US President Donald Trump on Tuesday promised to impose reciprocal tariffs from April 2 on most of America's trading partners, including India, China, Mexico and Canada.
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00:00Good evening, hello and welcome. You're with the news today. This is your primetime destination news, newsmakers talking point
00:06It's Wednesday night and our big talking point is once again coming from the United States of America
00:12Where Donald Trump has once again now put up warning to the world
00:17He says there will be reciprocal tariffs on all countries including India from the 2nd of April
00:23My big question today. How should India be responding to Trump's threat?
00:28My special guest today will be Fareed Zakaria the world's leading foreign affairs
00:34Analysts will be joining us to give us a complete lowdown on
00:38Trumpism so there's plenty to look forward to as always at first. It's time for the nine headlines at night
00:47Donald Trump sends the world into a potential trade war
00:52Warns retaliatory tariffs from the 2nd of April against all countries
00:57Including India Canada hits back takes tariff battle to the WTO
01:05Ukraine president Zelensky
01:07sends a letter to Trump
01:10Says he's ready for peace with Russia a day after halting arms supply to Ukraine US cuts off
01:18intelligence sharing
01:21And an all-party meeting in Chennai talent rejects
01:25Delimitation seek status quo on Lok Sabha seats for another 30 years
01:30BJP accuses DMK of fear-mongering says Center will clarify all doubts
01:37The party MLA in Maharashtra Abu Azmi suspended from the State Assembly for praising Aurangzeb
01:44Yogi hits out says send Azmi to UP for corrective treatment
01:49Akhilesh Yadav backs his MLA says he has the right to free speech. He's already apologized a
01:58Gold smuggling racket is busted at Bengaluru Airport
02:02Kannada actor Rabia Rao caught smuggling 14
02:06Kgs of gold Rania's father and Karnataka DGP denies involvement
02:12Sighting up in Delhi Jaganmohan Reddy demands principal opposition status in the Andhra Assembly
02:18TDP says won't break rules for one person
02:24India's stock market rallies despite the Trump tariff threat nifty ends 10-day losing streak at
02:3122,000 300 points sensex and 740 points up
02:34Reserve Bank of India announces a 1.9 lakh crore liquidity
02:39Inject measures in the banking systems RBI says it will continue to monitor
02:44Evolving market conditions and take appropriate measures
02:49Steve Smith announces retirement from one day internationals a day after Australia loses to India the Champions Trophy semis
02:56He will continue to play tests and t20 eyes
03:00But our top focus is coming today once again from the United States of America because US President Donald Trump
03:07Has addressed a joint session of Congress the first in his second term in a speech that lasted one and a half hours
03:14Trump hinted at launching a trade war from the 2nd of April
03:19Here are the big picture
03:21The US President Donald Trump has addressed a joint session of Congress the first in his second term in a speech that lasted
03:29One of the big takeaways from that major Trump's speech today
03:32Trump has declared reciprocal tariffs against several countries including India saying they will kick off from the first week of April
03:41the US President said Ukrainian President Zelensky has sent him a letter expressing willingness for peace talks and
03:48A minerals deal Trump has announced in the United States will get Greenland one way or the other
03:54other. Trump added that the process to reclaim the Panama Canal has also
03:59started. Referring to the capture of the terrorists behind the 2021 Kabul
04:03airport attack, he thanked Pakistan for its help in catching the terrorists.
04:08Donald Trump clearly is once again making the headlines. In a moment, I'll
04:13be joined by the world's leading foreign affairs analyst, Farid Zakaria.
04:17But first, listen in to what Donald Trump had to say on tariffs and indeed
04:23on the war in Ukraine.
04:24Yeah, India charges us auto tariffs higher than 100%. China's average
04:33tariff on our products is twice what we charge them. And South Korea's average
04:39tariff is four times higher. Think of that four times higher. And we give so
04:44much help militarily and in so many other ways to South Korea. But that's
04:48what happens. This is happening by friend and foe. This system is not fair
04:54to the United States and never was. And so on April 2nd, I wanted to make it
04:59April 1st, but I didn't want to be accused of April Fool's Day. That's
05:06what that's not just one day was cost us a lot of money, but we're going to
05:12do it in April. I'm a very superstitious person. April 2nd reciprocal
05:18tariffs kick in and whatever they tariff us other countries, we will
05:25tariff them. That's reciprocal back and forth. Whatever they tax us, we will
05:30tax them.
05:33Earlier today, I received an important letter from President Zelensky of
05:38Ukraine. The letter reads Ukraine is ready to come to the negotiating table
05:43as soon as possible to bring lasting peace closer. Nobody wants peace more
05:49than the Ukrainians, he said. My team and I stand ready to work under
05:53President Trump's strong leadership to get a peace that lasts. We do really
06:00value how much America has done to help Ukraine maintained its sovereignty and
06:05independence regarding the agreement on minerals and security. Ukraine is ready
06:10to sign it at any time that is convenient for you. I appreciate that
06:17he sent this letter just got it a little while ago. Simultaneously, we've
06:22had serious discussions with Russia and have received strong signals that they
06:27are ready for peace. Wouldn't that be beautiful? Wouldn't that be beautiful?
06:35So what does all this mean for India and the world? What does Donald Trump
06:39mean for India and the world? I'm joined by one of the world's leading
06:43foreign policy analysts, global commentator, CNN talk show host,
06:48columnist of the Washington Post and author Fareed Zakaria joins me. Fareed,
06:53appreciate you joining us there from New York. First, right at the very
06:57outset, give us a sense for either what the last six weeks or the first six
07:01weeks of Donald Trump 2.0 in your view have meant for United States and the
07:07world.
