Do you have a girl?
03:24I have a girl.
03:24Okay, so, with the girl, do you, how do you, how old is she?
03:29She's 11.
03:30Yeah.
03:30Going on 18.
03:31Going on 18.
03:32Now she's about to get into the boy phase or anything like that.
03:34Yeah, yeah, yeah.
03:35One thing I found about being a father, I got a 32-year-old son, of course.
03:38Now I got a 6-year-old.
03:40But, what I've learned being an older father is the ability to listen.
03:46Yeah.
03:46Because, a lot of times, we, I'm 54, you go through a lot, you know a lot, got a lot of knowledge.
03:52The tendency is to over-teach your kid and not listen to what they're saying, where they're at.
03:57Now that I'm older, I listen.
03:59Yeah.
03:59Because my son tells me exactly where he's at, what he wants to do, how he wants to do it, his feelings, and I don't shut him down.
04:07And I've learned so much as an older parent now, to just sometimes I just have to listen to my child and what they're telling me.
04:15And then I can help them navigate whatever they're going through.
04:18Instead of me, no, you got to do this, you got to do this.
04:21So, it's interesting that you have a girl.
04:23That's a whole different animal.
04:24It is, man.
04:25You know, and it's funny you say that.
04:26Every single day, I try to read a book, you know, Daily Reflections of Highly Successful People.
04:31And it's like a paragraph.
04:32And every day, it has the date, and you read it.
04:34And one of the slots in there was talking about how, as a parent, just try to look at the world through your kid's eyes, through their lens, and then act off of that.
04:43And so, I find myself doing it like, man, I wonder what it is like for her to be in the fifth grade right now with all this technology, all this stuff.
04:50And then, you know, so you're seeing so much at an early age where, you know, I'll come up in the 90s.
04:55We didn't see it that much.
04:56It was in front of us, but we didn't have it all right there.
04:59You know, we had to search for it in the library.
05:01You know, former basketball player Antonio Daniels.
05:04Yeah, yeah, man.
05:05Okay, so one thing he said.
05:06Down in San Antonio, I covered him.
05:07Okay, so one thing he said was interesting.
05:08He said with his daughters, because he said, I don't talk to them and say, well, back in my day.
05:16Yeah.
05:16He said he didn't do that anymore.
05:18He said because when he talks to his daughters, he said, listen, Dad, you didn't have a cell phone.
05:21You didn't have Internet.
05:22That's right.
05:23So he says, I don't say that anymore because they can't relate to it.
05:26No.
05:27As much as I want to, you know, teach them, and my day was in the 70s.
05:31So I got to kind of meet them where they're at.
05:34That's right.
05:35And that's what you're saying with your daughter.
05:37Yeah, yeah, I got, I mean, I have to see the things that I have to ask her.
05:40Well, what do you think?
05:40Exactly.
05:41What are your thoughts on it?
05:42Still be the disciplinary when I have to, right?
05:44But, you know, you got to see things to their eyes, man.
05:46So I'll get you a take on Financial Literacy Month in April in a minute, but I'm glad that, you know, we opened up there, man.
05:51That connection with family and raising girls, I'm telling you, is definitely.
05:55Man, you're a six-year-old, is it a boy or a girl?
05:57Oh, it's a boy, okay.
05:58That means you.
05:58I thought it was going to be a girl, and I'm going through my head like, yeah, somebody upstairs got you.
06:05They always say, they tell you if it was a girl, you were a heartbreaker.
06:07But I thought about it from a different perspective because how it would be emotionally to raise a girl from that emotional side of being a man compared to my son.
06:18Yeah.
06:19Because it's, you know, totally two different dynamics.
06:21Yeah.
06:21I love my son, but I love him a lot different than, like, my niece I helped raise.
06:27It was a whole different thing.
06:28When she was out the house, I worried a lot more.
06:30That's right.
06:30Where she's at, who she's with, what her friend.
06:32With my son, I'm like, ah, he'll be all right.
06:34He'll figure it out.
06:35That's right, yeah.
06:35And I just imagined having a daughter and what that would be like.
06:39Yeah, man, listen, my uncle always taught me, you know, you're the first man that she's ever going to love.
06:43So make sure you set a good example.
06:45So I kind of live by that every day.
06:47But, right, man, before we talk business, you know, I got to get your take, you know, on some NBA stuff, right?
06:52Because the other night I was watching the Celtics and I was watching the Thunder game.
06:55Right.
06:56And, man, Shea Gillis, Alexander, I think that's my favorite player right now.
06:59I mean, that dude is just something.
07:01I love the fact of, I love the fact that he utilizes something that I think the NBA's forgotten about, and that's the mid-range.
07:07He utilizes the mid-range so well, and it's so smooth, and that's like a very good shot.
07:14People forgot all about it.
07:15Well, it's because analytics says that in the sport of basketball that it's not a high percentage shot.
07:20Because the way they look at it is like if you're shooting 35%, 38% from three, it's almost like you're shooting 50% from two.
07:28Yeah.
07:28And so it's either a three-point shot or a layup, but if you watch basketball, and they say it's a copycat league, right, but Golden State played different than Denver.
07:38Denver played different than Boston.
07:40Boston played.
07:40So even though we're in this three-point shooting world, our last three champions all had a different style of play.
07:47Denver didn't utilize the three-point line the way that Boston did or Golden State did.
07:51Yeah.
07:52But they figured out a way to win.
07:53The two-point shot, if you watch it, it either keeps you in the game, allows you to extend the lead, or you can come back when other teams miss.
08:03That's right.
08:04So you utilize that part of them.
08:06When Golden State played, I think it was Milwaukee, and Milwaukee won, the last two or three minutes was a lot of two-point shots.
08:11It wasn't threes.
08:12Yeah.
08:12And when Golden State was winning, too, a lot of it was layups.
08:16So, you know, it just depends.
08:18But Shea, you know the thing about Shea that I love, he's kind of like Jokic, and he's like Luka.
08:24They all don't rely on athleticism.
08:26No.
08:27And they –
08:28IQ.
08:28IQ, but you're not – the thing you can't do is speed them up because they play at their own pace.
08:33Absolutely.
08:33And he had a chance, which was the beautiful part with the Paul George trade from Paul going to Clippers and he going to OKC.
08:41He was able to go through those learning moments of how to close out games, how to be a leader by going through the process.
08:48Him being at the Clippers, let's see what a Kawhi and Paul – whatever.
08:52He wouldn't be able to be in those situations consistently to kind of see the player that we see today.
08:56Yeah.
08:56Yeah.
08:57Yeah.
08:57And that's what makes them special, man.
08:58Yeah.
08:58And they got a great team where everybody understands and plays their role.
09:04Yeah.
