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00:00High noon, Jones and Keefe here on WEEI. It's a Wednesday. It's a Celtics Wednesday, which
00:07means it's time for Pure Hoops with Terp, Justin Terpen of WEEI.com. Terp, what's up?
00:14What's up, guys? What's going on?
00:16Well, injuries, any concern right now for the squad or everybody going to be all right?
00:22Particularly with Jason Tatum?
00:23Yeah, let's start with Tatum and then go to Brown and then I guess anybody else.
00:27I don't think there's really any concern with Jason. It's a sprained ankle. It happens
00:31all the time in basketball. He's probably had dozens of these throughout his playing
00:34career. So there's really no concern with that. Did you guys see he was on the Kelsey
00:38Brothers podcast?
00:39I saw the promotion for it. Yeah, yeah. It's already happened?
00:43Dropped today, yeah. And he was saying how he's young, so he bounces back a little faster.
00:48So I think the one thing that kind of sucks about it is it happens right when he's playing
00:52the best basketball of his season. And I'm not worried about it knocking him off his
00:56rhythm like we've seen this continuously with him that he can just bounce back and
01:00slide right back in. But it's just a sprained ankle like that's that's really all it is.
01:04I mean, when you see him like rolling around in pain, I think it enhances it a little bit.
01:09Some fear there, but I mean, he's fine. It's just sprained ankle.
01:11Do you think it was dirty? I did, but it's a basketball play. I think it was more reckless
01:15than it was dirty, if that makes sense. I think there's a difference between the two.
01:18Like he was trying to make a play in the ball and it was just a reckless closeout. I wouldn't
01:22call it dirty per se.
01:23What about Jalen Brown? See, that's one that I'm a little bit more interested to see because
01:27he's clearly dealing with something like the Celtics put out a press release on it saying
01:31that he was going to miss a couple games with that bone brewers. And the thing is with Jalen
01:35is I think he's really looking at the sixty five game threshold. He has to play eight
01:39of the final ten. And when you're looking at the guys that have already been disqualified,
01:43the guys that are already ineligible, he has a legitimate chance to steal an all NBA team
01:48here. And for him being such a prideful individual and really caring about the legacy he's
01:53leaving and all that, I think that's important to him. And I think and I don't blame him for
01:57not for wanting to go all in and trying to get all NBA this year, because this is a year
02:01he can really go and get it. And when you're talking legacies like that matters when you're
02:06talking about Hall of Fame or whatever it may be. So you think he's all NBA, Keith?
02:10So I think you got to look through it. Like I was saying, of the guys that qualify or don't
02:14qualify, talking about 15 players. And is it still two guards, two forwards? It's now.
02:23So I do think the All-Star game, they changed it to forward,
02:25backward, frontcourt. You said earlier we were talking about Durant.
02:28Like I think he's going to be. You think Durant is going to be all NBA?
02:30I do. So like Durant over Jalen.
02:32Like there's two teams, though. No, there's three teams.
02:36I just wonder. He feels fringy would be my point. So like to play to play in the games and like,
02:42quote unquote, rush it to hit that threshold. Like I have no problem with it, but I just I
02:46wonder if he's going to get what he wants at the end of the day. I wonder if he even is all NBA.
02:50Well, just to have his name in there matters. I also think it's a great honor. I think it's
02:54a good distinction. I think we always I mean, I always point to it and compare and play.
02:57Just a minute ago, we were comparing, you know, Durant and Giannis. One of the first
03:01things you look at is like all NBAs. And he was barely snubbed last year.
03:05Like he almost got it last year. Yeah. Yeah. Four team. Right. I think it does
03:09matter to what he did last year. I think there is some sort of like
03:13reputation that comes with winning Eastern Conference and NBA Finals MVP.
03:18I know it's not supposed to factor into this year, but seeing what he did,
03:21like there is some sort of reputation that comes with that that might get considered,
03:25although it shouldn't when deciding these or these regular season awards.