07:07Thank you, Rajdeep. Always a pleasure to be with you. Look, it has been
07:14overwhelming because not just of the pace, but the scale and the kind of
07:19almost revolutionary nature of what Trump is doing. Trump really is in 2.0
07:26affecting a much larger policy revolution than anything that he did in
07:311.0 in his first term. Why is this? Because in the first term, you
07:37remember, we now know from multiple sources, he didn't expect to win. They
07:41were taken by surprise. And they immediately brought in two groups of
07:47people who were to provide counsel. One was the traditional Republican
07:52establishment, you know, the grandee, the grandees of the Republican Party,
07:57the main congressional leaders. And those people guided a lot of Trump's
08:01policy. The second were a group of generals. Trump was very enamored with
08:06generals, if you remember, in the first term. None of those people are
08:10present the second time around. Because what Trump found was that push comes to
08:16shove, those people were not fundamentally loyal to him. I think the
08:21way they would put it is that they were more loyal to the country and
08:25constitution. But the way Trump viewed it, they were disloyal to him. So he is
08:30now completely without guardrails from either the Republican establishment or
08:35the kind of foreign policy establishment that the military
08:38represented. And as a result, what you're seeing is a fairly radical
08:43remaking of both American foreign policy and domestic policy. On the
08:48foreign policy side, a much more transactional attitude towards the
08:53entire world. And on the domestic side, an effort to really radically remake
09:01the American welfare state, administrative state, both have far
09:07reaching implications.
09:09I'll come to the specifics, both foreign policy and domestic in a moment. But are
09:13you surprised just by the speed with which this has happened that in the
09:17space of six weeks, Donald Trump, as you say, is radically trying to transform
09:22foreign policy and domestic policy, just the speed with which he's going ahead
09:27with whatever he promised during the campaign?
09:31Well, the key to understanding it is Steve Bannon, who was, if you remember,
09:35his first senior advisor, and still, I think, is very influential within that
09:41MAGA world, though Trump seems to have soured on him. Steve Bannon said, the
09:46key here is you want to flood the zone. You want to do so much that it
09:51overwhelms the opposition. It makes it impossible for them to know what should
09:56they focus on, what should they oppose, you know. And that has been a very
10:01effective strategy in the short term. In the medium term, it'll be interesting to
10:07see what happens, because many of these things that he has done, courts are
10:11ruling are either overreach or outright illegal. And then you will get to the
10:18most dramatic and potentially dangerous issue, which is will Donald Trump obey
10:25court orders? Really, no American president, you know, in modern history has
10:31ever taken the attitude he has taken. Even Nixon, when he was Richard Nixon, was
10:37ordered by the court to hand over the Watergate tapes and things like that. He
10:40obeyed all court orders. This is a new challenge. So that that is the
10:46potentially most revolutionary change that might happen.
10:50Are you saying when you say that, that if tomorrow Donald Trump wants to, and
10:54there's been some talk of it wants to have a third term, he could push in for a
10:58constitutional amendment?
11:00That would be very hard, because that would require two thirds majorities in
11:04both houses, plus two thirds of majority in the in the state legislatures. And he
11:10doesn't have anything close to that kind of support. No, what I mean is something
11:14very simple. And, you know, frankly, this is their apparels in India, which is the
11:20courts, for example, have said that his freezing of foreign aid is illegal. The
11:25Congress passed the bills requiring that that foreign aid be spent. The president
11:32does not have the ability to, to, you know, to stop that he can try and veto it
11:38and then Congress can override it. But that all happened. These are legislative
11:42issues that have been done. The court has said unfreeze the aid. So right now,
11:48what Trump is doing is he's found some, they're, they're adhering to the letter,
11:53but not the spirit of the law. They're saying, okay, we're going to unfreeze it,
11:56we just have put in place new procedures to review the aid to make sure that
12:01there's no, there's no fraud. And the procedures are such that no money has,
12:06has, you know, been passed through. At some point, the court will say, you know,
12:13quit stalling, quit fooling around, you have to obey us. And what happens then?
12:18There is a famous court moment in the 19th century with Andrew Jackson's
12:24presidency. And JD Vance has cited this, which is why it's so significant, which
12:29is the Supreme Court ruled against then President Andrew Jackson. And Jackson
12:34said, the chief justice has issued his, his ruling. Now let him enforce it.
12:41Meaning the court has no army, the court has no coercive power. And if the
12:47president justifies the court, what do you do? It's a huge constitutional
12:52problem.
12:53That's for the future. Let's talk immediately at the present in his speech
12:58today. The big takeaway, of course, was reciprocal tariffs starting from the
13:022nd of April, including on countries like India, which he says have
13:06unreasonable tariffs. He specifically cited India in the context of auto said
13:10it's 100% higher. Do you believe he's going to go ahead with that thread? He's
13:15already put up tariffs on on Mexico, on Canada, uh, doubled it on China. Are we
13:22seeing now the world heading to a trade and tariff war from the 2nd of April?
13:27It certainly looks like that. Look, Trump has one core belief. You can go
13:31back to the 1980s when he was a real estate developer. He took out a full
13:35page ad in the New York Times, and his main gripe was that Japan was in those
13:42days taking advantage of free trade and, you know, sending stuff to the U. S.