09:04Yeah.
09:05Yeah.
09:05Great assistant coach.
09:06Chip England's on that staff.
09:08Sam Presti from San Antonio running his show down there.
09:10But the one thing – and one thing I also felt like helped Shea Gillis and Alexander was when Chris Paul was there for that little bit of time.
09:17I thought Chris maybe showed him some leadership things.
09:19And I think Stephon Castle in San Antonio is going to be a beneficiary the same way.
09:23So will Wimby.
09:24Yeah.
09:24So will Wimby about how to be a pro.
09:26Absolutely.
09:26How to be a pro.
09:27That's what's missing in today's game.
09:28How to be a pro, man.
09:29That's on rosters.
09:30That's teaching these kids how to be pros, which is one of the reasons I think Houston is benefiting because they got guys, Jeff Green and staff down there, Fred Van Fleet.
09:37You have a mixture of pros.
09:39Absolutely.
09:40You're doing the same way.
09:41Tobias Harris, right?
09:42He's been around.
09:42Tim Hardaway Jr., you come in.
09:44100%.
09:44Big Beasley.
09:45You bring guys in the locker room that understand how to be a pro.
09:49Yeah.
09:50Because when you have a young team, young guys are going to do what young guys do.
09:53Now, you have some that are more mature than others.
09:56I think Cade Cunham was a more mature rookie coming in.
09:59But you still need a veteran presence that understands what it means to be a pro and go through some of the challenging ups and downs of the NBA.
10:08Because, you know, you come in with this idea that I'm going to help turn this team and program around immediately.
10:15Well, a lot of times it's a lot of moving parts with that and understanding how to navigate through a long season.
10:21Okay, how to take care of your body, how to practice, how to pull back, nights you don't want to play, nights that you're injured, things like that.
10:29But how to deal with expectations, too.
10:32Okay?
10:32How to deal with challenges of wins and losses, how to stay even-keeled, how to deal with the meat, all this kind of stuff.
10:39Some veterans, that's why you, Donis Haslam, was so, I think, integral to the success of Miami.
10:45Yes, he didn't play a lot, but he was a voice in the locker room where the coach didn't always have to come in.
10:50That's right.
10:50And kind of be the mediator.
10:52Yeah.
10:53And a lot of things that go on, you know, in the locker room.
10:55Yeah, I mean, Greg Popovich, you know, when I was covering the Spurs, he always kept vets like that.
10:59Andre Miller came late.
11:01Sue Butler, God bless his life.
11:02He wanted those guys around that understood how to do it because you had a whole bunch of young guys who were just looking up to them.
11:08And now that you know how to work and how to be a pro, man, I think it definitely rubs off.
11:11What's Jim Jackson like in business, man?
11:13Because I pulled up this article from the Toledo Blade back in 2004.
11:17And it was your friend, Pete Cope, who said,
11:20Jim doesn't try to be the smartest person in the world.
11:23So he knows how to recognize talent, coordinate talent, and he knows how to lead, right?
11:28That's what your longtime friend said about you in 2004.
11:31How do you lead and what do you like in business?
11:33Well, first of all, if I'm the smartest guy in the room, we got problems.
11:37No, it depends on the subject because we're talking basketball.
11:40Well, yeah, but yeah, I mean, it's all relative.
11:42And I say that is that you surround yourself with people that know the business or the business that you're going in a lot better.
11:50And you lean into that.
11:51Now, I do my research.
11:52I learn, I understand, especially from a real estate perspective.
11:55But I like to be in a room full of people that have a different skill set than mine that can complement.
12:01Yeah.
12:02And I think that's the important part.
12:03It's like building a team.
12:04And I think when you're in professional sports, especially a team sport, you get that.
12:10In an individual sport like golf and track and wrestling and boxing, you've got to depend on yourself.
12:14Even though you have a team that trains you, but when you go to perform, it's you.
12:18As a basketball player, I'm leaning into four, five, six, seven other guys to help me achieve success.
12:25And it's no different when you have, from a real estate or business-wise, why wouldn't you want the best around you that provide a different dynamic outlook,
12:34outlook, point of view to help you succeed, if you always want to command and be the guy, more than likely, you're going to trip up.
12:47And it's a great book called Good to Great.
12:50I love that book.
12:51Yeah.
12:51You know, get the right people on the bus.
12:53That's right.
12:53You know, no matter what direction you're going, if you've got the right people, you're going to figure it out.
12:57That's right.
12:58Yeah.
12:58And then using we, not I.
13:00Exactly.
13:00Yeah.
13:00A team.
13:01A team.
13:01It's a team.
13:02When did you officially retire, right?
13:03Because I know when you see the playing days stop, but when did you turn, 06, right?
13:06You turned in your papers over.
13:07I don't even know if I turned in papers.
13:10My agent might have done.
13:11I mean, I didn't have any fanfare going out.
13:13They didn't care if I retired or not.
13:14But see, that's why I love talking to guys like you, because your perspective is so amazing, man.
13:19I mean, listen, as we talk here, God bless his life, man.
13:22I mean, Junior Bridgman, you know, passed away.
13:24Oliver Miller just passed yesterday.
13:25Yeah.
13:26Former teammate of mine.
13:27It's those type of opportunities where I really appreciate talking to gents like yourself, man,
13:32because y'all been around, you have a history, and you just don't know when you're going to have those opportunities again.
13:36Bro, think about Junior.
13:37Junior was, and I got a chance to talk and meet Junior and understand his story from the days when he worked at Wendy's.
13:43He was the first minority.
13:45And Wendy's is a Columbus, Ohio-based company.
13:47So understanding his journey, no matter how much money he had, you can't die with it.
13:53No.
13:54And your mortality has to be tied to what have you done.
13:59And, again, legacies and how you leave it are different.
14:02I was talking to Spike Lee, and Spike said, my legacy, I want to leave it through my children, not what I've done.
14:07That's my legacy, my children.
14:10Okay?
14:11And everybody looks at it differently, and at the end of the day, when you think about it, I'm 54 years old.
14:16And how quickly life has passed by, you know, you're trying to accomplish all this stuff and accumulate all of this wealth or material.
14:25Then, at the end of the day, you can't take it with you.
14:27Yeah.
14:27You know, when it's all said and done, we've all got the same size casket.
14:33It's six feet, bro.
14:34Now, you may be in a mausoleum a little bit.
14:37The grave might be a little bit bigger, but the same thing.
14:40Yeah.
14:41And you ain't putting nothing in there.
14:42Look, Egyptians tried to take it with them, and it didn't work.
14:45Yeah.
14:45They tried to put all of the gold and the wealth and the items, and somebody, you know, grave robbers came in and got it.
14:54You know?
14:55They benefited more than anybody else.
