The Congress Working Committee (CWC) convened in Ahmedabad to strategise the party's future direction and address internal organisational matters.
Category
🗞
NewsTranscript
00:00Good evening, you're watching To The Point, I'm Preeti Chaudhary, we've got two debates
00:04lined up for you, one coming in from Gujarat, where the Congress is meeting, it's AICC meet
00:11as well as CWC taking place, why Gujarat?
00:13All of that coming up.
00:14First up, allow me to take you through the headlines.
00:19Infighting explodes in TMC, top MPs Kalyan Banerjee attacks Mahua, calls her uncivilised,
00:24BJP releases WhatsApp chats.
00:29Anti-Waqf protest turns violent in Bengal's Murshidabad after cops stop protesters from
00:36blocking roads.
00:43Union government files caveat in Supreme Court over petitions challenging Waqf's amendment.
00:49Centre is seeking to ensure that no order is passed on petitions without hearing it's
00:55side.
00:56Moments of grenade attack on Punjab, BJP's Neta's home captured on camera, cops probe
01:03pro-Khalistan link to attack.
01:09Top court grabs Tamil Nadu Governor Aaryan Radhe, says cannot sit on pending bills, Supreme
01:14Court clears 10 pending bills, Stalin hails union.
01:23India today, in fact, Congress expels drunk driver Neta, Usman Khan had killed 3, axed
01:29by Congress now.
01:30Killer drunk driver was deputy district head of Congress.
01:37Markets open in green a day after Trump tariff rattled, Geest Kalal Street, Sensex nifty
01:42surge Jai Shankar dials US Secretary of State, India US hopeful of early trade pact.
01:53After 64 years, the Congress party returns to Gujarat to hold AICC session.
02:03The All India Congress Committee session in Ahmedabad is the party's sixth in the state
02:08and the second post-independence.
02:11It will also be the Congress's third session.
02:17Over 170 Congress members to congregate in a state that the Congress hasn't won for the
02:23last 30 years.
02:26The session also marks 100 years of Mahatma Gandhi's presidency of the party, where 100
02:31years ago, he became president of the party in Gujarat itself.
02:37It also marks 150th birth anniversary of Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel, both Gandhi and Patel congressman.
02:47The CWC also to meet and deliberate.
03:17The core of Ahmedabad deliberations will be to chart the road ahead, how to recover
03:22from the recent electoral losses, centralization of organizational power, alliance management,
03:30enhanced public outreach, all expected to be key components of the resolutions debated
03:37and adopted.
03:40Sources confirm that the party leadership is actively considering a more defined and
03:46elevated role for Priyanka Gandhi.
03:52The two-day session being seen as a reset moment.
03:56The location of the meet, Gujarat, is not lost on anyone.
04:00It gains symbolic and political weight as it takes place in Prime Minister Modi's home
04:06state.
04:07An intent to chart a roadmap to reclaim political ground in Gujarat by 2027.
04:15Rahul Gandhi, in a speech in Parliament last year, declared that the India bloc would defeat
04:21the BJP in Gujarat.
04:24However, post that speech, the Congress has gone on to lose three state elections, abysmal
04:40performance in local body and panchayat polls in Gujarat, where on many posts the Aam Aadmi
04:47Party has replaced the Congress.
04:51The intent of the Congress to reboot from the Prime Minister's backyard.
04:59The intent of the message is clear.
05:04But the question though is, can sheer intent be enough?
05:10What is it that the Congress will do differently this time?
05:15Top focus on To The Point this evening.
05:19All right, so, you know, one of the reasons that the Congress has picked the state of
05:27Gujarat to go back for an AICC session after 64 years, it's a state that the Congress hasn't
05:33won for 30 years, is loaded, viewers, with political symbolism.
05:37The reasons now, why the Congress has decided to pick Gujarat for this particular meeting.
05:45Let's get you the graphics, symbolic political weight as home state of Prime Minister, a
05:52clear messaging there.
05:58Out of power in Gujarat for 30 years, the Congress needs to leave a message.
06:07First time in 64 years that the meet is being held in the state of Gujarat.
06:14We chart primarily a roadmap for Gujarat 2027 elections.
06:21Congress attempts to make Gujarat an ideological battleground and that is one of the main reasons
06:27why the Congress party has picked the state of Gujarat.
06:31Of the whole ideology that Rahul Gandhi speaks of, RSS against the Gandhian Congress, well,
06:39taking it in from the state of Gujarat.
06:41Of course, the CWC eyeing a revival plan might act as a morale booster as well.
06:47Meanwhile, the big questions that we are asking this evening, is Congress trying to make Gujarat
06:54the next ideological battleground?
06:57That's the big question that we're asking.
06:59Is Rahul Gandhi making Gujarat a prestige battle?
07:05Is it even possible for Congress to challenge BJP's Gujarat model?
07:10Is Priyanka Gandhi set to get bigger role in Congress?
07:15All right, let's take these questions to our guests this evening.
07:18Sanju Verma, National Spokesperson, BJP.
07:21Charan Singh Sapra, National Spokesperson, Congress.
07:24Deepal Trivedi, Founder, Vibes of India.
07:26Ajay Umat, Senior Journalist.
07:29I want to begin with Sanju Verma, each of our political panelists will get two minutes
07:34each.
07:35Your time begins now, Sanju Verma, because at least it seems that the Congress party
07:40has picked Gujarat.
07:41What many would suggest is their reset moment.
07:44There's multiple, you know, points that the Congress has worked on in the last seven months.
07:50There's no other place that Rahul Gandhi has visited more than the Congress.
07:532017, they came very close.
07:552022 was a washout for the Congress.
07:58But more than all of that, the big question, Sanju Verma, is that will the Congress be
08:03able to make Gujarat the ideological battleground where the Gandhian ideology of the Congress
08:10versus the RSS ideology of the BJP?
08:13You know, Preeti, first and foremost, let's get one thing very clear.