03:29So he could definitely slide in there. I mean, he was an all star. So when you're
03:33whittling down the pool there, like he's definitely going to get consideration. And
03:37again, with just like with who's already disqualified, not about the list in front of me,
03:40but like he can definitely get an all NBA team. Sixty five, you said, is the number.
03:45So I'm just trying to look at something like ten games left. Right. So if anybody else is
03:49going to rush to get there, like Jalen, add roughly ten. Right. Total. Because the first
03:54team is going to be pretty eerily similar to last year. So you think it'll be Shea,
03:58Guilders, Alexander and Jokic who are fighting for the MVP. It'll be Giannis and Tatum.
04:03And then, I mean, Luka was last year. So it won't be Luka first team, but maybe like Donovan Mitchell.
04:06Yeah. So just a couple like Wemby, Anthony Davis, Kyrie Irving, Luka, Kawhi,
04:12Joe Allenby, LeBron going to get there. Oh, that's good. He's not listed on this
04:16list that I have right in front of me, but he has missed time here in their throat.
04:19He's already had 60 games played. OK, so yeah. So but like that is a lot of good quality players
04:25that are off the board, which it's something to shoot for. But like, I don't think they're going
04:29to put it out there, even if it's third team, like all NBA. So you make it. That's great. It's
04:34good distinction. But as far as the team is concerned and like his health is still number
04:39one. Sure. Most important thing for sure. And the benefit for them is they're going to have two
04:43games at the end of the year against Charlotte. So they'll play Charlotte and it's not a back
04:47to back, but they'll play them two consecutive games in the eighty one and eighty two.
04:51So, I mean, maybe he tries to get it out, play eight straight here, take the final two days off
04:56and then have a couple of days off between the plane when the play in tournaments are being
05:01played between round one. So maybe he does that. But I also think like they're obviously
05:05and he's well aware of it, too, that his health is number one priority.
05:09Pure hoops with Terp every Wednesday high noon here on Jones and Keefe. Cleveland won last night.
05:15So the Celtics are back to five games back at Cleveland with whatever it is, ten or so to go.
05:20Is there any realistic chance with how well they're playing and how easy the schedule is
05:24used detailed? The two is Charlotte. There's like one real game left against Memphis.
05:28Is there any chance they can still catch Cleveland or is that dead?
05:31I think that's dead. You're not going five and five or whatever. I was starting to like,
05:35look into it a little bit or six and four over the last time they lost four straight last week.
05:39So I started to look at it there when they lost the four straight. But I mean,
05:43they've just been so consistently dominant this year. And also, does it make sense for
05:47the Celtics to go all in when Jalen's dealing with something? Now, Jason has this brained ankle.
05:51Yeah, but like with their schedule, I don't even think they may need to go.
05:55They're obviously going to try to win every game. So if it comes naturally,
05:57it comes naturally. Maybe if there's a push at the end, like, oh, you know,
06:00maybe this matters. Cleveland, it's only one or two games towards the end of the year. Maybe
06:04you go in for it. But like, they've been perfectly fine. They've played eight of their 12 games this
06:08month with two or more players of their top six out and they're eight no in those games.
06:11So like I said, with the schedule being what it is, they could very well just stay hot and
06:17went out and make it interesting. But I don't see Cleveland going another four game losing
06:20skid like they did last week. Anytime the season, any guys outside of the top six or even top seven,
06:25you think are making a case to maybe even play the playoffs or is it just a matter of,
06:29hey, there's nobody. So somebody needs to step up right now. I mean, the top nine is the top nine.
06:34I think it's obviously the top, top starting five. And then you got Al Horford, Sam Houser,
06:38Peyton Pritchard, and Luke Cornette, like that set. And that's what it's going to look like
06:41unless there's any injuries. I mean, obviously the Baylor Charmin thing's been fun. It's been
06:45a great story, but that's more for down the line. Yeah, correct. That's for like next year.