14:58Absolutely.
14:58Yeah, man.
14:59So, 06, man, when you think about it, after you leave the game, what's been the biggest positive surprise, right?
15:05Because, you know, you leave the game, and you talk to ex-athletes all the time.
15:08And me and Antonio talk to ex-athletes, it's always been that, hey, I miss my guys.
15:14Like, I miss the camaraderie.
15:15They don't necessarily miss the day-to-day, but they miss the camaraderie.
15:18But the game, life is different.
15:20Like, if something happened, a medical emergency, you don't got the team, nobody can call you up.
15:25They're not getting that immediate reaction anymore.
15:27So, like, what's been the biggest positive surprise post-NBA life?
15:30Now, everybody's situation is different because some people handle, I don't care what sport it is,
15:35they handle retirement differently depending on how they go out.
15:38Now, and I'm going to preface it by saying like this, I would say 95, 96, 97% of athletes don't leave the game the way they want,
15:47meaning they're probably forced into retirement, i.e. injury, got too old, you don't have a team to go to.
15:54It's a select few people that are able to leave on their own reconnaissance and say, I'm ready to retire.
16:03You know what I mean?
16:03There's only a few.
16:05Kobe had a hard time retiring, no matter how much he accomplished.
16:08Peyton Manning had a hard time laying it down.
16:11Floyd Mayweather, no matter how much, he had a hard time saying, I quit.
16:15But they were able to leave on their own terms.
16:18When you don't leave on your own terms, it almost feels like you're leaving something on the table.
16:22Yeah.
16:22Even though you know it's time.
16:25And for me, I was ready to retire.
16:28I was ready to move on.
16:31To just find another challenge in my life.
16:34I played 14 years, probably could have played another three or four.
16:37But I struggled with, did I just want to be a guy that was there?
16:41I just, it was tough for me to do that.
16:45Yeah.
16:45Even though I know it could be, I was a great mentor to young players.
16:48I felt I still had a role to play, playing-wise.
16:53And I didn't want to be just a guy there, taking up a uniform.
16:57And the transition was great for me because I was already involved in business to that point.
17:02So I didn't have a down period where I was depressed or I was like, what am I going to do?
17:06Or what's my next step?
17:08I enjoyed my year off.
17:10And then fortunately, I went right into broadcasting in 2007.
17:13Yeah.
17:14So that smooth transition, was it positive and made you surprised that that was so positive?
17:18Or was it?
17:18No, no.
17:18I was ready.
17:19I had to start transitioning for my retirement probably subconsciously a long time ago.
17:26Yeah.
17:26When I got into business.
17:26Actually, when I tore my ankle up my third year, I'm like, man, this thing can be over
17:30with quick.
17:31Let me find another passion, another business, another something that once I'm done playing,
17:37I can transition into and not be in that in-between state.
17:41Because it's nothing like being in that in-between state as a former athlete.
17:44People don't understand this.
17:45Well, you got money, you got this.
17:47You should just be able to walk away and live your life and not be unhappy or depressed.
17:53For your whole life, whether it's football, baseball, basketball, whatever it may be,
17:57you're accustomed to a certain schedule.
17:59Summertime, you work out.
18:01Training camp comes.
18:02Season starts.
18:03You play through.
18:05And then take a little break and then rinse and repeat.
18:07Then all of a sudden, your career just stops.
18:10You're no longer playing.
18:12That ritual routine is no longer there.
18:16For a lot of people, that's difficult to transition to mentally.
18:21Okay?
18:22And it's just like losing your job if you're working at a factory for, or whatever, 30 years.
18:29Then all of a sudden, it's done.
18:30They come in and say, you're no longer wanted.
18:32What do you do now?
18:34What do you do now?
18:35You see what I'm saying?
18:36And a lot of people just lean on that you got money, you got this, and that the transition should be easy.
18:41But it's more mental, especially if you're not prepared for it, than it is the physical part.
18:46But fortunately for me, I was prepared mentally to move on.
18:51And I didn't have that transition period where I looked at it from a negative.
18:55I've enjoyed my year off.
18:57You know what I mean?
18:57Absolutely.
18:58Absolutely.
18:58Take me back, man, to that young Jim Jackson from Toledo, Ohio, right?
19:02I mean, your dad was a bus driver for the city of Toledo, right?
19:04I mean, your mom, a corporate secretary again.
19:06What's the biggest thing you learned from your parents?
19:09Shit, work ethic, bro.
19:10Work ethic.
19:10I mean, my father had a job all my life, even when I was playing in college.
19:16I worked at Dean Witter for two years, and I sold furniture at Value City Furniture my junior year before I went to the NBA.
19:22So I had a job.
19:24I mean, whether it was in the wintertime, shoveling, snowing, going to neighbors or going in around the neighborhood, breaking leaves.
19:31I worked at my old grade school in the basement, polishing floors, because I had to study for my SATs and ACT tests, car dealerships, washing cars.
19:43I did all of that.
19:44And my parents taught me that even though I was playing basketball, that, okay, that's cool, but you take care of your business, whether that's at home, you work.
19:56And then my father taught me, he said, once you get a paycheck, you're going to know the difference between what you want and what you need.
20:04You feel me?
20:06Because that check, you said, well, I've worked X amount of hours, I've made X amount of dollars, taxes come out.
20:12And then it's like, well, do I really want to go buy those shoes or do I need to save my money to get?
20:18And it just taught me a certain level of accountability.
20:22Yeah.
20:22Okay, they gave me enough leeway when I was younger to make some decisions, but I had to be accountable for my actions.
20:31And that's the biggest lesson I took was that they provided me, they gave me the tools of decision making, okay, and living with those decisions, too, when I made bad ones.
20:44And the consequences that come with it was the biggest lessons that I learned when I was younger.
20:49Yeah, most definitely, as you're going through your adulthood and you're understanding, look, I'm pretty good at basketball, what guy are you studying?
20:56Like, who's the player that maybe had the biggest impact on you that you stole his moves?
21:00Because, I mean, now, listen, I was trying to be Jordan, right?
21:03I realized, I realized I wasn't going to be Mike.
21:05You sure?
21:06Listen, man, I had a fadeaway down, right?
21:08I really did.
21:09But, you know, you realize I wasn't going to get there.
21:11But what about yourself, man?
21:12Who are you studying?
21:13It transitioned, though, because when I was younger, I was a big Dr. J fan.
21:16I finally got a chance early in my career to meet Doc, and now I have a great relationship with Doc.
21:22I can pick him up.
21:23Oh, gee, what's happening?
21:24Happy birthday.
21:25But it was Doc.
21:26Yeah.
21:26Then it transitioned to Magic because I was a big point guard in high school.
21:31So my freshman year, I started point guard.