13:46Mark. He's always been a protectionist. He's always believed in tariffs, and he
13:51applies these tariffs in a kind of almost random, arbitrary way so that the
13:58tariffs on Canada, for example, really make no sense because he's complaining
14:03about fentanyl. 2% of the fentanyl that comes into the United States comes in
14:08from Canada. So what exactly is he asking Canada for? Nobody has a good
14:13sense. He you know, if you think about these tariffs, they're so bizarre and
14:19frankly stupid because you're putting tariffs on Canada and Mexico. American
14:27cars are all made in those three countries. We mean what we really make
14:31on North American cars made, you know, some parts made in Canada, some parts
14:36made in Mexico. They cross the border, assembled finally, usually in the U. S.
14:40or Mexico. So those will get tariffed. Your integrated supply chain, the cars
14:46that will not get tariffed are the German cars, the South Korean cars and
14:51the Japanese cars, which will come in tariff free. Similarly, he's putting
14:56tariffs on Mexico. But so the consumer goods that come in from Mexico will get
15:01tariffed. The stuff that comes in from Vietnam, Thailand, Indonesia, which are
15:07mostly all Chinese own Chinese made. You know, that's the way the Chinese have
15:12gotten around tariffs. So that will all come in. You know, it makes no sense. But
15:18he believes in it fervently. I think he is likely to do it. I think that if I can
15:24make, you know, this is India is one of the few countries for which this might be
15:29beneficial because India does have very high tariffs that that actually distort
15:34the markets in India. So if India could find a way to negotiate some kind of
15:39reduction of tariffs, it would be good for India. It would be good for the
15:43relationship. But the danger, Rajdeep, is that this goes into a tit for tat. The
15:48part of the speech you played, which was the most significant, was he said, if
15:53other people respond to my tariffs, I'm going to, you know, I'll do another tit
15:57for tat. That is that is a path to an upward spiral of tariffs, which would get
16:04very, very destructive and very dangerous for the world. We would end up in a
16:09inflationary world in which growth would slow and inflation would rise. That's
16:14called stagflation. We had that in the 1970s. It was devastating.
16:20But what you're saying is, therefore, is threat of retaliatory tariffs is serious.
16:23It's not just an attempt to get countries like India and other countries to the to
16:30the negotiating table. He actually means it. He actually believes that it is time
16:36to have this kind of that that America will not allow other countries to have
16:40high tariffs where the and he will insist on tit for tat tariff measures.
16:47I think that's right now. Again, India might be exempt from the full wrath of
16:52Donald Trump because it's frankly a small market for the US. You know, trade
16:57with India is not that high. He has certain national security reasons why he
17:03would like to be nice to to India. So there's a possibility that India could get
17:08a carve out, which is, I think, part of what Prime Minister Modi has been trying
17:12to do. But his basic attitude, Rajdeep, is tariffs are good. They shield American
17:20industry and American manufacturing. They allow me to raise revenues. He wants to
17:25create a department of external revenue, which is really crazy, because if you were
17:31to even put 10 percent tariffs on all goods coming into America, it would not even
17:36raise five percent of the revenues that the that the US government needs. You know,
17:41tariffs, it comes out of a 19th century world, but it's a world he believes in.
17:48I'll come to the other part of tariffs in the context of China at the moment, but I
17:52want to also, Farid, for a moment focus on the other big talking point, which is
17:56Ukraine. This has been a dramatic week of a kind I'm sure you've never seen also
18:00in your long career observing diplomacy, that standoff with Zelensky. It's gone
18:07viral across the world like little else, and today Trump turns around and says
18:11Zelensky is ready to talk peace, and he hopes to have a peace dialogue as well
18:17as a deal on minerals. The Russians are in agreement. How do you see this playing
18:22out now over the next few weeks, given what we've seen happen in the last few
18:26days with Ukraine?
18:29It'll still take a long time because the reality is the Russians are not ready for
18:34peace. What they are ready for is victory. What they want are very humiliating
18:39terms for Ukraine, which the Ukrainians even now will probably not accept. But I
18:44think you're absolutely right, Rajdeep, that what we saw was a completely
18:50unprecedented thing in foreign policy, certainly American foreign policy, which
18:55was the role reversal. The United States has always, for the last 80 years
19:00certainly, tried to be on the side of democracies fighting against dictatorships,
19:06of the victim of aggression fighting against the aggressor. In this case, not
19:11only did he weaken that support for Ukraine, he flipped. Donald Trump
19:17essentially has been now for the last few days supporting Russia. They have put a
19:22hold on military aid. They have put a hold on intelligence sharing. The
19:27Russians, my intelligence tells me, are planning a big bombing campaign.
19:32Remember, the Russians bomb Ukraine every day, 500 Iranian Shaheed drones at the
19:38very least, and they are ramping that up. So the US and Russia are trying to put
19:44Ukraine in a pincer movement. This is something nobody has ever seen, and I
19:49suspect it's going to have very deep long-term consequences. Look, if the
19:54United States can turn its back on a country it has been supporting ever since
19:59its independence in 1991, and put it under the screws this way, what does that
20:07say to countries in Europe that the United States promises to protect? What
20:11does it say to countries like Japan and South Korea? Frankly, what does it say
20:17to a country like India that is trying to have closer security relations with the
20:21United States? Are American promises, guarantees meaningful if you're going to
20:27adopt... The basic difference is Trump has taken a transactional approach, and so
20:32every issue is taken for new. But the US over the last 80 years did not build its
20:39world order based on transactions, it based it on relationships that were built
20:44over decades. And that's the difference. Are we building relationships or are we
20:49having transactions?
20:50Given that he's turning foreign policy transactional, and in a sense upturning
20:56the world order and disrupting it totally, how do you see it play out now? Do you
21:00see Zelensky and Putin coming with Trump on the dialogue table in the near future?