08:18There's this famous adage, you know, which says that the worst thing that you can do
08:24to a bad product is to not take it off the shelf.
08:27You keep marketing it, keep repackaging it, keep rejuvenating it in the desperate hope
08:33that it will sell, but it will not.
08:36In this case, the product is faulty and the leader is faulty as well.
08:40Of course, I'm talking of Rahul Gandhi and the product in this case is a debilitated
08:44Congress party.
08:45Let's get one thing very clear.
08:47You are as good as your organizational strength.
08:51Organization is the backbone for any political party.
08:54Now, forget about Hardik Patel and Alpesh Thakur, very known names, but these are some
09:00other heavyweights who left the Gujarat Congress in the last couple of years.
09:04Former Union Minister Narendra Modi, Jawahar Chawla, Chirag Patel, Arvind Ladani, Ambarish
09:11Der, Arjun Modwadia.
09:13Arjun Modwadia in particular, the man who represented Porbandar for the longest time
09:18and finally left saying that Rahul Gandhi has zero vision.
09:22The other very interesting thing that your audience needs to know is this.
09:26Any party can win provided it has the ability to translate vote share into winnable seats.
09:34Now, look at assembly elections in 2022.
09:39The BJP had a vote share of 52.5%.
09:42The Congress had a vote share of 27.28%.
09:45The BJP won 156 seats, the best that any party has ever won in Gujarat.
09:51And the Congress was reduced to a measly 117 seats.
09:55But it does not stop there, Preeti.
09:57The BJP polled 1.67 crore votes in 2022 Gujarat assembly elections.
10:03The Congress polled just 86 lakh votes.
10:07A huge difference of 81 lakh votes between the BJP and the Congress in the Gujarat 2022 polls.
10:15How will they bridge that yawning divide?
10:22Charan Singh Sapra, many would suggest being audacious is one thing, being foolhardy is another.
10:27To make statements on the floor of the House saying, watch us, we're going to win 27.
10:32Subsequently after that, go on to lose three state elections as well,
10:36as do abysmally where local body elections are concerned.
10:39And then now to go back to Gujarat and make it seem that you're creating a new ideological battleground.
10:46Of course, Preeti, we are creating an ideological battle.
10:50The battle Congress is fighting against BJP has always been an ideological battle.
10:55And why we are starting from Gujarat.
10:59Let me also remind you that Mr. Khargay as well as Rahul Gandhi,
11:03they both have declared that year 2025 is going to be the year
11:07where we are going to revamp or reorganize the entire organization.
11:11We are going to create a framework where a new system will be installed
11:16and everything will go in a dynamic way.
11:19And our organization, if it improves right from Delhi to Delhi,
11:24we will definitely be able to defeat Bharatiya Janata Party.
11:28Now why we are starting from Gujarat?
11:30Because this is Gujarat from where Mahatma Gandhi had started his freedom struggle.
11:37And Gujarat has given us three Congress presidents,
11:41Dadabhai Naoroji, Mahatma Gandhi and Sardar Vallabhai Patel.
11:45Whatever BJP might say, but there is a legacy of Congress Party in Gujarat.
11:51There was a dandy march of Mahatma Gandhi.
11:54There was the Bardoli agitation of Sardar Vallabhai Patel.
11:58There were so many other agitations which started during the freedom struggle from Gujarat
12:03and that became a national issue.
12:05That's what Congress Party is doing.
12:07We are trying to energize the workers of Gujarat.
12:11As well, we are trying to energize and organize the workers in the entire country.
12:16Let me also remind you that three days ago,
12:19Mahatma Gandhi and Khargeji, they took a meeting of district presidents.
12:22Three different days, district presidents of the entire country had come to Delhi.
12:26We are formulating a new pattern.
12:29That new pattern is going to be implemented.
12:31What does BJP have to do with that?
12:34We have decided and we have declared that we are going to reorganize our organization.
12:38So we are doing that.
12:39We are going to fight this ideological battle which starts from Gujarat.
12:43Because Gujarat, Sardar Vallabhai Patel,
12:47Mahatma Gandhi, Dadabhai Navroji had created a history for Congress,
12:51which we are going to repeat it again.
12:53Alright, your time's up, sir.
12:55I want to cut across to both Ajay Unmath and Deepal Trivedi.
12:58Deepal Trivedi, founder of Vibes of India, political analyst as well,
13:01and senior journalist, Ajay Unmath.
13:03Mr. Unmath, if we just put out what the results in terms of vote share and seat share were,
13:08ever since you had 2017, you had 2022,
13:13the closest that the Congress has ever come was in the year 2017.
13:162022 was a complete washout.
13:18One of the spoilers there was also the Aam Aadmi Party.
13:21What do you think is the significance of all of that,
13:24and plus Rahul Gandhi's concerted attempts to keep invoking Gujarat,
13:28be it in the Parliament or outside,
13:30and also making at least, you know, in the last one year,
13:33of all the states that he has visited, Gujarat is right on top.
13:38I think that, you know, not only number of visits,
13:44but of late I am observing since last six months that, you know,
13:47Gujarat is on the priority list of Rahul Gandhi,
13:52and I was listening to this Congress spokesperson,
13:55I want to ask her one thing, that, you know,
13:58why BJP is taking so many Congress leaders into their party?
14:02That means that, you know, BJP is the single largest party,
14:06they are having more than 52% vote share in Gujarat,
14:09and they have different characteristics and faces,
14:13and why they are poaching the leaders from Congress party?
14:16The fact that, you know, Congress party is,
14:19that, you know, Kshatriya, Dalit, Adivasi and Muslim,
14:22that Kham theory, BJP wants to disrupt it with their Hindutva ideology.
14:27So this time I think that, you know, Rahul Gandhi has made a roadmap.