21:33I'm basically the same size almost.
21:36Magic, and then, of course, it was Mike.
21:37And all three were uniquely different that all impacted the game differently from Julius, from the ABA to the NBA, what he brought.
21:46Magic being the first, really, outside of Oscar, big, big guard to do something different.
21:52And then there was this anomaly that swooped in called Jordan that kind of had all this other stuff going on.
21:58And it wasn't so much pattering the game.
22:00It was understanding how they played and how they impacted the game.
22:03And they all impacted the game differently.
22:05They impacted winning differently.
22:08And they all, you know, Doc was smooth.
22:12Magic had that big, bright smile.
22:15And Mike was just a killer.
22:16You see?
22:17And they all did it different ways.
22:19So those were the three that I really looked up to from a professional perspective.
22:25Like, that's called being a pro right now.
22:27Yeah, yeah, absolutely, man.
22:29And then you get here in 92, right?
22:30And you, again, no scrub, fourth overall pick, 1992, by the Mavericks.
22:37Again, you want to play 14 seasons, 12 teams, right?
22:39Houston, Atlanta, Miami, a part of it.
22:41Portland, up in Philly, right?
22:43And the Lakers.
22:44And people say, oh, 12 teams.
22:47I'm like, man, do you know what it's like to play 12 teams?
22:48That means your reputation had to have been golden.
22:51Because if it's not, you don't get to even see 12 teams.
22:54You don't even get a chance to sniff it.
22:56But here you are doing that.
22:57But the one thing that you got, you got a very interesting business lesson right away.
23:01Because I called up my OG, Dwayne Price, down in Dallas.
23:07And I said, man, I got Jim.
23:08He's still doing it.
23:09He's still doing it, man.
23:10At seven, he's still doing it.
23:11I said, man, I got Jim Jackson.
23:13He said, man, Jim Jackson.
23:15And I said, yeah.
23:15He said, man, I remember I went to Toledo, Ohio.
23:18And he held out on the Mavericks.
23:20And I went on his dad's bus.
23:22Come to find out he's on the bus.
23:23Anyway, he tells me about that holdout, man.
23:25And it's interesting.
23:26I went back and I looked at it, right?
23:27Here you are.
23:28You won, right?
23:29The offer that was made was $10.8 million.
23:31And you felt like that was underpaid.
23:33Because Shaq went before you.
23:34He signed $39.9 million, right?
23:36Charlotte Alonzo Mourning, he had $26 million.
23:39And then after that, Christian Leitner, $21 million, right?
23:42Exactly.
23:42And so you wanted some more money.
23:44Explain it.
23:45No, it was, at the time, it was market value.
23:47Yeah.
23:48Okay, I'm the fourth pick.
23:50Alonzo Mourning was the fifth pick.
23:51I wasn't going to ask more than the third pick, but I wouldn't take him less than the fifth.
23:55And the reasoning behind Dallas at the time was, we met with them.
23:59They had drafted Doug Smith before and Randy White.
24:02And in their mind, it didn't work out.
24:04And they didn't want to pay a guard.
24:05I'm like, listen, it ain't my fault.
24:08You don't want to pay a guard what the fourth pick is to trade the pick.
24:11But I'm not coming in for less than what I'm worth.
24:14Okay, so I had to go.
24:16At that time, people were like, what is he doing?
24:19Why is he holding out?
24:20I'm like, if I don't do the right deal today, it's going to come back to haunt me later on.
24:25And it will affect the fourth pick next year.
24:27Because it's market value.
24:28That's right.
24:28Which was Jamal Mashburn.
24:30That's right.
24:30So I had to take a stand at the time.
24:34And my agent, Mark Termini, laid out the groundwork and said, this is what's happening.
24:38You tell me which direction you want to go in.
24:41I said, I trust you, but I'm not selling for anything less.
24:45Now, I got labeled a certain way.
24:48It impacted, I think, short-term and long-term my career because I fought the NBA.
24:53Okay, actually, we were going to have a collusion lawsuit against the NBA because we found out
24:59that David Stern had talked to these owners and said, you need to stop paying these rookies
25:04these kind of contracts.
25:06You can't do that.
25:07It's collusion.
25:07So they would have to pay me double my contract or what I got offered in the trade so they
25:15finally came in.
25:17So we go to the press conference finally in February, March, whatever it was, and everybody's
25:22laughing and, oh, we're so glad we got this done.
25:25And I'm sitting there looking, thinking to myself, if I didn't have this lawsuit, I'd
25:28still be sitting at home in Columbus, Ohio.
25:30That's right, yeah.
25:30You know, so it taught me business, but also it taught me a lot about myself, okay, how
25:37to handle adversity.
25:38What did you learn about yourself?
25:39Because as much as I wanted to play, it was the principle of the situation, and it wasn't
25:44about, it was about the money, but it was about the principle, too, is that if you get
25:48over on me on this time here, I'm never, you're always going to get over on me.
25:52It's like if somebody is extorting you, right?
25:55You pay once, you have to pay again, okay?
25:57To me, I'm like, if you get over on me right now on my first deal, you got me.
26:03And it's the principle behind it.
26:05You chose the fourth pick.
26:07You knew what the market is.
26:08The market was already set.
26:10But you don't want to pay it because of some things, decisions you've made in the past.
26:14I'm supposed to sacrifice for it.
26:16Yeah.
26:16Not going to happen.
26:18Yeah.
26:18And that taught me so much about the business of basketball.
26:22When you have leverage, you have to use it.
26:25Because you don't have it for long, unless you're LeBron.
26:28Absolutely.
26:29Absolutely.
26:30That's right.
26:30That's true.
26:31That's true.
26:31But here, and then, you know, Dwayne also asked me, he said, man, ask him what it would
26:35have been had the three J's stuck together.
26:38Jamal Maspern, you mentioned, Jason Kidd, and yourself, right?
26:42Because I called even some scouts, right?
26:44Frank Bale.
26:45And they all say, you know, they would have been the Warriors before the Warriors because
26:48they had all of that talent.
26:49Jason Kidd running this show.
26:51Jamal Maspern would have been like Draymond.
26:52If y'all would have stuck together, do you think championship would have been in the
26:56future?
26:56Well, I don't know.
26:56Because there's so many variables in winning a championship.
26:59Talent doesn't always equate to a championship.
27:01But here's what people don't understand.
27:02And Dwayne should have told you this.
27:05Yes, we had our issues and challenges, three young bucks trying to figure it out.
27:09But we also, infrastructurally, weren't built right.
27:12So, the first, when I first got there, I was the first one, we already had an interim head
27:17coach.
27:18Donald Carter was the owner.
27:20Next year, they hired Quinn Buckner, first time coach.