21:06Is that possible? Will Europe feel completely abandoned? And what does it do
21:11to the alliances that have held for years, decades after the Second World War like
21:15NATO? Is all of that now going to be disrupted? Or is this purely transactional
21:19for the short term goal of achieving some kind of a temporary truce or peace in
21:24Ukraine?
21:26So you put the question exactly right. In the short term, look, Zelensky has no
21:30options. The United States is the principal military supporter. And if the
21:35United States threatens to withdraw that support, that is a deadly blow for the
21:40Ukrainians. They cannot afford that. So Zelensky will have to come to the table.
21:46Putin will come. Look, Putin has gotten almost every demand Putin has. Trump has
21:52already conceded. Trump says, you know, Putin can keep all the territory he has
21:56gained. He's talked about potentially relaxing the sanctions on Russia. He's
22:01talked about how NATO membership for Ukraine is out of the question. He's
22:07talked about no American troops in Ukraine. These were the key demands that
22:11Putin had, which were supposed to be affected in the negotiation. This master
22:17dealmaker, Donald Trump, has done the most bizarre negotiation I've ever seen
22:21which is he has preemptively conceded every point to Putin. So in the short
22:28run, there's going to be negotiations. I suspect that they will take longer
22:32because, as I say, the Ukrainians really cannot accept a complete humiliation and
22:37surrender that Trump seems to want to place on them. But the longer term effect
22:41is the one that I worry about, Rajdeep, which is what does this mean for NATO?
22:46After all, what is NATO? It's not the buildings. It's not the pieces of paper.
22:51It's not the meetings of the ministers. Fundamentally, it's the question, will
22:58the President of the United States send American military power to defend a
23:03small European country if it is attacked by Russia? And you tell me, do you think
23:10any European country, particularly the small ones close to Russia, can be
23:15confident that President Trump would, in fact, defend them? No. So they are
23:21nervous. They're going to start thinking about what do they need to do as a
23:25result. But I think it also has an effect on how the Taiwanese think about their
23:30future, how the Japanese and the South Koreans think of their future. Because
23:33everybody, at the end of the day, the US was the linchpin underpinning the
23:38stability of the world. And it had anchored that in these alliances. And the
23:44core to these alliances was the United States will protect you if you're
23:48attacked. That is what's kept the peace for 80 years.
23:52But there are those who believe, I've been reading some Indian foreign policy
23:55analysts who suggest that Trump now wants to sort of recreate that world
23:59order into spheres of influence, and thereby allow the likes of Putin to
24:03perhaps have his sphere of influence, even as America exercises its sphere of
24:08influence in parts closer to the United States of America. Do you see that
24:13really happening? Do you see Trump abandoning Europe and NATO in the near
24:18future because of this special relationship, if there is one, with
24:22Putin?
24:24You know, we don't know exactly how Trump thinks about this. But certainly
24:28the policies suggest something like what you are describing, a kind of 19th
24:34century spheres of influence world, in which in which, you know, Russia gets to
24:41have a sphere, China gets to have a sphere, and the US gets to have a sphere.
24:46The problem is, you know, people forget what that 19th century world looked
24:51like. It was a world of constant war. You know, think about the way in which
24:56those great powers treated the poor countries of the world, like India, they
25:02colonized them, they extracted their resources, they enslaved their people. Is
25:06that really a world we want to go back to? I mean, the whole revolution of
25:11international affairs that's taken place after 1945, and creating this
25:15rules-based system has produced peace and prosperity and stability and dignity
25:21for a lot of the smaller countries in the world that have not, you know, that
25:25otherwise were always the victims of this kind of great power spheres of
25:30influence condominium. So Trump may want it, but I suspect we're in a very
25:34different world. You know, the Ukrainians, for example, are not going to accept
25:38just any peace. They will fight. They'll fight if they have to fight as an
25:43insurgency. And as we know, insurgencies can be very powerful because the
25:48Ukrainians are fighting for their life and liberty. The Russians are fighting
25:52for grand imperial design. What we know about nationalism over the last 40
25:57years is, you know, at the end of the day, the Ukrainians will be hard to beat
26:01with or without American assistance.
26:03So what you're saying, you don't expect, as Trump seemed to suggest, an early end
26:07to the war, an immediate ceasefire. You don't see that happening.
26:11I think you may get a ceasefire just because, again, you know, Trump is
26:17insisting on it, but then will there be a resolution of the issues? You know,
26:22there are huge differences between the Russian position and the Ukrainian
26:26position. And I suspect that Trump can force the Ukrainians to do certain
26:31things, but there's a limit beyond which they won't go. You know, they've
26:35signed ceasefires. They gave up the third largest nuclear arsenal in the
26:40world in 1994 to Russia in return for a security guarantee from Russia, which
26:46Russia has now violated for 10 years. So, you know, they are aware that they
26:52need something more than a piece of paper.
26:55Let me take this to closer home because you mentioned China more than once.
26:59There are two views. One is that Trump is ready to take on the Chinese on trade
27:03and tariff issues. The other is that this is a prelude to a deal with the
27:08Chinese, again, being transactional. What would that mean, particularly for
27:12India and our security concerns? Is Trump keen to have a deal with the
27:17Chinese or does he want to push the Chinese?
