👉 El esperado juicio oral contra Andrea del Boca por presunta participación en un caso de administración fraudulenta finalmente ha comenzado, tras siete años de espera. La actriz es la única acusada privada entre once imputados, siendo los demás funcionarios públicos. El caso gira en torno a la financiación estatal de una novela que nunca fue exhibida. El abogado defensor, Juan Pablo Fioribello, sostiene la inocencia de Del Boca y asegura que el contenido fue entregado al Banco Audiovisual del Estado.
👉 Seguí en #ArrancaLaTardeEnA24
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👉 Seguí en #ArrancaLaTardeEnA24
📺 a24.com/vivo
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NewsTranscript
00:00It's the beginning of the year.
00:02Yes, it's the beginning of the year.
00:04A trial that will also be televised.
00:06Dr. Juan Pablo Fiorivello is with us.
00:08Thank you, doctor, for joining us.
00:10It's a pleasure to be here with you.
00:12This is Andrea Del Bocca's historical lawyer.
00:14She represents her in several cases.
00:16And, well, she knows this one by heart.
00:18All of them.
00:20All of them.
00:22Look, the truth is that we are very happy.
00:24Personally, very happy.
00:26Because we have been waiting for this for a long time.
00:28For something like this to happen.
00:30That, once and for all, the oral trial begins.
00:32How long did it take to start?
00:34The facts are from 2015.
00:36Seven years.
00:38Seven years since the trial began.
00:40Excuse me, doctor, can you be happy
00:42to end up on the bench of the accused
00:44for a figure as popular as Andrea?
00:46Facu, you are just like me
00:48and you know very well that a process,
00:50precisely what can bring light
00:52to a criminal process,
00:54is nothing more and nothing less than the oral trial.
00:56The process is that there may have been
00:58some kind of participation.
01:00Where is that going to be elucidated?
01:02In a process.
01:04What is the process? The oral process.
01:06The oral trial.
01:08The oral trial is what is going to bring light
01:10and now we are going to detail it.
01:12Everything there is, everything we have,
01:14everything that is accused.
01:16And it is the process that is going to put
01:18white on black.
01:20Therefore, we are absolutely happy
01:22that this begins.
01:24Let's go.
01:38Let's see, there are 11 accused.
01:4010 public officials
01:42and Andrea is the only private one.
01:44This is how the scheme is proposed.
01:46Let's see, let's go by parts.
01:48Generally here it is about
01:50covering the sun with your hands.
01:52You know, I don't do that.
01:54The cause can be addressed
01:56from a technical defense,
01:58from guilt or
02:00from innocence. Knowing that a person
02:02is guilty and still attending it.
02:04I have no doubt
02:06about Del Boca's innocence
02:08because the amount of evidence
02:10that there is, and now we are going to show it,
02:12is overwhelming.
02:14Now, the accusation that they make to her
02:16is very specific.
02:18It is having participated in a
02:20scheme of alleged fraud.
02:22And is that real, doctor?
02:24No, no.
02:26Could she have participated
02:28involuntarily?
02:30No, not at all.
02:32But one thing is not clear to me, doctor.
02:34In all this movement
02:36there are 36 million
02:38pesos, which
02:40now would be much more
02:42than at a certain time.
02:44It is not known if it was paid or not.
02:46What is the current situation of that number?
02:48The confusion of the media
02:50was a lot about this.
02:52She was hired.
02:54People who do not know
02:56or are misinformed, what do they tell you?
02:58The novel never exhibited it.
03:00Let's clear things up.
03:02There is a contract where the state
03:04hires her to give audiovisual content
03:06to the bank of
03:08audiovisual content, which is the bank.
03:10That hiring is done
03:12through the University of San Martín.
03:14Is that right?
03:16That's crazy.
03:18There are two discussions there.
03:20First, if it is a priority of the state
03:22to finance audiovisual projects.
03:24That's a discussion.
03:26But that discussion is given to the bank.
03:28No, no.
03:30That's a political discussion.
03:32But triangulating it
03:34through a university adds
03:36the plus that one says, well, the university
03:38limits some controls.
03:40Kirchnerism has not been
03:42characterized in the least precisely
03:44as a matter of transparency
03:46when it comes to funding and hiring.
03:48I am on the political front
03:50of what Andrea thinks.
03:52However, I am a friend, I love her
03:54and I assist her professionally
03:56because I am convinced of her innocence.