06:50Maybe not even next year, like depending on the moves they make, like he's eventually going to
06:54be in the rotation and contributing, but he's not going to play in the post. It's funny though. Like
06:58as great as Brad Stevens is at his job, the draft has sort of been like not applicable,
07:04right? Like how's he doing the drafts? Like, I don't know. They trade the picks. They don't
07:06have picks or they're super late picks. But you're like, if this is one of the guys that
07:09he found super late and he's like actually decent, you're like, all right, that's another feather in
07:13the cap for the Brad. The thing with that too, is there's guaranteed money that comes with the
07:16first round pick. So when they stuck in picked Baylor Charmin at 30, I was like, well, they must
07:22see something truly something here. If they're going to willing to take on the guaranteed salary
07:26granted, it's not much, especially when you're talking about like what Tatum and Brown make,
07:30but like it's still guaranteed money. So when they're willing to take that on, you understand
07:35that Brad sees something. And I mean, it could be huge, especially with like how tied they are to
07:41the financial restrictions and the second apron as of right now, you're going to need someone
07:45like that to contribute down the line. So speaking of that, any developing thoughts on
07:51the Celtic sale, Wiccan pags, uh, this new I'm told it's Chisholm guy. I feel like
07:56Bill Chisholm. That's not the way you should pronounce it. I feel like it should be Chisholm,
07:59but whatever you take it up with him. I feel like I don't trust anything about that guy.
08:03He's not really from the North shore. Like he claims you really out of nowhere. I really
08:07pronounce your name Chisholm. That's by choice like Chisholm probably bill. But yeah, well,
08:11I was the first to do that. I think any, any developing stance on the new owner,
08:15I mean, he's doing other things, right things right now. He's saying all the right things.
08:18He's it seems genuine when he talks about his fandom, when he talks about how much he loves
08:24the team, like it all seems really genuine and that's all he can do right now. Time will tell
08:29what happens and how he acts when the half a billion dollar luxury tax ends up on his desk.
08:34I would push back on that. I don't, I wonder how genuine it is. Cause it's so much. It's like,
08:38I watch every game. I know who Abby and Forsberg are. And it's like, I am. Well,
08:44I get my antenna up about that. I feel like you're laying it on tooth. I don't like how
08:47much you're doing right now. I mean, it's one way to look at, I do think it is genuine though.
08:50Like listening to him talk. I mean, he's, he really does seem excited about it. Even when
08:54they're showing the clips of him the other day, uh, just interacting with players pre and post
08:58game. Like it really does seem like he's starstruck in a way. Like it doesn't like,
09:03maybe he didn't think he was going to get the bit. Like maybe that's part of it. Maybe he's
09:07looking at like, Oh, pags is already in house. Maybe they're just going to go right to him.
09:10I think that's what everyone thought. Hell, this guy didn't even have a Wikipedia page.
09:14Wild. Nobody knew about it. Billionaire buys it coming in by the team. Now we had, uh, the
09:19statement from Steve Pagliuca last week that we went over. You also had wick Rosbeck's appearance
09:25on the Greg Hill show and just trying to like make sense of what everybody said. I mean,
09:30there's really a lot in the interview that wick had, but then just from the outside,
09:33trying to read into it, you know, pags is kind of calling out the new owner in a way he's taking
09:38shots at like the current ownership. Like, what do you think of that whole relationship and how
09:42it's kind of spun to this spot? I don't blame him at all for being pissed off. I mean, he's been
09:46with the team since wick came in. He was part of that big majority, uh, ownership group that bought
09:52the team. And it turns out he was paying more than wick was, I guess. Cause most of them are
09:56sure. Right. So in for a little while, like he boxed them out at the end there, uh, when they
10:03won the finals, like wick kind of boxed out Steve a little bit. I think Steve probably like everyone
10:08else again, thought he was going to be the winning bid. He was been a partner with them forever. I'd
10:12be, it was a fully financed offer. So I got news for him. I didn't think he was ever going to win
10:16the bid. So if he thought so, I don't know what he was thinking, to be honest. No, like I just,
10:20I don't have the highest bid though. He should have. Sure. It turns out Axios said he had the
10:24third highest. It was Chisholm. It was another group. And then him. I wonder. So he might've
10:27been fully, he might've been fully financed and no debt and all these other things, which is what
10:31I was going to ask you. But what were you just going to say? I wonder too, if maybe he didn't
10:34agree to the structure of keeping wick on. He didn't. Axios also reported that the only group
10:40that did that was Chisholm. So I think that that's where Irv comes in is like, sorry,
10:44wick. Like we're taking the best offer. Like, yeah, it'd be great if you can stick around and
10:47play governor for a little bit, but we're taking the most money. It's the reason why we're selling
10:51the team. And so that was probably a factor. I'm sure wick was happy with that, that it didn't go
10:55to pags how I read it, but I don't think they're leaving money on the table. No, I definitely don't.