14:32He was here before one month, and before one month,
14:35they had done a lot of, you know, brainstorming sessions,
14:38and now they are focusing on urban areas, they are focusing on tribal areas,
14:42they have decided to revive that, you know,
14:45all the Madhav Se Solanki and Jinnah Bhai Dharji's
14:49caste combination theory, and that's the reason that,
14:52you know, this time they are asking that, you know,
14:55census should take place, they are also focusing on delimitation,
14:58they are asking for unemployment, and lot of issues related to Gujarat,
15:02and that's the reason, you know, they are talking about Gandhi ji
15:05and Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel today in Gujarat.
15:08The point I am making is that this time, Rahul Gandhi,
15:11last meeting also, he said that, you know, in 2022, yes,
15:15of course, Aam Aadmi Party was a spoiler, but in 2017,
15:19BJP and Congress, they were, you know, almost, it was a
15:22photo finish-like situation in Gujarat, and Congress
15:25really did very well after a long time.
15:27In 2014, everybody wanted to vote for Narendra Modi in Gujarat,
15:32because, you know, they were saying that son of the soil
15:36is becoming Prime Minister of India.
15:38So, obviously, that was, but, of late, I am observing that
15:42since last six months, Rahul Gandhi is working very hard,
15:45and he has challenged Bhartiyanka Party to pick up the gauntlet,
15:51and I think it would be very interesting battle in Gujarat,
15:54the way they have started, the way they have started from Gujarat this time.
16:00Okay, I'll come back to you, I want to bring in Deepal Trivedi
16:02into this conversation as well.
16:04You know, Mr. Vedhi, you've watched Gujarat very, very keenly,
16:08you know, over decades now.
16:10It's very interesting what's happening in the current context,
16:12why the Congress has decided to go back to Gujarat.
16:15And I would think, over and above everything else,
16:17is the fact that Congress has picked Gujarat as the new ideological
16:21battleground, but will it help?
16:23Because for 30 years, you know, Congress hasn't come to power in Gujarat,
16:27the closest it got was in 2017, however, you know,
16:31urban centers like Surat Saif, the BJP,
16:332022 was a washout with 156 seats to the BJP.
16:37What is the Congress doing differently this time?
16:40Or is it just, you know, once again, you know,
16:43trying to put up a facade and not coming through?
16:47Thank you, Preeti.
16:48As you rightly pointed out, that the Congress has decided to make
16:52Gujarat its battle, the epicenter for its ideological battle
16:58for the next general elections.
17:01And I think it is not just very meaningful,
17:05it has a lot of value to this.
17:09Because not all battles are fought just to be won,
17:13someone has to be on the battlefield.
17:16All across these last three decades,
17:19when we have been witnessing the BJP growth,
17:22and I would say, you know,
17:24unpredictable and unprecedented growth and success in Gujarat,
17:29what has happened is that,
17:32that in Gujarat, people have got distant from Congress.
17:38There have been generations who have not seen Congress.
17:41This is for the first time that Congress is trying to regain
17:45its lost ground and it is doing it in a very meaningful manner.
17:50The present CWC meeting and the AICC session in Gujarat
17:55is very ideological.
17:57And as I have repeated in the past also,
18:00that if the BJP growth in 1984,
18:04when the BJP won first two seats,
18:07first two Lok Sabha seats in India,
18:09one was from Gujarat.
18:11Gujarat is BJP's model state.
18:14The beginning of the BJP began from Gujarat
18:17and even the decline of the BJP,
18:20like organically, that is the rule of the nature.
18:24The circle has to get completed.
18:27So Gujarat is a very symbolic choice
18:30for a new ideological battle that the Congress has initiated.
18:34I'm going to come back on why do you think it's different this time around,
18:37but I will go back to Sanju Verma and Charan Singh Sapra
18:40and I would request the both of you,
18:42we are having a bit of a trouble with our clock.
18:44Sanju Verma, please respect the time,
18:46as well as Charan Singh Sapra, we can't play the clock right now,
18:49but I will time you both on my phone
18:51and I would hope that you would agree to that.
18:54But Sanju Verma, coming back,
18:57there is a certain amount of sense which both the journalist
19:00and the political analyst also came in with.
19:02Number one, Sanju Verma, where they seem to suggest that
19:05A, they're doing it differently this time,
19:08to focus on Gujarat concertedly,
19:11because Gujarat elections are not in the next six months,
19:14they're in 2027, it's a while away.
19:17So the Congress, Rahul Gandhi, in the last six months,
19:20some wizards have happened, not to Bihar, but to Gujarat.
19:23Do you see somewhere down the line, it's a prestige battle, Sanju Verma?
19:26The last time around, Rahul Gandhi spent 60 days yatra,
19:29and I'm sure Ajay Unmat will come through on that,
19:32in 2017, the Congress came in kissing distance
19:36until and unless the urban centers like Surat saved you.
19:40You know, Preeti, first and foremost, let me make one thing very clear
19:43and I hope you will not heckle me.
19:46You know, I'm surprised you have two journalists
19:50and both of them are waxing eloquent about the Congress party.
19:53So basically, it is one versus three.
19:56This is not BJP versus Congress.
19:59Deepak Trivedi can find nothing wrong with the Congress.
20:02Ajay Unmat can find nothing wrong with the Congress.
20:05You know, these are the kind of journalists who have actually ensured
20:08that the Congress is consigned to the dustbin of history.
20:11As long as there are journalists like these,
20:14Rahul Gandhi will have nothing.
20:17Now, let me come straight to the point.
20:20Get this very loud and clear, Preeti.
20:23BJP, as J.P. Nadda rightfully said,
20:26is the only national party
20:29which has a worker, a process,
20:32and most importantly,
20:35we are the only party with an ideology.
20:38What is Rahul Gandhi's ideology?
20:41I don't like Narendra Modi.
20:44What is Sonia Gandhi's ideology?
20:47I don't like either Narendra Modi or Amit Shah.
20:50What is the Congress party's ideology?
20:53Merit is a flawed concept.
20:56Rahul Gandhi talks on domestic soil
20:59when he goes abroad on foreign soil.
21:02He says, what is the need for reservation?
21:05Congress's ideology had duplicity.