03:58That's why I say, let's start from scratch.
04:00The way to hire her is fine.
04:02The state, this is pure administrative law,
04:04the state hires through the body
04:06that the state puts.
04:08The person who is hired, if they have
04:10all the requirements that the state asks for,
04:12if the person hires the INCUCA
04:14and the way it is,
04:16if the person fulfills everything,
04:18that will give the responsibility
04:20to the state officials,
04:22to the individual who is hired, zero.
04:24That is why it is due to the accusers.
04:26Due and another more,
04:28to the head of INCA
04:30and the rector of the University of San Martín.
04:32Doctor, you did not answer me.
04:34But sorry, Juan Pablo,
04:36did they form part of the functionaries
04:38of a gear?
04:40No.
04:42Some calculation responsibility
04:44that has to be.
04:46In front of the funds,
04:48there you go to your concrete answer, Luis.
04:50This is a system of location of work.
04:52The location of work is,
04:54to make it vulgar,
04:56as you perform stages,
04:58who hires you, certifies what you did
05:00and pays you the following.
05:02They hire her to give the content.
05:04I didn't have to show it.
05:06You, who have more television than anyone
05:08you know perfectly.
05:10The content was given 100%.
05:12The content was given ...
05:14For the State Audiovisual Bank.
05:16Absolutely.
05:18Finished the edited chapters,
05:20the vast majority and the raw of the rest.
05:22There the complaint jumps and locks.
05:24Now you will tell me,
05:26and why didn't the light see the novel?
05:28The novel did not see the light,
05:30because it did not correspond to her to say
05:32where it came from.
05:34We are missing something, Floribelo.
05:36We are missing the sum of money.
05:38It came out of the box, someone received it
05:40and who received it?
05:42Much was paid, much was given
05:44in the production of the novel.
05:46The novel was made in its entirety,
05:48only some chapters are missing
05:50to be edited,
05:52but they are already presented and given.
05:54All the chapters are presented and given.
05:56Therefore, the vast majority of the witnesses
05:58that we are citing tomorrow,
06:00that the trial begins,
06:02will be forceful.
06:04Is Andrea going to speak at the trial?
06:06Andrea is going to speak.
06:08I'm going to see when we make her speak.
06:10She is going to give the interrogation.
06:12Is that going to be seen, doctor?
06:14Surely. If you know perfectly well,
06:16Facu, that I am open to the media
06:18and it seems to me that there is no better.
06:20Always kind to us.
06:22But how does it correspond?
06:24Always half the face, that must be said.
06:26And in fact, if you like, doctor,
06:28we share the last note that Andrea del Boca
06:30gave on this issue, because it will also be
06:32a defense testimony,
06:34to which the trial will surely be linked.
06:36We'll see.
06:38Let's see. There are two ways.
06:40One, which is the judicial one,
06:42which I am very calm about, because I
06:44complied with a contract.
06:46Everything I had to record is recorded.
06:48It is presented in the court.
06:50What I had edited,
06:52which is what I presented,
06:54is also in the court.
06:56So I am calm because, from my point of view,
06:58there are ten former officials
07:00and I am the only private one.
07:02I always wondered why, out of 5,000 hours
07:04that Facu has, only 26 hours
07:06of my company are investigated.
07:08But well, it will be a matter of talking about it
07:10also in the trial.
07:12But always at a judicial level, I was very calm
07:14because I did everything I had to do
07:16by contract.
07:18No more, no less.
07:20I complied with my commitment.
07:22I did not have,
07:24within the contract,
07:26I did not have the possibility
07:28to edit and sell or show it.
07:30I could only advertise it.
07:32That's why I uploaded
07:34to my YouTube channel
07:36as a promotion,
07:38but I couldn't show, I can't show a chapter
07:40because I am missing the contract.
07:42And on a personal level,
07:44which is what always
07:46sensitizes me,
07:48is everything that had to do
07:50with my family, with my dad.
07:52The personal cost.
07:54Sometimes when they say,
07:56it's not that I cry for the trial itself,
07:58because the truth is that I celebrate that it begins,
08:00but yes, on a personal level,
08:02I know it was a very big
08:04stroke that my dad, well,
08:06he got into a depression
08:08and a lot of things that cost him his life.
08:10And with the rest of the ...
08:12There was Andrea,
08:14and I come back to some things we talked about,
08:16because I make him the devil's lawyer, doctor.