27:21So I think Trump, ultimately, as you say, he's a transactional person. If he
27:25can get some kind of a big deal with the Chinese, he will. He mentioned in
27:30the State of the Union that he had negotiated a deal with the Chinese and
27:35that in his narrative, in his version of events, Biden didn't enforce it. It's
27:40complete nonsense. The problem is, of course, it was a highly protectionist
27:44trade deal. And to give you one sense, 90 percent of the tariffs that the
27:49United States got in return for putting up those tariffs in China, 90 percent of
27:54the revenue went to give additional subsidies to American farmers because
28:00they lost out on the Chinese market because the Chinese put tariffs on
28:04American farmer products. So the whole thing was a fiasco. And the Chinese
28:10never came through on the things they were going to buy, largely because of
28:14COVID. So he may try to reprise another one of those, even though the first one
28:18failed. The real question, Rajdeep, is what does he do on China's geopolitical
28:26ambitions, regional ambitions? One of his key officials, who is currently up for
28:33confirmation, has said, look, Taiwan is not important to us. And there is a
28:38strain within Trump's group that says Taiwan is more important to the Chinese
28:44than to us. Why the hell should we care? And by the way, it's going to be hard to
28:47defend anyway. That would be a seismic shift in American foreign policy in Asia
28:53because Taiwan has been seen as the key to whether or not the Western-led alliance
29:01can deter China. It's not even really just about Taiwan. It's about does the
29:07United States have the strength, capacity, the will, the skill to deter
29:12China? And if that doesn't happen, I suspect that a country like Japan, which
29:18is an advanced industrial country, will think seriously about getting nuclear
29:22weapons. And that changes the landscape, the geopolitical landscape of Asia.
29:28Where does that leave India and its strategic alliance with the United
29:32States? Indeed, Quad, which India seems to be wanting to invest more and more in
29:36if, as you're saying, we have this situation panning out where the Chinese
29:41seem to believe that they could have a free run into Taiwan. Where does that leave
29:45India and our strategic ties with the United States?
29:50Well, I think it will make India consider very seriously whether and how deeply it
29:56should tie its mast to the United States. It's inevitable. I think that it's
30:02unfortunate. I have long advocated that India should have closer strategic,
30:07economic, technological ties with the US. But I suspect that what this is going to
30:13do is make the Indian government feel, you know, it's a good thing we have good
30:17relations with Russia. And I suspect what you're going to see over the next six
30:21months is an Indian thaw with China. Not a major rapprochement, but I think you're
30:29going to begin to see more Chinese investment in India. You're going to see
30:33some relaxation of the tensions that are taking place. The border issue, as you know,
30:38has already been somewhat resolved in a way that there are larger buffer zones now. So
30:43the likelihood of a clash taking place doesn't happen. If the Chinese were smart,
30:49they would try to resolve the border issue now, because I think that would be taking
30:55advantage of America's, I wouldn't say weakness, but its own goal, its misguided
31:03strategy here, which is making everyone nervous. And of course, New Delhi will be
31:07nervous watching what's going on.
31:09Because, you know, the Indian Prime Minister, Prime Minister Modi was in
31:13Washington just two weeks ago. And there was a sense that he had managed to get some
31:17kind of a reprieve or at least get some time to work out, to allow negotiators to
31:23work out deals with the United States. Now, given what Trump said today, April 2nd,
31:28reciprocal tariffs, was the enthusiasm perhaps premature? How should Prime Minister
31:36Modi and his government then deal with Donald Trump?
31:39Look, Prime Minister Modi did the right thing. He went there. He has a good personal
31:43relationship with Trump. He tried to use that in a way to create a new framework. I think
31:50that the Indians should try to think about a trade strategy that allows them to create
31:55some kind of a deal where they have a carve out, where they bring down tariffs on some
32:01products that the US cares a lot about. As I say, I myself think that it will actually
32:07boost Indian growth because a lot of these tariffs, as you know, Rajiv, Indian tariffs,
32:12Rajdeep, are largely protecting domestic players in India.
32:18They're not good for the Indian economy.
32:20They're protecting some big business house that happens to make this stuff in India.
32:24Those people don't want foreign competition, but the Indian consumer would benefit.
32:29Indian growth would benefit.
32:30The larger question, as we've been talking about, is the strategic issue.
32:35I think tariffs, you might be able to get some kind of a carve out.
32:39But how does India position itself?
32:42You know, when it does have the look, the reality of Asia is the rise of China.
32:47China is going to quadruple its nuclear arsenal in the next 10 years.
32:53India has to have a policy and think about what that means.
32:57China is going to build a blue water navy that can project power well outside its
33:03waters. India will have to have a strategy to ask itself what it does about that.
33:08And that's where the dependability and the consistency of American foreign policy
33:13becomes very important.
33:15And the US has been consistent with its alliances for 80 years until this.
33:21You know, the fact is, it's interesting you use the word consistency.
33:25What have we seen today in his speech?
33:27Donald Trump spoke about reclaiming Greenland come what may or not just reclaim
33:33reclaiming the Panama Canal and getting Greenland taking over Greenland.
33:37So at one level, expansionist at another level, isolationist saying we'll make
33:43America great again.
33:44Focus on the domestic economy makes sense of this.
33:47Here is Donald Trump virtually talking about reclaiming Panama Canal.
33:51Greenland also talking about converting the Gaza Strip into some kind of a
33:59Riviera. So talking about the world as if he owns the world at the same time, talking
34:05about protecting American interests domestically.
34:09Is that a paradox?
34:12Well, there's a paradox in the sense that it's Donald Trump.
34:16I mean, he's full of contradictions.
34:17But if you want to find some through line, some strategy, it is that, you know, the
34:25United States is rich, powerful.
34:27We want to have more control over our hemisphere, over our immediate areas.