21:08Congress's ideology had hypocrisy.
21:12Every journalist, and I don't mean you, Preeti,
21:15had said, they changed Vijay Rupani as Chief Minister
21:18less than one year before the 2022 assembly elections.
21:21This time, BJP will be wiped out.
21:24I mean, look what happened.
21:27Nobody had heard of Bhupendra Bhai Patel
21:30and the BJP recorded a stellar victory.
21:33Let me tell you what Hardik Patel said.
21:36He said, this is Congress's problem in Gujarat.
21:39We will travel 400 km to meet the workers.
21:42But nobody comes 40 km to meet the workers.
21:45That is the condition of a devil-taker Congress.
21:48Okay, ma'am, your time is up. Your two minutes is up.
21:51Ma'am, your two minutes is up.
21:54I want to bring in Charan Singh Sapra into this conversation.
21:57And before that, I just request all our panelists,
22:00let's not make any personal attacks.
22:03There's no point doing that. Everyone's entitled to an opinion.
22:06That's my humble submission. I want to bring in Charan Singh Sapra into this conversation.
22:09Charan Singh Sapra, your two minutes begin now
22:12because it's alright to posture
22:15but actually coming good on that is a different thing.
22:18And the question, you know, why I raised that is, Charan Singh Sapra,
22:21look at, and we'll put out the figures there,
22:24look at the results of the local body elections
22:27after even a Rahul Gandhi makes that claim
22:30on the floor of the parliament saying, watch us in 27,
22:33we will win Gujarat in front of you.
22:36In local body elections, the Aam Aadmi Party
22:39has A, taken the place, the BSP has done better
22:42of many posts where Congress was there.
22:45The Congress has fared abysmally. We'll play those graphics out right now.
22:48Your two minutes, Charan Singh Sapra, start now.
22:51We are not playing the clock. Go ahead.
22:54See, Preeti, I told you earlier also that Congress Party
22:57is in a process of revamping the organization
23:00Now, what is the motto of this
23:03adivation which we are having today and tomorrow?
23:06I'm also in Ahmedabad. The motto which we are sending
23:09to the workers is sankalp, samarpan
23:12and sangharsh. Sangharsh, I hope
23:15you understand and your viewers will also understand
23:18ki humko sangharsh karna hai. Hamara samay hai ki humko sangharsh
23:21karke jo Mahatma Gandhi ji ke ideals, the ideals of Mahatma Gandhi
23:24and Sardar Vallabhai Patel, that needs to be
23:27taken into the people. That needs to be
23:30taken to the grassroots. Sardar Vallabhai Patel and Mahatma Gandhi
23:33and Dadabhai Naoroji, they were never communal.
23:36Their ideals were secular. The secular credentials
23:39were there. Whereas, what is BJP or RSS?
23:42Complete communalism. Sardar Vallabhai Patel
23:45or Dadabhai Naoroji or Mahatma Gandhi, they were
23:48never having a divisive agenda. They never did hate politics.
23:51But what is BJP and RSS doing? Hate politics
23:54and divisive agenda is the main plank of BJP.
23:57That is how they are able to, you know, do that
24:0080-20, shamshaan, kabristan, everything and
24:03do a counter-polarisation in favour of BJP.
24:06So, we are going to the grassroots through our workers. We are trying
24:09to channelise our ideology. We are
24:12trying to channelise how it has to be taken to the grassroots
24:15and make the youngsters understand that this is what
24:18Congress Party wants. Congress Party wants a secular India
24:21and what does BJP want? And finally, we also
24:24would like to take so many things which, you know, Sardar Vallabhai Patel
24:27he was against RSS. He had written to
24:30Shyama Prasad Mukherjee. He had banned RSS
24:33after Mahatma Gandhi's assassination. Sardar Vallabhai Patel
24:36was never in favour of RSS. And when the airport was being
24:39named the Ahmedabad Airport, it was BJP
24:42who protested and said that this should be given in the name of Shyama Prasad Mukherjee.
24:45Sir, your time is up. Your two minutes is up.
24:48Your two minutes is up. Your fader is going to go down. I want to bring in
24:51Deepal Trivedi and Ajay Unmat back into this conversation. Sanju Varma
24:54I just want to tell you one thing. Ajay Unmat was one of the very few journalists
24:57who in 2022 had said that the BJP
25:00is going to come very good in this election
25:03and the Congress really doesn't stand a chance. But
25:06one of the very few who predicted a landslide win for the BJP.
25:09But I just know because all I'm saying
25:12is all I'm saying Sanju Varma right now is please
25:15for everyone. Please respect everybody that there is
25:18on our panel and I would really appreciate it.
25:21Ma'am it's not an argument. I want to bring in
25:24please can I get all faders down and Ajay Unmat in. Ajay Unmat
25:27the fact is, what is it that the Congress is doing
25:30right right now? Because if you look at even local
25:33body polls, look how badly the Congress has done even in
25:36panchayat polls, number one. Number two, it's not that
25:39the Aam Aadmi Party is getting out of Gujarat.
25:42The sheer fact that they only had five MLAs
25:45they've been able to maintain that. You never
25:48know how the Aam Aadmi Party performs but it's all not smooth sailing
25:51for the Congress. Definitely.