27:23Jamal's first year.
27:25Next year, they sell the team.
27:27Okay?
27:27David McDavid buys the team.
27:30Jake Higg is drafted.
27:33Next year, they sell the team.
27:34Another coach.
27:35So, I had three owners, four coaches, and five years.
27:40No continuity.
27:40So, no continuity, no stability up front in the front office.
27:44So, how do you think the product is going to deal with all of the change?
27:49Because you don't have anything that's set in stone.
27:51So, yeah, as young guys, you needed direction.
27:53You needed stability.
27:55And we didn't have it as an organization.
27:58Hence, Jason, Jamal, and I never played 82 games together.
28:02People think that we were together.
28:03I got hurt 51 games until my third year.
28:06Jamal got hurt the next year.
28:07That fifth year, we all got traded.
28:11So, we never had a full season.
28:13People think that we were together four or five years and playing.
28:16No.
28:17So, we really never had a chance to develop into what could have been something special.
28:22Because of all of these moving parts.
28:24And when people tell the story, they only tell one side of it.
28:28Like, oh, they broke up because Tony Braxton.
28:30Man, quit playing.
28:31They ain't had nothing to do with it.
28:34You know what I mean?
28:35Nothing.
28:35But that's the sensational part.
28:37When you want to dig into the weeds on really what happened and why it didn't work.
28:43Infrastructure just wasn't set.
28:44Well, when you look at businesses, right?
28:46Maybe it's something that you want to buy.
28:47Is continuity a big thing?
28:49Like, you're looking at the guts of the organization and seeing management and is continuity a big thing?
28:53Oh, it is.
28:54Because if you have constant change, then you have fluctuation in that business model.
28:57The business model itself is going to suffer.
29:00Because it's going to trickle down to your bottom line.
29:02Yeah.
29:02That's like if you buy a stock.
29:05You know, you love the Fortune 500 companies because you know they're stable.
29:08Now, every now and then you go gamble a little bit, put a little something to the side and say,
29:13just a little bit more volatile stock.
29:15I'll look at it.
29:15And I'm okay with losing if it does.
29:18But if it pops, I'm good.
29:19But it's not going to break my portfolio.
29:21Okay?
29:21But that's a small part of it.
29:24But it's just like anything.
29:25You know this.
29:26You've been around it.
29:27You want stability.
29:28That doesn't mean that it's always going to be the best, but you know you're going to be okay.
29:35That's right.
29:35In the long run.
29:36Yeah.
29:37You know where everybody is.
29:38You know where everybody is.
29:39You know the personality.
29:39Exactly.
29:40You know that.
29:40Absolutely.
29:41Well, I mean, listen, staying in your portfolio, man, I know you have the real estate, the commercial real estate firm.
29:45What else is in there, man?
29:47What are you looking at?
29:47What else are you interested in?
29:48What else is going on?
29:49And I usually start the show at the top of it and ask you about a stock, right?
29:53I saw that.
29:53No, about a stock.
29:53I saw that.
29:54Yeah, right?
29:54I was going to ask you.
29:55We got so into the Women's History Month that I forgot all about it.
29:59But let me get that right for me right now as we're in this portfolio.
30:02Any stock in there that's done something for you well?
30:04I mean, you always go with the steady Microsoft's Apples and all that kind of stuff.
30:09Ethereum is one.
30:12Bitcoin, stuff like that, the production part of it.
30:15So you're into crypto?
30:15Yeah.
30:16Well, I'm into it.
30:17Like, you know, 2%, 3% of the portfolio may be in it.
30:20Just because you want to fight it all you want, okay?
30:24You want to fight it all you want, but it's going to happen.
30:26Yeah.
30:26I read a book 25 years ago, 30 years ago that talked about phasing out paper money, okay?
30:32Because that's where we're going from a globalization perspective.
30:35If you think about it, it went from credit cards to debit cards, and now everything's on your phone.
30:39Guess what?
30:39You don't use cash.
30:40That's right.
30:40Because during COVID, it actually accelerated the process of eliminating paper money because you didn't take cash anymore.
30:47So now, coming out of COVID, how many places do you go to that don't accept cash?
30:52Yeah.
30:52I mean, not too many, but I was at one one, and then when this machine broke, and I wish I had some cash on it.
30:57You wish I had some cash.
30:57Yeah.
30:57But you think about where we're going.
30:59Right.
30:59Because this one-world currency is what people want to get to.
31:03And the challenge with that is, and I always think about the Jetsons and stuff and what's happening back.
31:09You know, the Jetsons came out in the early 60s, okay?
31:11And think about all the technology, the walking, the moving walkway, the flying, the phone, the robot in the house.
31:17We're doing all that now.
31:18Yeah.
31:19Jetsons in the 60s, so somebody knew something.
31:21Yeah.
31:21Okay, but the biggest thing I look at is where are we going with that?
31:27Because if you have one world currency, you phase out paper money, click of a button, they want to shut down the system.
31:33You have paper money, it's not worth anything.
31:35That's right.
31:35So you start to barter.
31:36You go back to trading coffee, animals, horses, gold.
31:41Yeah.
31:42Because money is phased out.
31:44So I just look at things like that, man.
31:46I try to read a lot and try to understand the market, where it's going.
31:51I'm conservative by nature, so I don't take a lot of chances.
31:56But like I said, I'll play with some stuff like the Bitcoin and crypto.
31:59Yeah.
32:00Try to figure it out.
32:01Well, you're into land.
32:02I mean, you've always been that way since you was a kid.
32:05You can't build no more.
32:06You can't build.
32:06That's what you said.
32:07It's not going to make any more dirt, right?
32:08You've always said that.
32:09It's not going to make any more dirt.
32:09I mean, listen, commercial real estate right now, it was a tough market at first, but it looks like it's rebounding.
32:15What are you watching?
32:16What is working for you?
32:17Maybe something you had to kind of get rid of because it's not working for you?
32:20Well, from a commercial side, it's always tough because a lot of people figure it out through COVID, you don't have to be in the office.
32:24Right.
32:25But we're coming back, though.
32:26Yeah, you're coming back, but it's a smaller office space.
32:28Before, it was these companies that had all this huge, look, this is not a big space.
32:31Right.
32:31So the big companies had all this office floor to floor.
32:34They don't need it now.
32:36Now, it's shrunken.
32:37To me, multifamily is always a safe bet, and the reason why is because you've got first-time users, people in transition, short-term stays.
32:49So now if you have a good product and a good market at a great address, your occupancy is going to stay up 85%, 90%, and that's what you want.
32:59And it's less dependent upon the market with regards to interest rates because you're not mortgaging an apartment.
33:07Yeah.
33:07Okay?
33:07Once it's built, it's built.