34:33Ironically, the reason he wants Greenland is because of global warming, which he says
34:38is a hoax. Because of global warming, the Arctic ice cap is melting and the Russian
34:44and maybe even Chinese ships will be able to come in through there.
34:48But that's the idea. Create a larger fortress America.
34:52Let the Europeans handle their own issues.
34:54Maybe we are somewhat involved in China, but in Asia.
34:58But, you know, we're not going to confront China.
35:00They can do what they want there.
35:02So there is a kind of consistency.
35:05But as I say, it harkens back to a world that was a very different world in which, you
35:11know, there was constant war, there was aggression, there was exploitation of small
35:16countries. You know, I would think that you would look at the last 80 years and say
35:22we've gotten beyond that.
35:24But, you know, the part of part of, you know, the core to understanding Trump is this is
35:30the politics of nostalgia.
35:32The most important word in his in his slogan is make America great again.
35:38Right. It is a harkening back to some Garden of Eden that, in fact, never existed.
35:44But, you know, people we all as we get older, we think things were better in the old days
35:49because we forget all the bad stuff.
35:51And he's he's now thinking back 150 years to things being better.
35:58I don't think that's the reality, but that is the core.
36:01But he's got the likes of, you know, he's he's virtually got American industry sort of
36:07fawning at the moment with him.
36:09He's got the likes of Elon Musk, his comrades in arm.
36:12It seems at the moment that there is no pushback that with the likes of Musk and others
36:17around him, they seem to believe they seem to be a sense of invincibility that they can
36:22get away with whatever they wish to do.
36:26Right now, you are you are absolutely right.
36:29Part of this, though, is illusionary, which is that business businessmen and even many
36:34foreign leaders have understood how to handle Trump, which is you praise him to the
36:38skies. You call him a genius.
36:40You tell him that everything he's he's said is is, you know, has transformed the debate.
36:45Then you make either very minimal concessions.
36:48Most of the businessmen who have who have announced these plans for investments, those
36:53plans were already in the works.
36:55They have just dressed them up and told told Trump that it was all his idea or they
37:01massively inflate the numbers.
37:03You know, there's one deal that that Oracle and OpenAI have.
37:07They each now they each have promised, I think, five billion dollars.
37:11So it's 10 billion dollars.
37:13They announced it as a hundred billion dollar deal.
37:15And then Trump said it may even be 500 billion dollars.
37:19So suddenly it went from 10 billion dollars to 500 billion dollars.
37:23That's that's you know, everybody understands that with Trump, you you praise him, you
37:30massively exaggerate all that, all the numbers involved.
37:34But there will be pushback because the truth is Trump's approval rating is not very
37:39high. Trump's approval rating right now is 47 percent.
37:43Biden's at this point, I think, was 55 percent.
37:46Trump is coming in with the second lowest approval rating of any president at this
37:50point in history, the first highest being his own approval rating in 2017.
37:57So it's important to remember that that Trump presents, you know, this image of
38:02extraordinary power.
38:04But he has a very narrow plurality, not even a majority of the American people.
38:11You know, I think that the way the best way to understand him is 35 percent of the
38:15American people think he walks on water.
38:18He is a deity and that support is unbelievable and unbreakable.
38:24And then there's another 10 to 15 percent who can be persuaded to be on his side if
38:29they think the Democrats are crazy enough.
38:31And the Democrats mistake in the last election was on immigration and on all these
38:36multicultural issues and transgender and all that they came across as crazy.
38:41And that tipped him over.
38:44But he's not wildly popular in America.
38:47He is a very controversial figure in America, as in the world.
38:50But but the fact is, the Democrats, particularly after the defeat, are in some
38:55element of disarray.
38:57Trump every day relentlessly attacks the Biden administration, attacks Joe Biden
39:03personally. And and at least from India, we don't you know, we now see Trump as this
39:08political strongman getting away with whatever he says on a daily basis.
39:12We've even got a Trump tracker at the moment on the channel.
39:15But that's the is he being seen?
39:18You think is the world also at the moment intimidated almost by Trump's presence, not
39:23just the Zelensky's, but the Stammers, the other countries in the world are just
39:29intimidated or just don't know what will happen next and therefore are fearful of the
39:34future. Yeah, yeah, you're exactly right.
39:37And there are two reasons for this.
39:38One, Trump is a master of the media.
39:43He understands what one might call the attention economy.
39:46That is, you need to dominate the narrative.
39:49You need to shape the narrative.
39:50And he's out there relentlessly and relentlessly partisan.
39:54He has no interest in being presidential.
39:57He has no interest in being bipartisan.
39:59As you say, in the state of the union, I cannot remember for anybody else relentlessly
40:06attacking his predecessor.
40:07In fact, if anything, in addresses like that, often there's an effort to to say we're
40:12continuing some of the great policies of this country.
40:15No, Trump relentlessly, polemically shapes the agenda to advantage him, just to try to
40:22put the opponents on the defense.
40:24But the other piece here is that Trump and this gets at the foreign leaders issue.
40:30Trump is again, because he's so transactional, he's always looking to see whom does he
40:35have leverage with so that whom can he pressure into a win-lose.
40:41For Trump, there is no win-win.
40:44He wins, you lose.
40:45Well, guess what?
40:46Your leverage is with your allies, right?
40:50Because you are the one, the United States is providing protection.
40:54The United States has built economic interdependence, which means they depend on you to a
41:00certain extent. The Canadian economy, it depends on the U.S.
41:03economy. He has no leverage with Putin.
41:06He has no leverage with Xi.