25:54I have only one suggestion to
25:57my BJP spokesperson that you know internet does not
26:00give you right to be forgotten. So you just please go
26:03and check my predictions about 2022
26:06election, 2024 elections and I have said
26:09in 2022 that BJP will come with
26:12thumping majority and they will break the record of Madhavsi Solanki
26:15Please don't try to suit the messenger. I am simply
26:18saying what Congress Party is doing in Gujarat and what is their
26:21strategy. I am not here as Congress spokesperson. That job
26:24Congress spokesperson will do. My simply submission
26:27and my simply I was just talking on the strategy of Congress Party
26:30and this time you know what Congress Party, Congress Party has
26:33realized their mistakes and Preeti as you rightly said that you know
26:36since last six months Rahul Gandhi is visiting here
26:39they have done a lot of assessment ground level. They have appointed a committee
26:42under the leadership of a Dalit
26:45leader in Maharashtra and they could identify that you know
26:48who are traitors in the Congress political party
26:51and they have decided that this time they will not
26:54sideline them. They will be eliminated and in a
26:57maybe in a week's time or maybe in a month's time
27:00there will be organizational changes
27:03in Congress Party in Gujarat. Their strategy this time
27:06is to focus on urban center because last time
27:09in election in 2022 and in 2027
27:12also if you see BJP gained
27:15heavily in Ahmedabad 22 out of 23
27:18in Baroda all 9 out of 9
27:21in Surat all 21 out of 21
27:24in Rajkot 6 out of 6 in Jamnagar
27:27Bhavnagar all 100% strike rate. BJP
27:31did very well in urban areas whereas you know Congress Party
27:34has done very good in tribal areas and in
27:37some of the pockets in Saurashtra and North Gujarat
27:40so this time their strategy is that you know they should work hard
27:43in South Gujarat as well as urban area
27:46so this is their strategy and my point is that you know
27:49what Congress is planning this time how
27:52Rahul Gandhi has challenged BJP and they think that
27:55you know despite having an anti-establishment sentiment
27:58of 30 years why Congress Party
28:01is not back in power. Congress Party
28:04had a very dismal performance in Panchayat election
28:07in Lodh Sabha election and in Assembly election
28:10having said this all political parties
28:13has a you know strategy
28:16that how they can revamp their plan
28:19so we are simply a messenger and we are telling what is happening
28:22Don't shoot the messenger. Ajay Unmar who studies the ground
28:25Don't shoot the messenger. You might disagree with him but like I said
28:28Sanju Verma that he was one of the very few journalists who predicted
28:31a complete decimation of the Congress
28:34where 22 was concerned
28:37But ma'am you know the deal is
28:40he is not making sense to you
28:43but that does not give you the license
28:46to berate him
28:49Alright ma'am but at least not on my show ma'am
28:52Don't shoot the messenger. Anyway being a journalist is a tough job
28:55Don't shoot the messenger. I just want to bring in
28:58Can I get all faders down? I don't want to argue ma'am
29:01Humble submission. I just want to bring in
29:04Deepal Trivedi into this conversation. Deepal Trivedi the fact is
29:07What is it that the Congress needs to do
29:10where it goes beyond the lip service of making
29:13Gujarat the ideological battleground. It's losing
29:16you know it's base where it comes down to the tribals
29:19where even the OBCs is concerned. You could see that
29:22the Aam Aadmi Party made quite a bit of gains where the tribals
29:25were concerned in the last election in 2022
29:28You have lots of leaders of the Congress
29:31which are now skipping ship and going to the BJP
29:34Number two there is a
29:37you know a sense at least where the voters are
29:40that the leaders of the Congress are corrupt
29:43All of that. How is the Congress looking to deal with it
29:46because it would need to do everything differently
29:49if it needs to come good in its word
29:52Yes Preeti as you rightly mentioned
29:55you know there are a lot of things that the Congress has to do
29:58and do it differently
30:01but the foremost thing that the Congress needs to do
30:04at least in Gujarat is to be consistent
30:07consistent in its policies
30:10consistent in its approach
30:13You know in the last 30 years you know ever since the
30:16Kham theory, the Kshatriya, Harijan, Adivasi and Muslim
30:19theory of the Congress which gave Congress
30:22over 145 seats in the 80s
30:25when that happened the upper class
30:28in Gujarat, especially the Partidars
30:31and other Baniyas, the Brahmins
30:34they got all disengaged and disillusioned with the Congress
30:37A reason because of
30:40which the BJP very successfully could
30:43hijack Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel from the Congress
30:46If you ask any youngster on a Gujarat street
30:49and Miss Varma
30:52we are sitting here in Gujarat as observers and we see that
30:55that people in Gujarat
30:58associate Vallabhbhai Patel with BJP
31:01So this time the Congress has made a very
31:04a very aware
31:07a very aware decision
31:10and adopted a resolution
31:13reclaiming Sardar Patel
31:16and if we remember it is the BJP
31:19the biggest cricket stadium in India
31:22was named after Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel
31:25It was the BJP which re-Christianed the name
31:28to Narendra Modi Cricket Stadium
31:31So this is the respect that the BJP gives to Sardar Patel
31:34but it uses Sardar Patel when it comes
31:37for quick electoral gains
31:40so the Congress also has to play equally smart
31:43Alright, I'm going to go back to Sanju Varma right now
31:46Sanju Varma, I know you've got a fair bit of rebuttals
31:49that you want to comment, so go ahead with that
31:52It's interesting Sanju Varma
31:55even just the way you look at how things are stacked
31:58because you're still two years away from elections in Gujarat
32:01Many would say it's audacious for the Congress to do what it's doing
32:04and if it actually follows through this time, because you're right
32:07the Congress has been very very inconsistent
32:10on following up on anything
32:13Preeti, first and foremost, let me make one thing very clear
32:16You know, I love coming on your show
32:19you're very fair, but at the same time
32:22I don't need to be taught how to do my job
32:25If a journalist's job is tough, a spokesperson's job is equally tough
32:28I feel that there are journalists who are being
32:31unsaid to the BJP, I will speak out, that's my right
32:34Now let me come to the moot point
32:37The moot point is this
32:40Here one of the political analysts, journalist, pro-Congress, pro-Ahud supporters said
32:43BJP only uses Sardar Patel