08:18I love it. Besides, you are a specialist in this.
08:20No, no, no. I have been
08:22insisting on this topic for many years.
08:24That's true.
08:26But seriously, I make you the devil's lawyer.
08:28You said, well, they recriminated Andrea
08:30because the novel didn't see the light.
08:32You clarified it, it was not her responsibility.
08:34But that's key, because they say, why didn't she see the light?
08:36Because the contract is to give the content.
08:38Did she give the content? Yes, she gave the content.
08:40The second question.
08:42Do they recriminate you for being aware of a fraudulent maneuver
08:44and being part of this fraud to the State?
08:46No, absolutely not.
08:48She was hired, she surrendered things,
08:50the actors absolutely worked ...
08:52There's another point.
08:54They recriminate her that in the contract
08:56with the actors, there were some amounts
08:58to be paid via Cachet,
09:00and in reality, either they didn't charge or they charged two pesos.
09:02So there is a difference between
09:04what she said the actors got
09:06and what she perceived from the State
09:08to pay the actors, and what the actors
09:10charged, and some say they didn't charge like Massey.
09:12Your question is great.
09:14Aristotle said, after the phrase,
09:16the only truth is reality.
09:18Well, when I saw publicly
09:20that there were two actors, in this case
09:22Massarell and Massey, who publicly said
09:24that they didn't charge, that they charged one peso
09:26and another, perfect.
09:28As I am a right-wing man, guys, come to the courts
09:30and declare under oath as witnesses.
09:32You asked them to be witnesses.
09:34Now we are going to review Massey's statement.
09:36They went to declare ...
09:38There comes the confusion, Marina.
09:40One thing is what they say in front of the camera,
09:42which has no value.
09:44And another thing is when they came to declare as witnesses
09:46under oath, if they lied,
09:48and both said
09:50very clearly, and I accompany you
09:52in the declaration, both Massey and Massarello,
09:54everything they told me I was going to charge,
09:56I charged it in time and form.
09:58I don't owe anything.
10:00Texts, words ...
10:02It's not what Massarello publicly said.
10:04Maybe they were doing a play
10:06to sell five more seats,
10:08maybe they did that, but ...
10:10Who of the two?
10:12I don't know, any of the two. I don't have any personal incognito.
10:14What bothers me is that they lie.
10:16That's perfect. I'll take you to court and say it under oath.
10:18They declared under oath
10:20and said, no, the novel ...
10:22They charged.
10:24We charge everything we have to charge. I don't owe anything.
10:26Did you make money with this novel, Andrea del Bosco?
10:28No, not at all. How can I make money
10:30if the novel is not finished paying
10:32and what was produced
10:34was turned into production and realization.
10:36I don't earn a penny.
10:38Now I continue to be the devil's lawyer,
10:40but we have Fabian Massey's statement
10:42to see his texts.
10:44This is what he said in court.
10:46Yes, we just saw the note from the AMA
10:48where he said, I didn't charge,
10:50it hurts me to be going to court
10:52because this was all at a loss.
10:54After that,
10:56it can be declared under oath.
10:58There what ...
11:00I'm going to get a minute
11:02to the screen.
11:04To be able to see it well.
11:06Because this is part of the file.
11:08The city of Buenos Aires
11:10on the 18th of October
11:122016
11:14The prosecutor, secretary, etc.
11:16Required the declarant
11:18to show his filiatory data.
11:20Hector Fabian Massey
11:22who exhibits the ID.
11:24Born in Capital, January 18, 1965.
11:26Asked.
11:28Let's go down.
11:30Then to show
11:32if he has any interest in the cause.
11:34Let's go down with desire because we didn't get there.
11:36No, my only relationship with Andrea del Bosco
11:38and her producer
11:40was or was in this professional case
11:42asked by the prosecutor
11:44to say if he participated in the novel
11:46Mama Corazón and in his case to specify
11:48what his role was.
11:50He answers, yes, that's it.
11:52I participated as an actor.
11:54I participated as an actor.
11:56It went a little high for me.
11:58If you want to read the yellow, what is the key?
12:00In my case, I think it was Nicolas Del Boca
12:02who communicated with my representative
12:04Alejandro Vanelli,
12:06the one who called me.
12:08He asked me if I was available.
12:10He tells me the project, my role.
12:12He tells me the cast.
12:14From that day on, my representative is the one who negotiates.