41:07So he has gone to war with his own friends, with his allies.
41:13In the long run, however, as I say, what this does is it transforms America's situation in
41:20the world from being the country that created this enduring set of relationships into a
41:27country that is purely transactional.
41:29And I think as any good businessman will tell you, the way you build a great enterprise
41:34that endures is not transactions, but relationships.
41:39Trump is the kind of businessman and this is what he was like.
41:42Every deal he made, the other party felt so cheated they never wanted to do business with
41:47him again. That's what he's doing in international affairs.
41:51Which is what we saw also, Farid, to a large extent in Trump 1.0.
41:55A lot of there was a revolving door.
41:56A lot of the people who were in his cabinet eventually left him, some with some element
42:01of recrimination. Do you see that happening or do you believe the likes of J.D.
42:05Vance, the Elon Musk who are around him now?
42:08This is, as you said at the very outset, a very different Trump administration, one which
42:12he controls far more than he did in his first term.
42:15Will they all stay? Are we seeing, therefore, Trumpism going to last the next four years
42:22or do you see ups and downs coming that he's going through some kind of a honeymoon period
42:27at the moment? But that might not last.
42:31No, I think it'll last with his core supporters and with these officials, because this time
42:37around, he has he's learned from his first term.
42:41Don't have people who have great institutional strength of their own, who have a kind of,
42:47you know, deep sense of their own personality, their own integrity, their own office.
42:52So get people who are slavishly loyal to you, who are polemically, you know, as as
42:59devoted to the MAGA agenda as you, who depend entirely on you, and then humiliate the
43:05ones who might have come from the outside, like Marco Rubio, force him to parrot the
43:10line that you want him to parrot.
43:12It's a it's a very, you know, it's a very effective strategy.
43:16And this we all know well from India, you know, he has now created a cabinet of chumchas
43:22and and I don't think that they will abandon him.
43:26OK, let me ask you in conclusion, as someone who's been in the American media in a way
43:30over the years, are we seeing the American media also capitulating or do you see the
43:35American media having a pushback questioning Donald Trump, whether it's his policies on
43:40Gaza, whether it will be his policies on Ukraine?
43:42Do you see that kind of a pushback?
43:44Or is the American media also by and large succumbed, particularly the media owners?
43:50Look, they are trying, the American media is trying to hold him accountable.
43:54There are a few things that make it difficult.
43:56First, you do have the reality that media companies are now more pressured because of
44:03the rise of social media.
44:04And so they you know, the owners give in.
44:08They settle lawsuits with him, which are, frankly, completely very weak lawsuits where
44:13he was clearly certainly going to lose in court.
44:16But the media owners feel like, well, we have other business with the government.
44:20We have this is unprecedented in America.
44:22The idea that you would have the president of the administration, you know, exact a price
44:29for, you know, and expect subservience from the media is very new.
44:34But the second part of it, which is the more worrying part is, look, you can only point
44:38out things so often.
44:39In that State of the Union address yesterday, he told many, many falsehoods.
44:44You know, he said that America has given three hundred and fifty billion dollars of aid to
44:48Ukraine. The actual number is more like one hundred billion.
44:51All those foreign aid programs he pointed out, half of those are not not not correct.
44:56And by the way, there was no fraud in them.
44:58Those were all programs that he just didn't like.
45:00And he knew that you can get Americans upset by pointing out you're sending money to
45:05foreigners. But there was no fraud involved.
45:08It was just programs he didn't like.
45:10So you do all this.
45:11In fact, you recall you recall, Farid, there was a controversy over his comments precisely
45:16on foreign aid to India, suggesting that aid had been given for voter turnout in India,
45:21which turned out to be actually for Bangladesh.
45:23Today, he didn't mention it at all.
45:25Do you see the United States reducing aid to countries in this part of the world?
45:30Do you see because of the attempt being made to sort of cut down on government expenses,
45:36the United States will play a very different role in this part of the world as well?
45:42Oh, yes, I mean, if Trump has his way, this is, as I say, a revolution in foreign policy.
45:47Look, the United States is the richest country in the history of the world.
45:50I always thought it was a matter of great pride as an American that it was also the most
45:55generous country in the history of the world.
45:58Four out of every ten dollars of humanitarian aid given worldwide is given by the United
46:04States, or it used to be given by the United States.
46:07If you think about India, the whole green revolution, the agricultural revolution that
46:13allowed India to go from a country that imported food to a country that exported food was
46:18done by the United States, by the United States government and the Rockefeller Foundation
46:22and other such entities that provided it as an act of beneficence and charity.
46:28I mean, that was a time when India was not particularly friendly to the U.S.
46:31during the Cold War. That spirit of generosity is changing and it's and it's very sad to
46:38see. But it gets to the central question, you know, you were asking, can the press push
46:43back? You can point all this out.
46:45But ultimately, you know, the most worrying thing is that there is a large enough segment
46:51of Americans who is receptive to his message.
46:55It's not a majority.
46:57It's a large enough segment that they can he can use it to drive this agenda through.
47:02So what the press can only do is present the reality, present the facts, present the
47:07distortions. But ultimately, in a democracy, you have to hope that that the people will
47:13will choose wisely at the end of the day.
47:16So is Farid Zakaria a first generation Indian immigrant who went to the United States?
47:21What now? More than 40 years ago, Farid, whose father was an Indian politician in this
47:27country, I do feel that your your vision of America, as you saw it, you've been celebrated
47:33out there as one of the leading commentators on foreign policy.
47:37Do you believe that dream of America is bit by bit being shaken by Donald Trump?