32:46I remember when we built the 182 metres
32:49at our 597 feet tall statue
32:52honouring Sardar Patel's legacy at Kevadia
32:55in Gujarat, and PM Modi inaugurated it in October 2018
32:58for a cost of 3000 crores
33:01The entire tribal
33:04Rahul Gandhi, Priyanka, Vadra, pseudo-secular
33:07they all said, why spend 3000 crores
33:10to build Sardar Patel's statue
33:13and today more than 2 crore people visit Kevadia
33:16just to pay obeisance to Sardar Patel
33:19every single year, but let me say one more thing
33:22that Sardar Patel died in 1950
33:25Sardar Patel got Bharat Ratna
33:2841 years after his death
33:31in 1991, whereas Nehru awarded himself
33:34in 1955, and Indira Gandhi also awarded herself
33:37when she was still very much alive, for zero contributions
33:40So don't teach the Bharatiya Janata Party
33:43about how we have to respect, be it Patel's legacy
33:46or Ambedkar's legacy. What did Nehru say about Ambedkar
33:49After Ambedkar's death, Nehru wrote a letter
33:52to Dr. Rajendra Prasad saying, do not attend
33:55Ambedkar's funeral, because he was a controversial
33:58figure and an anti-national
34:01And today, this very Congress Party in Gujarat
34:04prays for Dalits
34:07Ma'am, you've gone beyond 2 minutes, I'm going to cut you short
34:10I want to bring in Charan Singh Sapra back into this conversation
34:13Charan Singh Sapra, one of the biggest questions that faces the Congress
34:16Consistency. And it has been a question that has been posed
34:19to your top leadership. Rahul Gandhi spent 60 days
34:22in Gujarat
34:25in the year 2017. The Congress came very close
34:28to doing, it did really well, it was touch and go for the BJP
34:31Rahul Gandhi never came back
34:34to Gujarat for 2022 elections
34:37save an 11 rallies that he did
34:40and at best, lasting a couple of days, which was 5 or 6 days
34:43he spent in Gujarat. Consistency
34:46There is a question today that Priyanka Gandhi
34:49might be elevated. Consistency is something
34:52that haunts Priyanka Gandhi as well. So what do you do
34:55Charan Singh Sapra, where consistency comes into question for the Congress
34:58number 1. Number 2, look at what happened
35:01in 2017 Charan Singh Sapra. You had the likes which represented
35:04all the communities you say that the Congress had hold in
35:07You had Alpesh Thakur, you had Hardik Patel and you had Jignesh Mewani
35:10out of those 3, which actually propelled
35:13that kind of mandate for the Congress
35:16which was very very good. 2 are now
35:19sitting with the BJP
35:22See Preeti, number 1
35:25let me also tell you that in 2017 I was
35:28there in Gujarat for more than a month
35:31I know what happened and how the Congress campaigned
35:34probably we could not do the same in 2022
35:37there might be several reasons to that
35:40I agree we should be consistent in our program for Gujarat
35:43and we will be consistent when we are taking so much pain
35:46when we are doing such a big event in Ahmedabad
35:49and we are formulating a strategy
35:52not only for Gujarat but for the entire nation and for the entire party
35:55that means that shows that we are really serious
35:58doing the AICC session in Gujarat and in Ahmedabad
36:01itself sends a very big message which maybe the BJP
36:04might not understand, you might understand
36:07and the other 2 panelists might understand
36:10having a session is something else
36:13but you have to follow through with the messaging
36:16that's where consistency comes into question
36:19you never interrupted the BJP spokesperson
36:22I apologise
36:25as far as Sardar Vallabhai Patel is concerned
36:28let me give you today's example
36:31in Ahmedabad near the riverfront there is a RSS library
36:34till today a book of H.V. Sheshadri
36:37is being given free of cost
36:40H.V. Sheshadri is a person who had written
36:43all negative notes against Sardar Vallabhai Patel
36:46so this is happening even today
36:49I have myself seen the BJP spokesperson
36:52can also come to Ahmedabad and see that
36:55how can they claim Sardar Vallabhai Patel
36:58we will remind people
37:01that it was not BJP at that time
37:04but RSS and Hindu Mahasabha
37:07who openly burned the effigies of Sardar Vallabhai Patel
37:10Nehru and Babasaheb Ambedkar
37:13when the constitution was made and when it was declared
37:16this is open
37:19and also there are so many other things
37:22like I said the airport when Congress wanted to name after Sardar Vallabhai Patel
37:26so these are the differences
37:29which we are going to predict in front of people of Gujarat
37:32I want to give one minute each to Deepal Trivedi and Ajay Unmat
37:35on just how they are looking at the developments there
37:38Ajay Unmat one minute Mr. Umat
37:41for you to summarize what is there to watch out for
37:44with what Congress has done today
37:47listen in 2017 the Congress party
37:50could perform very well because of Hardik Patel
37:53Alpesh Thakur and Jignesh Mewani
37:56because again they tried to do caste combination
37:59Hardik Patel was belonging to Patel community
38:02then Alpesh Thakur OBC community
38:05and Jignesh Mewani Dalit community
38:08again they failed in 2022
38:11and Rahul Gandhi did not come to Gujarat for election campaigning
38:14and Gujarat was treated like Cinderella
38:17they had virtually given K-pop because
38:21and Congress party could not do electoral seat adjustment
38:24and that was the reason Rahul Gandhi focused more on caste
38:32in 2024 they could manage only one seat in Gujarat
38:35and now they are trying
38:38in 2027 elections
38:41they will try again caste combination
38:44and that is the reason they are focusing on urban areas
38:48that is what you know Congress strategy is
38:51to focus more on urbanization
38:59Deepal Trivedi I am going to give you the same time
39:02one minute on what is there to watch out for
39:05in the next 6 months to a year if Congress needs to
39:08solidify its ground
39:11and the BJP how do you think they will counter it
39:14at the moment the BJP is extremely comfortable
39:17and the BJP has no point to even fret
39:20about this convention or the AICC session
39:23taking place in Ahmedabad
39:26because of the public support that the BJP enjoys
39:29as I said earlier for the Congress
39:32it is impertinent that it remains consistent
39:35what I find wrong with the Congress
39:38that it keeps on changing its goal posts
39:41every 6 months
39:44this is the reason that the Congress has not been able
39:47to solidify its electoral gains
39:50in Gujarat in the last 3 decades
39:53whether it is the minorities
39:56whether it is the OBC
39:59the Congress does not have a consistent stand
40:02unless the Congress does that
40:05there is no hope
40:08I will give one minute
40:11to Sanju Varma
40:14and I will give one minute
40:17to Sanju Varma
40:20and your time starts now
40:23.