12:16And this happened in August.
12:18A little before
12:20the novel begins to be shot.
12:22But I had already worked
12:24on other works that had
12:26been financed by the state.
12:28I think through the Inca.
12:30Frontier, Ultimatum,
12:32the Celebration.
12:34The three came out of thin air.
12:36If you want, come in.
12:40The shooting began in September.
12:42It ended before the holidays.
12:44I sit down again.
12:46We can have it full screen.
12:48And there it says
12:50that he signed
12:52and tells some details.
12:54What I asked Production
12:56if they look for the part where
12:58specifically refers to whether he charged or not.
13:00The knowledge is committed.
13:02He charged it and so he declared it.
13:04The two declared the same thing.
13:06Maybe Production doesn't have it in their hands,
13:08but I'll tell you.
13:10The statement is forceful.
13:12It puts white on black.
13:14One thing is what was said on TV.
13:16And many times on TV,
13:18with a microphone, many things are said.
13:20When we, the penalized lawyers,
13:22invite them to testify,
13:24in two minutes everyone aligns
13:26and declares the truth.
13:28Because if not, a false testimony comes in.
13:30I'm still the devil's lawyer, Doctor.
13:32Because of the conditions
13:34that were signed in the contract
13:36of the Ministry of Planning,
13:38the University of San Martín
13:40and Andrea's producer.
13:42It was a leonine contract
13:44in favor of the producer
13:46because she had no more obligation
13:48than to deliver the content
13:50and kept the international commercialization
13:52of everything produced
13:54that had been financed
13:56with everyone's money.
13:58I say it bluntly.
14:00I said it many years ago
14:02in Infobae and I'll say it again here.
14:04Previously, this novel,
14:06she had participated in this same contract,
14:08they made another production.
14:10That woman.
14:12Do you know what ended up happening?
14:14When that one ended, it was shown.
14:16Do you know what ended up happening?
14:18And this is going to be in the case.
14:20When the case ended,
14:22Andrea del Boca and her producer
14:24returned, I think,
14:26three or four million dollars
14:28to whom?
14:30To the State.
14:32But of course.
14:34Doctor, at the time,
14:36there was talk of an investigation
14:38of the Supreme Court,
14:40an accountable investigation.
14:42Well, this is key.
14:44And the result of this investigation
14:46was never disclosed.
14:48This is key, your question,
14:50and the information is true.
14:52Let's make it clear here.
14:54There was an investigation
14:56by the State.
14:58They went to the bone like no one else.
15:00They audited, by order of the federal judge,
15:02all the accounts of the producer,
15:04all the accounts of Andrea's family.
15:06And the conclusion, after auditing everything,
15:08I repeat,
15:10court experts said
15:12that no deviation was observed
15:14in all the analysis.
15:16So how did we get here, Juan Pablo?
15:18How did we get here? I'll explain it to you.
15:20There is a personal connection with Andrea.
15:22Let's see, the figure of Andrea,
15:24the figure of Kirchnerism,
15:26who continued to parade in court
15:28after having made Falco of all colors,
15:30was used politically,
15:32I have no doubt about it,
15:34and was brought to the cause.
15:36Let's see, processually,
15:38there is nothing.
15:40There are court experts who give in favor,
15:42witnesses who declare in favor.
15:44It is one of the few causes
15:46that I have participated in,
15:48where there is no evidence against.
15:50The process reached precisely for that.
15:52And then there is a suspicion
15:54that there may have been
15:56the commission of a crime.
15:58What happens, doctor,
16:00and I continue in my role of devil's advocate,
16:02if there is a maneuver of fraudulent administration,
16:04of alleged deviation of funds,
16:06of which the ex-minister De Vido was part,
16:08of which the headlines were part,
16:10well, at that time at the University of San Martín,
16:12of the Inca, etc.,
16:14and public officials involved.
16:16It's a gear.
16:18Andrea's producer was a necessary participant
16:20in that maneuver.
16:22No, I tell you why.
16:24If the project did not exist,
16:26if the novel was not made,
16:28we do not have to talk about it.
16:30It is not that it was not made.
16:32The key is that, Facu,
16:34you must understand it as much as I do.
16:36The novel was made,
16:38it was hired because they were going to give it to the bank,
16:40they were going to sell it abroad,
16:42I don't know where they were going to exhibit it,
16:44to spread the fiction,
16:46and it was made and surrendered.