47:42Or do you believe this is a temporary phase and you remain confident of the U.S.'s
47:47historical role that it's played across the world?
47:51I have to believe it's a temporary phase.
47:53Look, America is a vast country, as you know, is also true of India.
47:58You know, when people despair about India, I tell them the same thing.
48:01It's a vast country.
48:02Many people agree with you.
48:04Many people don't agree with you.
48:06The people who like Modi, you can point to his triumphs.
48:10The people who don't, I point out, you know, it's never gotten more than 37, 36, 37
48:15percent of the vote. The same is true in America.
48:18You know, there there is a big country with many, many different elements.
48:22But ultimately, you know, it's a matter of temperament and belief.
48:26I tend to believe that over time the ordinary people make the right choices.
48:32That is the fundamental belief we all have to have in democracy.
48:36So, yes, I'm still optimistic about America.
48:39And I think, you know, Winston Churchill said you can always count on America to do the
48:44right thing after it has exhausted all other alternatives.
48:48I think we are right now in the exhausting all other alternatives phase of this.
48:53But we'll get to the right place.
48:55Parit Zakaria, on that optimistic note and in the hope that, as they would say in India,
49:02phir subah hogi, there will be a dawn.
49:04Hopefully Donald Trump will also recognize America's historical role as well at some
49:10stage or the other.
49:12But I really appreciate you joining us on this important day.
49:15The timing could have been better because Donald Trump, as I said, is making headlines
49:20not just in the United States, but across the world.
49:23Always good to to listen to you, Farid Zakaria.
49:26And thank you very much for taking out the time.
49:28Really appreciate it.
49:30My pleasure, Rajdeep, always a pleasure.
49:33Thank you very much, Farid Zakaria, giving us a really world view of what Donald Trump
49:38has meant to the world just in the last six weeks of Trumpism, as we are calling it.
49:45Hope you enjoyed that.
49:47Let's turn to tonight's fact check.
49:49It's one of, again, something that we are trying to do on a daily basis.
49:53Post truth society, who knows whether it's a Donald Trump or leaders in India?
49:57They often don't stick to the facts.
49:59But today, our fact check is of a video making the rounds that purports to show a Ukrainian
50:04female soldier applying soldier, applying makeup in a war like zone, sharing the video.
50:10People claim that this was a crisis actor and that Ukraine was manufacturing fake combat
50:15scenes to get more money from the U.S.
50:17India. Today's fact check has found that the viral video is actually a behind the scenes
50:22shot from a music video by Ukrainian artists Misha Scorpion and Witzig.
50:27Take a look.
50:29You are watching fact check segment where we bust fake news.
50:32A video now making the rounds purports to show a Ukrainian female soldier applying makeup
50:36in a war zone like sharing the video.
50:38People claim that this was a crisis actor and that Ukraine was manufacturing fake combat
50:42scenes to get money from the U.S.
50:44Dot. India. Today fact check found that the viral video is a behind the scenes shot from
50:47a music video by Ukrainian artists Misha Scorpion and Witzig.
50:50This fact check on viral fake news is done by India.
50:53Today's team of our.
50:55This is A.I.
50:55Sana signing off.
50:57OK, I also want to tell you that you just heard the Farid Zakaria interview, that is
51:03part of really what we are going to focus on at the country's top thought platform.
51:09The world today will be an important element.
51:11The India Today conclave is back Friday and Saturday with the theme of age of acceleration.
51:18The conclave has a stellar lineup this year in a year where, as I said, Donald Trump is
51:23upending the world order of people very close to him, including his former U.S.
51:28secretary of state. Mike Pompeo will be one of the key speakers.
51:32Don't miss the India Today conclave live and exclusive on the 7th and 8th of March.
51:37Take a look.
51:41There is a tariff war going on.
51:43The U.S.
51:44president, Donald Trump, in his second term has unleashed a tariff tsunami across all
51:50countries, including India.
51:54But then he did it before as well.
51:57In June 2019, the U.S.
52:00president, Donald Trump, in his first term, terminated India's designation as a
52:05beneficiary developing nation under the key generalized system preference or GSP trade
52:14program. President Trump concluded that the GSP did not assure America equitable and
52:21reasonable access to Indian markets that it promised in return.
52:26The U.S.
52:26secretary of state, Mike Pompeo, was the man to soothe the freed nerves.
52:32I'm very confident we can.
52:34Look, I know the GSP is a big deal to India.
52:36It matters an awful lot.
52:38I don't think anyone would be surprised to know that trade and trade deficit matter an
52:42awful lot to President Trump.
52:44I'm confident that when two countries of goodwill work together, that we can work our
52:48way through this. Make no mistake.
52:51Neither country will get everything they want when that when that deal is put together,
52:55when it's ultimately resolved, each each country will have to give things up, make
52:59trade offs. But that's what friends do.
53:03Despite losing the GSP status, India's trade with the U.S.
53:07demonstrated notable resilience and growth in the next five years.
53:12The current reciprocal tariff system introduced by President Trump in his second term
53:18could best be explained by his right hand man in his previous term, Mike Pompeo.
53:23No one knows President Trump as well as the former U.S.
53:28secretary of state.
53:30Mike Pompeo would be at the India Today conclave this weekend to decode President
53:37Trump and his reciprocal tariff and more all on the India Today conclave.
53:47Promises to be a fascinating conversation Friday, Saturday.
53:50Don't forget the India Today conclave for now.
53:53It's time to say good night.
53:55Goodbye. Jai Hind.
53:57Namaskar.