33:09You just have to maintain and keep it up, stabilize the rents, and make it work and have great tenants.
33:15So to me, multifamily is, I think, a no-brainer because it's somewhere that's affordable market rate.
33:25So it's so much product that needs it, especially in a lot of these densely populated cities, even in some of the smaller cities that need new product.
33:34Young people want to live a certain way.
33:36Older people want to get out in a house.
33:39So I love multifamily.
33:40So if you're not, if you don't have a house, right, and listen, the market could be going through a correction, so it could be some opportunities, right?
33:45And you may be leaning toward a single-family house or a multi-unit, right?
33:49Do you maybe, are you advising someone, hey, go get that triplex because that.
33:53Yeah.
33:54I like that better just because once you have it, it's a lot easier to me to rent out that space than to sell when it's a down market because of interest rate of what you may lose.
34:05People are going to look for a place to live all the time.
34:10So with a rental unit, even though it's short-term stays a lot of times, you can be pretty secure that you're going to be, as long as it's taken care of, that you're going to be able to make money and rent that.
34:22Yeah.
34:22With the selling of a house, depending on the market, that house may be sitting on the market for six months to a year.
34:29And you're still paying that mortgage unless you own it outright, still paying taxes on that property, you know, while that house is on the market.
34:36So I tend to stay away from that.
34:39Single-family home?
34:40Yeah.
34:41Oh, yeah.
34:41And just look at, from a multifamily side, mixed-use side, things that I know you can sign a long-term contract with or a short-term contract knowing it would be leased out.
34:52Yeah.
34:52I had Don Peebles, man.
34:53We was down in Miami.
34:54We were talking to him.
34:55That's right, baby.
34:55Yeah, man.
34:56And he was giving me some cities that maybe people should look at, right, investments.
35:00And I know D.C. was one area.
35:02What's Jim Jackson's?
35:03Like, if you had to give me five cities where you're monitoring because there could be some interesting opportunities, where are you looking at?
35:08Well, Charlotte, Dallas, Houston, Columbus, Ohio.
35:13It's a great Midwest market.
35:14Yeah.
35:14For it's under 30, we'll be up in Columbus, Ohio.
35:16Oh, yeah.
35:16I mean, it's great because it's a white-collar market, highly educated.
35:20You have a lot of retail there, a lot of corporations now are in Columbus.
35:26The tax base is pretty good.
35:28The university is there in the state capitol.
35:30Yeah.
35:31It's a great market because you have great school systems, great education, cost of living is relative, and you can get in and out of Columbus.
35:40Yeah.
35:40And the way the MSA is, everything is included.
35:45So the MSA, whether you've got Reynoldsburg, Pickerington, Delaware, it's all kind of included in Columbus.
35:50So it's a great market if you're looking to kind of settle in, to own property, whether that's industrial, whether that's multifamily, whether that's mixed use.
36:04There's pockets still in Columbus that makes this like a Charlotte, you know?
36:07Yeah, absolutely.
36:08And you said Houston, too.
36:09That's one of my favorite cities, man.
36:10I love Houston.
36:11Well, Texas, period, too, just because of-
36:13No state Texas.
36:14No state Texas.
36:15Yeah.
36:15And I'm always a fan of Dallas.
36:19Always.
36:20Because that's where I laid my groundwork.
36:22That's where I learned business.
36:23That's where we had our restaurants.
36:24Yeah.
36:25So I'm always a Dallas.
36:27Yeah, Plano, Texas, man.
36:28That's where I want to go.
36:29Do you?
36:29Yeah, man.
36:30Plano or McKinney, but Plano is my area.
36:32Why Plano?
36:33Because my aunt lived up there, and Dwayne lives up there, too.
36:36And every time.
36:37Plano, you know, when I first got there, Plano was like-
36:40It was flat.
36:41No, it was far north.
36:42Yeah.
36:43Okay?
36:43Towway stopped where I was at.
36:45Now you're up in Frisco and all these other places.
36:49I mean, once you get up there, you don't even come back this way to Addison and Plano anymore.
36:53It's crazy how much it's grown, man.
36:54But it's an amazing place, man.
36:56It's quiet.
36:56It's nice, man.
36:57And again, the beautiful part about it is no state taxes.
37:01People don't understand how much I love that, man.
37:03No state taxes at all.
37:04I'm telling you.
37:05When I left Dallas and got traded to Jersey and got a check, it's all the taxes come on.
37:10I was like-
37:11Yeah.
37:11I live in Jersey now.
37:13That's a culture shock for me.
37:14I guess it is true about the-
37:15Oh, my God.
37:16Man.
37:17I live in L.A. now, bro.
37:18So trust me.
37:19Yeah, you pay.
37:20You pay.
37:20You pay.
37:20Well, you speak in L.A.
37:21I pay the sunshine tax.
37:23Yeah, well, is your house and everything else is good out there?
37:26Well, I got a condo.
37:26Okay.
37:27So fortunately, and again, here's the real estate part of it.
37:31I was five, ten minutes from Brentwood, so I could see the billowing of the smoke.
37:35Fortunately, the wind was blowing southwest and away from us.
37:40So I got affected by wind, lost power, but not like the Palisades and not like Altadena.
37:47Yeah.
37:48Imagine, Palisades is going to be rebuilt because the wealth and money is there.
37:54Altadena, this is a community that third, four, five-year generations people owned homes.
38:00A lot of their equity was in and their wealth was in the homes that got destroyed.
38:04And the toughest part is how do you rebuild that community, especially if your insurances don't take care of it.
38:12A lot of them were insured and they want to rebuild, but it's still a process.
38:15Yeah.
38:15What happens when your market value for your land is not equivalent to what it's going to cost to rebuild that house?
38:24Yeah.
38:24What happens then?
38:26So how lucky, how blessed we are that we didn't get touched, but you just got to feel for the people that have been displaced because of that and lost a lot.
38:38And the question is, can they all or will they want to rebuild?
38:41Yeah.
38:42And especially there because, I mean, they're going through insurance problems now.
38:44Like, no insurance company wants to set up shop there.
38:47So if you rebuild, you know, how do you get your house insured, man?
38:50It's very intense stuff.
38:52You know, listen, you have a lot of stuff as we wrap up here in your portfolio.
38:54I mean, you know, you go back deep in your Toledo days.
38:57I mean, I saw it was Jackson's Lounge and Grill.
39:00I don't know if you still have that.
39:01No, no.
39:01You sold it.
39:02We're on the property, though.
39:03Yeah.
39:03The car spa, you still have that one?
39:05We sold it.
39:05Sold it.
39:06That one.
39:06So, I mean, you know, you're in and out.
39:08Yeah, you're in and out.
39:08Right.