40:30If you look at the books
40:33the BJP
40:36The country's vote share was a massive 61.86%.
40:40With 25 seats, the Congress won just one seat
40:43from Dhanushkantha, with a vote share of 31.24%.
40:47Imagine, despite having a vote share of 31.24%,
40:51the Congress could not translate that into winnable seats.
40:55That is the point I repeatedly make.
40:57The Congress has lost the ability
40:59to translate vote share into winnable seats.
41:02And again, I will draw the attention of your audience
41:04to this.
41:05The total number of votes polled by the BJP in Lok Sabha
41:082024 from Gujarat were 1.79 crore votes.
41:13The votes polled by the Congress were 9,090 lakhs,
41:17which means, again, there was a difference of 89 lakh votes.
41:22How is the Congress ever going to make up
41:24for those 89 lakh votes, which it fell short of?
41:27And the final point is this.
41:29On the debate, you give Shraddha Anjali to Sardar Patel.
41:34But nobody has forgotten that if there
41:36is one person who was given stepfatherly or college
41:40stepbrotherly treatment, it was Nehru
41:42who completely demolished the legacy of Sardar Patel
41:46and successive Congress governments
41:47completely destroyed Patel's legacy.
41:49All right.
41:50That's that.
41:51I want to bring in Charan Singh Sapra into this conversation.
41:53And there's a point which Sanju Verma makes Charan Singh Sapra.
41:55We'll supplement it with figures,
41:57where the Congress in Gujarat has been completely
41:59unable to convert vote share into seat share.
42:01Look at the vote share.
42:03We'll put out those graphics now right
42:05from the last three elections in the state of Gujarat.
42:09And look at the kind of seat conversion
42:12that has taken place.
42:13The Congress hasn't been able to do that.
42:15And of course, you heard both the commentaries
42:17made by Ajay Unmath and Deepal Trivedi.
42:21See, Preeti, the facts are that we have not
42:23been able to convert.
42:24But yes, we are trying to develop our organization
42:28in a way that in future or in the coming election in 2027,
42:32we have to defeat Bharatiya Janata Party.
42:34There's no second thought about it.
42:37We will defeat BJP.
42:38We are formulating a strategy.
42:40And there are so many issues.
42:42Why we are concentrating or we are
42:44trying to concentrate on the urban area?
42:45Because there are so many issues.
42:47The economic issues are there, of course.
42:49People of Surat, the traders of Surat,
42:51or maybe Baroda or Ahmedabad, their issues
42:54are different, which BJP has not been able to resolve.
42:56The MSME over here has been largely affected.
43:00There is a trade deficit.
43:02And there are so many other issues
43:04which Congress party will bring in the front.
43:08And we will see that the urban votes, as well as
43:12the rural vote, the tribal vote, all these votes,
43:15there are issues through which we can take these votes
43:18and we can defeat Bharatiya Janata Party.
43:20Earlier figures were not in our favor.
43:22You can take as many figures and the results
43:24will be the same what were there earlier.
43:28But today, Congress is in a process
43:30of changing the organization, of energizing the organization,
43:34and trying.
43:36Sangharsh.
43:36The word sangharsh is very important, sankalp sangharsh.
43:40We are going to do this sangharsh to defeat BJP,
43:43to change the Congress party, and make it
43:45a vibrant party in Gujarat.
43:47All right, sir.
43:47We don't know whether it will reach fruition.
43:49But as political observers, it's
43:51going to be very, very interesting and juicy
43:53to watch on what really goes down.
43:55I appreciate all four of you for joining us.
43:57Thank you there.
43:58Because it's going to continue, where
44:01the debate of the Congress coming into Gujarat
44:04two years before elections, will the Congress
44:06follow it through consistency, is going to be a big question.
44:09And if it does, how much can it harm the BJP?
44:11Ultimately, there is way too much.
44:15It's loaded politically with symbolism
44:17of what the Congress has done today.
44:20Is it just going to be limited to that?
44:23Many of our viewers might have seen one video, which
44:25would have shocked them, but would have also
44:28made them feel really sad.
44:29Because that's how molestation, sexual harassment, is handled.
44:33It was an incident that took place in Bengaluru,
44:37an incident of molestation on the streets of Bengaluru.
44:40Why we've picked up a story that is two days late, is viewers.
44:45Because two days from now, absolutely no action
44:47has been taken.
44:48That man you see on your television screen
44:50has sexually harassed someone.
44:53That molestation has taken place in full public view.
44:56And he's just run away, on the loose, no action.
45:00This incident took place on April 3rd,
45:03a horrific sexual assault at the IT Hub's BTM layout.
45:07In the CCTV footage accessed by India Today,
45:10the molester can be seen following
45:12the unsuspecting woman, grabbing her, groping her,
45:15and then fleeing the scene.
45:17Karnataka Home Minister in all of this.
45:18And that's also why we've picked it up two days late.
45:21Because we thought he said something
45:22which was highly insensitive.
45:23Because most of our politicians keep
45:25making very, very insensitive statements.
45:28But then at least they follow it through later
45:30with some action sometimes.
45:31Nothing has happened.
45:32The Karnataka Home Minister made a bizarre statement,
45:34claiming small incidents such as like what
45:37has happened on your television screen takes place very often
45:40in big cities.
45:41Also, clearly in big cities, the perpetrators of crimes
45:45like that never quite get caught.
45:47Even though an FIR was registered against
45:51the unknown molester who's still on the loose.
46:15All right, I'm going to quickly cut across to two women.
46:18Trisha Shetty, human rights advocacy activist.
46:21Sanjana Galrani, she's an actor.