11:02And my question was going to be, do we, do we think Chisholm can round up the money
11:07to do this? Because pags did have that weird line in his statement and we mocked it. He's like,
11:11Hey, if it falls through, I'm your guy. Like, is there any part of pags that you think still
11:15believes he can get in there and, and still wind up with the Celtics? I think so. Because the
11:20private equity money really complicates things. Like the NBA has different restrictions against
11:24the private equity money. So we'll see what happens with that. There's still a lot that
11:27needs to go down for this to be finalized, which is why I kind of found all the media blitz kind
11:33of interesting because it wasn't done yet. You know what I mean? And like he was talking
11:37everywhere and it was kind of a foregone conclusion, but there's so much that has to
11:41still happen for this to go through. So until it's done, until this is completely finalized,
11:47then pags is going to believe he has a chance because his was fully financed. Like, I think
11:51that's a, that's a big deal that he had a fully financed offer and they're ready. They have a bid
11:56already ready to go. So that doesn't mean if it does fall through that it'll just automatically
12:00go to pags. Like you said, he was the third highest bidder. So I mean, maybe he goes to
12:04the person that was above him, but until this is finalized and he should feel that way, you can't
12:08just back off just because it's believed that it's going to go there, right? They're going to stay
12:13in the race. And it does suck for pags too, that you spend all this time together, spend all this
12:17money with this team. And then all of a sudden it's like, Oh, this is your last year. Like,
12:22it's not your decision at all. That's terrible. Um, the other thing that jumped out to me
12:26when wick was talking with Greg and everybody in the morning was,
12:31thank God for Brad Stevens. Meaning Brad Stevens is going to have a real challenge
12:35this off season. He's like, we'll even, we'll see what he does in June and July.
12:38So obviously there's a lot of talk about the, uh, the second apron and all the luxury tax,
12:41all the money that you're paying on top of whatever your payroll is. But he had a line
12:46in there about how you can't, the basketball restrictions are too much. It was like,
12:51it's not the money it's the, it's the basketball restrictions, which is so false. Well, when you're
12:56winning championships and your restrictions are, you can't get a mid-level guy who probably
13:01wouldn't crack your rotation. You can't do stuff with draft picks and you can't do stuff with like
13:05matching. But if your roster is set, shouldn't you just keep paying it? And that's why I think
13:10they're going to do that. I think at least in year one, we'll see what happens down the road.