39:09And so I had Coco Gauff and she said that she wanted her business empire when she's all said and done.
39:14She wanted to be timeless, right?
39:16Jordan Childs, the Olympian, she said that she wanted her business, she wanted to be eternal, right?
39:22Eternity.
39:22She wanted the last.
39:23Yeah, yeah.
39:23What is Jim Jackson?
39:25It's all said and done, right?
39:26When we're all out of here, what do you want your business empire to be?
39:29One word.
39:33Impactful.
39:34Impactful.
39:34Why?
39:34And it's from this respect, because we're working on some stuff now in my own neighborhood.
39:37And for my kids and their kids, just does it touch and help, support, all that goes into impact, provide opportunity, whether that's physical, mental, economic, for people to say that I can do this too.
40:02You know, you know, that I, you know, small kid from Toledo, Ohio that wanted to do something different, made mistakes, but figured some things out too along the way and left something impactful back where people can touch, feel it, see it.
40:16You see what I'm saying?
40:18Absolutely.
40:18That's what's important to me.
40:20Most definitely, man.
40:21Look ahead, some fun stuff, man.
40:22Rapid reaction, right?
40:23Let's start with the million dollar question, right?
40:25I think I know how you made your first million.
40:26I didn't do it.
40:26I think we knew how to made your first million, right, in the NBA, right?
40:32How did you spend your first million?
40:33I got my mom near my house.
40:34Okay.
40:35I took care of myself.
40:36When I first saw that check, I was like, whoo, whoo, whoo, proud.
40:39You have to keep in mind, it took me a long time to see that check because I held out.
40:43That's right.
40:43That's right.
40:44Now, but what they don't understand, when I held out, I had my Nike money and my card money, so I was good.
40:49I was like, I'm holding out, but I ain't won for nothing.
40:52So I can hold out, but I got my mom near my house.
40:56That was the, mom, that was it.
40:59You know, that was the first thing I wanted to do.
41:01Yeah, so no regrets then.
41:02Of course not.
41:03Yeah, yeah.
41:04Are you impacted by tariffs all the time as we look?
41:06You know, that word is like a buzzword now.
41:08Well, we don't, I mean, how's it going to trickle down to goods and services that we get?
41:13That's right.
41:13That's the question.
41:14Yeah.
41:15We don't know yet, but, you know, when you impose a tariff on imports,
41:20does that hike up the price on what we're going to be paying for that specific item?
41:24Yes.
41:24Okay.
41:25The answer is yes.
41:26They go to your answer.
41:28Yeah, so you are, we all are.
41:29We all are.
41:29We're going to be affected somehow or somehow.
41:30Well, in your business portfolio, because then you have real estate, some materials.
41:33Oh, some materials.
41:34So we get affected by gas prices that go up because of transportation.
41:38Wow.
41:38Because now the transport goods and services to a location costs you.
41:44That's right.
41:44So it drives up the cost of, you know, that delivery of that particular item,
41:50whether that's wood, whether that's steel, whether that's glass, whatever it is,
41:53that all goes into the development cost.
41:56Yeah.
41:56Small stuff, man.
41:57Small stuff, man.
41:58Small stuff.
41:59Listen, one teammate or one player that maybe nobody talks about, but you know,
42:04was an effective teammate.
42:06He was a winner.
42:07He's a good person.
42:08And I always say that because, again, God bless Junior Brisbane's life.
42:10That's what he represented, a good teammate, a leader, a winner, and a good person
42:14and a hell of a businessman.
42:16Who would that individual be that no one talks about?
42:18I tell you what, I've been Jamal Mashburn.
42:20Jamal Mashburn.
42:21Yeah.
42:21You know, I've been trying to get him, man,
42:23because I know he had a whole bunch of Porsche dealerships at one point.
42:25He got so much going.
42:26And I'm so, his mom was educated right here in Harlem.
42:31His mom was an educator.
42:32He was quiet, never talked, but he came on my podcast and we were able to talk a lot.
42:37And I see Jamal and I know what he's doing, and I just, I wish we were together a lot longer
42:43so I can learn from him.
42:46But watching what he's done on and off the court, especially off the court, with his career,
42:51business-wise, how articulate he is, he goes and speaks, it's phenomenal.
42:55Yeah.
42:56You got to make that call for me, get him on the show, man.
42:57Yeah, you got to make that happen.
42:59Look around the world, man, right?
43:00Look around the world.
43:01What country do you invest in right now, right?
43:06That's you, that's, it's so much potential.
43:08Outside of the U.S., what country do you invest in right now?
43:14With this change of administration, man, it's tough, bro.
43:17Yeah.
43:17It is.
43:19See, I love Italy, but the economy is not stable.
43:22That's right.
43:23You know, that's the problem with, with, with Italy.
43:25I would say, um, a country.
43:28Or a continent.
43:31I would say, Africa.
43:34Africa.
43:35Yeah.
43:35Yeah.
43:35Everybody picks Africa.
43:36Well, it's just because of the potential.
43:39Now, it's, it's the stabilization part of it, though.
43:44You know, how stable is the government?
43:46And it's, and it's tough, because when you're not there, like, it's so, so much opportunity.
43:50That's what, you know, Chinese have invested heavily.
43:52Yeah.
43:53Infrastructurally.
43:53Infrastructurally and everything in Africa, because of the minerals and the natural resources
44:00that are there.
44:01Absolutely.
44:01Yeah.
44:01You know, they've been doing it for years.
44:03The British have been doing it for years.
44:05But instability of the government also lends itself to speculation.
44:11You know, but if I could really be safe and know, Africa would be it.
44:14Absolutely, man.
44:15No question about it.
44:16Yeah.
44:16I talk about that all the time, about going to invest.
44:19But as you say, you just, every country is different over there.
44:22Yes.
44:22The borders are different.
44:23The currency is different.
44:24Currency.
44:25Yeah.
44:25So I'm looking at 2063, maybe, to get all online.
44:27Is that what you would do?
44:29Yes.
44:29But again, I'm not there, so I will be nervous, because you hear about the transportation.
44:33You're not on the ground, right?
44:34Yeah.
44:34Like, even trucking, they get stopped every state.
44:36Every state.
44:37They've got to go through stuff.
44:37That holds up imports.
44:38It holds up services.
44:40And, you know.
44:40You know, I saw it even with a good friend of mine, rest his soul, Dikembe Mutombo.
44:44Yes.
44:44And he's from the Congo.
44:45And he's from there.
44:46And he just wanted to do a hospital to help his community and people get health care.
44:57How challenging that was for him just to do that.
45:01And he's from the Congo.
45:02He's putting in his own money.
45:04But he had to go through so much to get that done.
45:08And you would think that it's a no-brainer.
45:12The state doesn't have to pay for it.