46:23And the reason why we've picked up the story, Trisha, again,
46:26it's two days late.
46:27Usually we would have never picked up something like this.
46:29But the fact is how casually the government of Karnataka
46:32is taking this incident, the kind of commentary we've seen.
46:36And at the back of it, no action.
46:37That man is still at large.
46:39Because small incidents like that
46:41take place in big cities like Bengaluru.
46:45So, what do you make of the statement made
46:47by the home minister of the state?
46:51It is extremely disturbing.
46:54And if you speak to any woman, you
46:57will know that for us, when we commute, right,
47:00when we leave our homes and we're either going to work,
47:02to school, to see our friends, whatever,
47:05we are always accounting for our safety in the respect of,
47:09you know, what are we wearing?
47:10How are we traveling?
47:12What time are we going?
47:14It's sad.
47:14It may be a small incident happening here and there.
47:16But the truth and the lived reality of women across India
47:20is that this is not a small incident.
47:22This is a heavy burden we carry on our shoulders
47:25every single moment, every single time we go out,
47:28accounting for our safety.
47:30And it's tiring.
47:31It's tiring as women to constantly
47:33have to think of who's going to stalk us, who's
47:35going to touch us, who's going to grope us, who's
47:37going to molest us, thinking of, OK, at least my boobs got
47:40touched, not my ass.
47:41We're constantly trying to play this gymnastics,
47:44trying to protect our body in public spaces.
47:46Listen, what is the job of a home minister?
47:48The job of a home minister is to ensure safety
47:51within his state, right?
47:53So he's not doing any people in Karnataka any favors.
47:57Instead, he's letting them down by saying,
48:00such incidents happen.
48:01If such incidents happen under your watch
48:03and you are not taking complete responsibility,
48:05if you are not taking this as a serious issue of safety
48:09when it comes to women, then resign.
48:12Give it to someone else who can manage
48:13to do their job properly.
48:15It's as simple as that.
48:16We have laws in place.
48:17Make sure that there's fear of the law,
48:20that these laws are enforced, that these processes,
48:22should someone complain, they shouldn't
48:24be subject to the gruesome process of judiciary.
48:27Very often, why do women who are subject to molestation
48:31not complain?
48:32Because there is sort of a mentality where you think,
48:35you know, now what am I going to do?
48:37I'm going to go through the court process
48:39and keep re-victimizing myself, keep torturing myself
48:42because the system is not here to support me.
48:44This is where I think our politicians
48:46have a huge role to play in affirming survivors.
48:49Speak up, step up.
48:50We will ensure that the entire process,
48:52once you complain, is easy in ensuring
48:54you have access to swift and assured justice.
48:57Ms. Galrani, I want to bring you in as well
48:59because, you know, like I said, this is an old story.
49:01Technically, it shouldn't really feature
49:02on a show right now because we've already covered it,
49:04but it's bizarre because the kind of statements
49:07our ministers make and get away with it.
49:09It's normal to say for the Home Minister
49:11that small incidents happen in a big city like Bengaluru.
49:14You know, we'll take care of it.
49:15Have they taken care of it?
49:16Absolutely not.
49:17I'm sure there's going to be another
49:18such incident very soon.
49:20I'm a Bangalorean.
49:21I bleed Bangalore.
49:23This city is like my mother to me.
49:25I'm born and brought up here.
49:26I'm aware of each and every area as if it's my own.
49:30And I'm very proud to tell that Karnataka Police
49:33is one of the best polices in the country.
49:36And our government also, I'm not from the government
49:39or I'm not targeting to be there,
49:40but our government may be a Honorable Chief Minister
49:43or our Home Minister, Parmeshwar Sir,
49:45who has just made this statement.
49:47He has made it out of a general point of view,
49:51not in a way to condemn that, okay,
49:53something like this is happening
49:54or let's not concentrate on something
49:56which when something like this is happening.
49:59He's really very aggressive and a dedicated minister,
50:01Mr. Parmeshwar Sir.
50:03And his statement has been largely interpreted.
50:04I have one quick question.
50:05Not very honorable in terms of commentary
50:09made by the Honorable Minister who you've just quoted.
50:12Please don't intrude me.
50:13I didn't intrude you when you were talking.
50:14Mam, it's a question.
50:15It's a rebuttal.
50:17This is a country wide problem.
50:20This problem is a problem of India.
50:22This problem is a problem that has to be addressed
50:25from the grassroots level.
50:26Let me ask you a question.
50:28Why does something like this not happen in Saudi Arabia?
50:30Have you ever heard in your lifetime?
50:32Why does something like this to a woman
50:34doesn't happen in Dubai?
50:35In Dubai or Saudi Arabia, you just lift your eyeballs
50:38and if that particular woman is going ahead
50:42and filing a complaint against you,
50:44you are into serious issues.
50:46You don't even know if you'll go back home for a lifetime.
50:48That is how serious the law is.
50:49Mam, I don't know.
50:50You know, I'll tell you what.
50:51I'll tell you what.
50:52I apologize.
50:53I'm shutting you down and I apologize for that.
50:55I apologize for that.
50:57And the reason I'm doing so.
50:58The reason I'm doing so,
50:59I take full responsibility for cutting you short.
51:02And the reason I'm doing so,
51:03sometimes it's very irresponsible
51:05in terms of the commentary,
51:07in terms of the usage of language that you have just.
51:11Because it's wrong.
51:11It's wrong.
51:12To suggest.
51:13Because I'll tell you,
51:14number one, it's not honorable.
51:16It's not honorable to use language like this
51:19where you say incidents like this happen.
51:21Number one.
51:22Number two, as good as the Bangalore police has been,
51:26the Bangalore police hasn't done its job.
51:28And you know, I'm glad I'm really out of time.
51:30I'm gonna end the show.
51:31I appreciate both of you for joining us.
51:33We're gonna keep a keen eye
51:34on all developments in the story.
51:36Till now, the molester has not been caught.