13:15But in year one, which is, um, I find it hard to believe he's going to come in and just blow
13:19this up. He'd be an immediate villain. And if he has skin, then maybe, but if he doesn't,
13:23then yeah, that's probably not your best first move. It's not like he wasn't aware of this
13:27massive historic luxury tax bill when he bought the team. And maybe it's something that him and
13:32his other investors looked at, like, Hey, we're going to have to eat this. Like we're going to
13:36have to just swallow this and deal with the repercussions. Because if not, we're going to
13:39be hated right away. Like imagine he comes in and just shifts off like true holiday and Kristoff's
13:45possibly after they go back to that, especially if they went back to back and you're like,
13:50these guys all want to come back. In fact, these guys are under contract and we're going to move
13:53on from them. If OKC knocks them off in the finals, then it's different. I don't rule off
13:57one of those. If they're back to back, if you win two in a row and everybody's under contract,
14:02that's insane. You could have said the same thing about last off season though. Had they gotten
14:05past Miami and went to the finals, Marcus Smart's probably still here. Oh, right. So no, no, I'm
14:09just saying I could see him moving pieces as soon as next off season. If they win though,
14:14you can't do it. If you're, you're sitting there going for a chief P uh,
14:19we're about to get into, uh, while the Celtics winning three titles in the eighties, no, uh,
14:24no, uh, Celts Pete, what were we calling it the other day? No, Celtric Celtric. Thank you. That's
14:29good. That is good. Uh, but we did just get Larry Bird and his first championship in Celtic city,
14:34episode four, which for all the hating I've done and they dragged their feet way too long,
14:38getting the bird. We finally got what I would consider awesome. Like an a plus
14:42is great, worth watching type of episode. So what'd you think? I loved it. I mean,
14:46just how competitive Larry Bird was like really, really stood out throughout that whole thing.
14:51Like they, the best, like hated each other. Like they have any more stuff like that. They need more
14:58rivalries, genuine hatred. Like I never really understood. Well, they developed into friends,
15:02but, but like the dream team and like everything that happened with magic by the end, like that's
15:07what you needed. But like on the court, those guys hate each other. The only rivalry now is
15:11Isaiah beef, Stewart and LeBron James. That's all we got. Now there's a significant gap between
15:17those two to say the least because he ran after him one time. It's our goat. It's the goat.
15:23LeBron also ruined the league because he has no rivals. He wants to be friends with everybody
15:27early on Pearson, Garnett hated him and that was good. He doesn't want to be friends with
15:31everybody. He hates beef stew. He does hate beef stew. That's his beef stew hates him. And it
15:34probably kills LeBron at night. Why did I do that? Isaiah Stewart, the competitive advantage
15:39too. Just like across the board. Like when the small detail in there about how the locker rooms
15:43would always be like hot or cold and the Celtics locker window open, but red bitch or the visitors
15:50McHale took a shot at overrated red where he said, he said he was himself though,
15:55with the back-to-back draft, read the coach overrated. Okay, fine. I might have to amend
15:59my stance a little bit. You know, trading for parish and McHale was a decent trade.
16:02That's a good deal. But no, and McHale's like, he didn't, he didn't freeze the other team out.
16:07He's like that. He never worked in that place. Yeah. He's like, the only thing that ever happened
16:11is when it got so hot, we could open our window in the locker room. The opposing team could die.
16:15I love when they show up to camp McHale's first year and they're at a gym. That's worse than the
16:20mountain view middle school gym. I played in, in God's town, New Hampshire. I was like, what is
16:23this? Like, he's like, we're the Boston Celtics. It's the NBA. And you're at some college. I've
16:28never heard of playing on these like tiny little hoops, Hellinick college in ridiculous Brookline,
16:33which I was unaware of. It was literally a middle school gym. I also think of, uh,
16:37it had a stage. Yeah. Right. Yeah. No, it was not a place. Maybe I'd have a wall of discipline.
16:41Yeah. That's an ML car. That's what I have a car called it. Robert Paris was like,
16:45there was no wall of discipline. It was a gym of discipline. He was like everywhere.
16:49We were big. So what I do, especially with these like older ones. And I talked about it after
16:53episode three, I think it was like, if there was sports radio or podcasts or even Twitter
16:58at the time of like Dave Cowens, how, what a big deal that would have been like,
17:02Oh, he quit the team. And I was watching the team from the stands. I was back playing again.
17:05Like what's going on? Like that would have been a whole thing. This early eighties run. And
17:10obviously we know the years they won the years. They didn't know how it ends. Right. Bill Fitch
17:16and they went red goes to the team and is like, who wants Bill Fitch back? Everybody says no,
17:21except for Larry bird. And then they get rid of them. That's fascinating. And like, imagine
17:27covering that at that time. Well, like if you played it out now and I don't think it will
17:31happen, but I'm saying the equivalent is Celtics won the title this past year.