45:14You know, the government doesn't have to pay for it.
45:16You may assist in it.
45:17But here's somebody that wants to give back and give health care.
45:20And the challenges that he had to go through to get that done, it blew me away.
45:25Yeah.
45:26And that's what we're talking about with regards to the instability there.
45:31Yeah.
45:31Yeah.
45:31Two more things, man.
45:32Get you out of here.
45:33The first is Forrest Be Okay, a great platform we have.
45:36And you've named enough books.
45:37So I'll go back to the financial literacy question, right?
45:39What's the biggest piece of money advice that you've had in your career you still use today
45:43that's worked?
45:45Biggest piece of advice.
45:47Young guys look at it differently, though, today.
45:49Yeah.
45:49Because they come in a little bit more educated.
45:51They understand that they are a business, so they want to invest and do things early.
45:55Where when I came in, it was, hey, focus on basketball.
45:58Focus on basketball.
46:00And the challenging thing is, too, is that with a money advisor, if you don't have the literacy
46:08on the money side, somebody can tell you anything because you don't know.
46:13But I would say invest a big part of your money up front and tuck it away.
46:21And not saying it doesn't work for you, but you always want to be able to have money tucked
46:25away.
46:25And if you want to go do some stuff, go do it.
46:27Enjoy it.
46:28Have some fun with it.
46:29But put a big portion of that money up.
46:32How much should a young guy today put up?
46:34If, let's say, he gets his contract, his rookie deal, I would say put up 70, 80% of
46:39it.
46:4070, 80%.
46:40Yeah.
46:41And this, from this perspective, depends on what kind of lifestyle you want.
46:44Because you can tuck that money away, they can earn interest, whatever it is.
46:47You can invest it.
46:48You can take a little part of it.
46:49Now, because they're going to get money from marketing, endorsements, whatever, that they
46:53can live off of.
46:54Yeah.
46:54Marshall Lynch was a prime example.
46:56He said, listen, I put my paycheck up and I lived off of my endorsements.
47:00Right.
47:00You know what I mean?
47:01A lot of these young guys can do that.
47:02They get the big contracts and have the endorsements.
47:05And a big part of what you're living could be allocated towards the NIL or NIL money that
47:12you already got in college, your marketing dollars.
47:15Utilize that money to kind of live your life.
47:18And over here, invest your main meat of your money into solid, whether that's businesses,
47:27whether that's real estate, whether that's in the stock market, to put it up and have
47:31it start to work for you.
47:33That's right.
47:33You know what I mean?
47:34And understand how to leverage and use money, not always use money.
47:38Yeah, absolutely.
47:39You know what I'm saying?
47:39The difference?
47:40Yeah, absolutely.
47:41Yes.
47:41Listen, we got to stop being credit card debt, right?
47:44People are already, countries right now, credit card debt.
47:46Stop using money that's not theirs, using money, understanding how to use it.
47:50Get you out of here on this, man.
47:51Good to great.
47:52You played 14 years in the NBA, right?
47:54I think you can understand how this works.
47:57But what's the difference between a good NBA guard and a great one?
48:02And you played against some of the greats, right?
48:03The AIs, the Colbys, the Jordans, man.
48:06I mean, you had your battles.
48:07It's a big gap.
48:08It is.
48:09And it's more so the mental part.
48:11Because it's a lot like Larry Bird wasn't the most athletic.
48:14But in between his ears, understanding how he saw the game, played at his own pace,
48:19could get to his spot, could get to his shots, and the ability to block out all the noise.
48:24See, because there's a lot of great players, a lot of very good players.
48:27But the ability to block out the noise and deal with, like Colby, to be able to,
48:32when he was going through his trial, to be able to block it out, come back and still score 40,
48:37knowing that your life is in peril over here, meaning something really bad can happen.
48:42A lot of players can't block that out.
48:43They can't block out, if something traumatic is going on in their life,
48:47to still be able to come and do their job, okay?
48:49When they're dealing with something that's negative over here, it impacts what they do on the court.
48:55The great ones are able to manage both and still be able to do their job over here
49:00while they're dealing with this over here.
49:02And that's the difference.
49:04Yeah.
49:05You know, that, to be able to compartmentalize that part and say,
49:09let me go do my job and do it to the best of my ability while I still have to deal with this over here,
49:15is something else, bro.
49:16And it's like a great team and a good team.
49:18It's just little things that separate.
49:21And how much are you committed to really working on your craft?
49:24That's right.
49:25Are you really willing to sacrifice certain things in order to put everything you can into your craft
49:34to be the best you can be?
49:36And that, a lot of times, separates the really great players from the good players.
49:39Yeah.
49:39Yeah, man.
49:40I mean, listen, the guys coming in nowadays, they have a lot to live up to,
49:43but getting to that level of greatness, it's a whole different part.
49:46But that's why it's only so many people that get there.
49:48And sometimes it's not really based upon overall talent.
49:53It's what you're willing to sacrifice and put in to help that talent come out.
49:59And sometimes your circumstance is going to dictate how great and what you do.
50:04You see what I'm saying?
50:05My circumstances where I got hurt, so now I wasn't the same player.
50:09I was moved around, so I never was able to reach, I think, my full potential as a player.
50:15I'm not saying that I'll be Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant,
50:17but I had a chance to be a really great player, maybe an all-star.
50:21But my circumstances dictated something different.
50:25And sometimes your circumstances, depending on injuries, are Grant Hill.
50:29That's right.
50:30Injuries.
50:31His circumstances prevented him from being probably the Grant Hill that we were starting to see
50:36that was going to be the next face of the league,
50:38to being a really good, solid NBA player,
50:43but not the great player that we thought he was going to be.
50:45Yeah.
50:45Because there was injuries.
50:46Yeah.
50:46Well, listen, you and Grant, two great businessmen.
50:49How about that?
50:49You know, I can't argue that.
50:51Hey, man, he got ownership in the heart.
50:52I want some of that stuff like that.
50:54I want friends like that, man.
50:57That bring me in and say, come on, man.
50:58Yeah, man.
50:59Get out of that business party, man.
51:01Jim, thank you so much for the time, man.
51:03You're probably my longest tenured guest here, man.
51:04But, you know, you can't stop a good conversation, man.
51:07I'm glad you had me, man.
51:08I appreciate it.
51:08Yeah, man.
51:09Shout out to Frank Ross, right?
51:10Yeah, man.
51:10Frank Ross, man.
51:11He set this up, man.
51:12I appreciate the time, Jim Jackson.
51:13Thank you so much.
51:15A look into Jim Jackson's portfolio.
51:17It's a very, very rare, rare look.
51:19A legend from Toledo, Ohio.
51:21See you next time.
51:22Thanks for watching.