17:36This year, they fall just short. They lose to a good team. The next year they fall just short.
17:40Then the year after that, they're like, or after that year, they're like,
17:43Hey guys, who wants Missoula back? And Tatum's like, I want them back. And everyone else was
17:47like, no, he's got to go. And then they get rid of them. Teachers, pet Tatum's like, screw you
17:51guys. You don't really like pretty wild. But then obviously we know they win it in 84. So,
17:56and it ended up kind of working out just all the antics, like that stuff,
17:59Cedric attacking a fan and then playing, finishing the game. Like that's insane.
18:05And then he had a great game. They don't win it. If it's not for him, Danny Ames getting
18:08bitten at the bottom of a pile. Like imagine any of that stuff happened now, even a little,
18:13we talked about it before too. Like again, there was Tommy or yeah. Tommy Heinsohn's doing like
18:18an interview when he was still the head coach, he was doing an interview and just like, start
18:21lighting a cigarette, but also like storming the court was normal, like after a win.
18:29So even after a win, they just rushed the floor, be Philly with the bird game winner. And there
18:34people are just all over birds. Cedric Maxwell gave a running elbow to a fan of the front row.
18:38It stays at the gate. Like, all right, guys, cool off, but circling back to like how things
18:42would be talked about people. I mean, you know, w I didn't exist, but how I would have talked
18:48about that team. If you win the title in 81 and then in 82, you come up short in 84 years,
18:5483, you're swept in round two by the bucks or the box and you quit on your coach quit.
18:59I'd be like trade parish. It's like talk radio at the time. And it probably was the discussion
19:05at the time. You got to blow this up in two years, removed from a title and a 61 win season.
19:10It looks like it's your league. And you don't even, it's one thing. If you lose to the Lakers
19:13or you lose to Dr. J you lost to the box, right? The second round swept by the box. I thought I,
19:20this is one of the first times too. Cause one of my critiques of the early episodes was,
19:25and it's not like you can do a new interview with bill Russell or red hour back, but it's like a lot
19:30of it is footage we've seen before. I, some of the like practice footage and stuff. I don't,
19:36I don't know that we've ever seen that. Like I lighten up max in a practice. You're like,
19:42I've never seen footage like that. So then I I'm starting to think there's some actual value to
19:47lost footage. That's never been seen in this Celtic city, which I appreciate.
19:51I've also thought they've done a really good job of using the archived footage to tell the story.
19:56Like the storytelling throughout the whole thing has been pretty incredible to use. Like, all right,
19:59here's some old Jerry West video. Here's some, uh, old, obviously before it was like a lot of
20:03will or, uh, bill Russell, will Chamberlain read our back, but now even still it's some
20:08older interviews, but did get Jerry West before he passed away. So some of that is,
20:12Oh, for specifically for this documentary, they did get him before,
20:16but like just the way they've kind of blended it all together has been
20:20really entertaining. And the storytelling from the guys to like Cedric Maxwell did a great job,
20:24like telling the story about the best practice. And then they had the footage to accompany it.
20:29I thought I'm with you guys. I thought that was the best episode yet. I thought too,
20:32is when they're showing all like the game footage and all like the big moments between
20:36the Celtics and Sixers or whatever, even though they're 81 finals is Joe Missoula must be
20:43screaming about not enough threes. Just be like, guys, the lines right there. Cause like they make
20:46a big deal. They're like Larry birds hit three threes today. And you're like magic. If Larry
20:51just decided how it's like eight a night, would he trade the threes for the fighting though?
20:55Oh, that's a good question. No, I think you'd want, yeah, actually. And you're right. He's
20:59loving it. There's less hard nips for all the fights that you saw on that. He's all in. Yeah.
21:03That might be the one thing he likes more than threes. All right. Grapple, uh, pure hoops with
21:08Terp every Wednesday here on Jones and Keefe. I enjoyed that episode of Celtic city. Uh, you
21:13could check out all his work at Justin M Turpin on Twitter. And of course,
21:17we.com Terp. We appreciate it. Thanks. All right, fellas.