16:48It's all presented,
16:50so that I have a lot,
16:52a lot, but a lot of peace of mind.
16:54First, because it is an oral tribunal
16:56with a lot of experience
16:58with career people in all this.
17:00The Attorney General,
17:02Dr. Fabiana de León,
17:04also a person with a lot of experience
17:06in the criminal field.
17:08Doctor, if you give us a minute,
17:10we find the part in which we refer
17:12to Fabian Macei's statement.
17:14He talks about remuneration,
17:16these are values,
17:18I'm going to read it from the screen.
17:20These are values that have to do
17:22with that moment,
17:24we are talking about 80,000 pesos,
17:26he says,
17:28from there in actors,
17:3035% is discounted plus 6%
17:32and 10% is for my representative.
17:34I don't know what Macei covers.
17:36He says, the other part of the contract
17:38was for the image session,
17:40for the sum of 60,000 pesos,
17:4210% of that money goes to my representative.
17:44The part of actors is deposited
17:46through the actors' account
17:48and my representative was going to charge.
17:50The other part, for the image session,
17:52is deposited,
17:54what is clear is that he charged
17:56both parts,
17:58what was going for actors
18:00and what was going for the contract.
18:02It is what Macei declares in court.
18:04He declares under oath and says that.
18:06I charge everything,
18:08the rest charged everything.
18:10The Court's last moment
18:12and the question is,
18:14then, why is it here?
18:16Because, unfortunately, the judge
18:18destroyed...
18:20Who was the judge?
18:22Sebastian Ramos.
18:24And the prosecutor was a police officer?
18:26Yes, both good judicial officials,
18:28but they did not have the delicacy
18:30of knowing how to say the rest.
18:32The way they were hired at the time
18:34of kindergarten was a shame.
18:36And it's crazy, nobody can defend that,
18:38it's a delirium.
18:40There was a conflict between Andrea Del Bocca
18:42and the Argentine Association of Actors.
18:44Why?
18:46Because Andrea,
18:48in previous works,
18:50had not been charged
18:52in favor of her,
18:54what corresponded to the collection
18:56of her novels exhibited in Europe.
18:58And, in fact, do you remember, Luis,
19:00that he had set up an international association
19:02against Zagai?
19:04With Luis Brandoni
19:06and Fabian Zanola.
19:08And then...
19:10She complained
19:12because she had to have received
19:14I don't know how many millions of dollars
19:16and they had given her back.
19:18Doing the answer of the great lawyer
19:20of the devil we have at the table...
19:22I have the oldest part, doctor.
19:24No, no, I know her.
19:26It's Satan in person, but it doesn't matter.
19:28Taking that issue out,
19:30there is a statement...
19:32Do you know who is the first witness
19:34we have cited to testify?
19:36He was Minister of Culture, but later.
19:38He was Minister when there was the change of government.
19:40Is he the one who denounces?
19:42No, no, no, on the contrary.
19:44When the complaint is made,
19:46there is the change of government,
19:48the Lombardi area, in writing, says
19:50everything rendered so far
19:52is in perfect condition.
19:54Keep going with the payments
19:56because there is no irregularity
19:58if the project sees the light.
20:00There is the signature of the Deputy Secretary...
20:02I remember it in statements.
20:04Sorry, doctor.
20:06No, that was later, before.
20:08Was Lombardi the one to declare?
20:10Or is he cited for the trial?
20:12Who is going to parade for this trial?
20:14It's going to be a show.
20:16It's going to be a soap opera.
20:18Yes, it's going to be a soap opera.
20:20It's going to be Massei, it's going to be Mazzarello,
20:22it's going to be Lombardi.
20:24It's going to be Lombardi, it's going to be
20:26most of the actors who were there.
20:28Ferdente too.
20:30Technical staff are cited.
20:32But it didn't happen.
20:34People may think,
20:36no, they kept the money,
20:38but it didn't happen.
20:40No, no, it was a total success.
20:42They would also have to parade,
20:44or at least be there,
20:46Ana, the daughter of Andrea del Boca,
20:48who was in the cast,
20:50and also the sister who was,
20:52I think, the head of the dressing room.
20:54Yes, but here what we want to prove, Luis,
20:56is that it really happened.
20:58The other day I did a very basic exercise,
21:00how do you think it's going to turn out, Andrea?
21:02And half of you said,
21:04no, for me it's going to turn out well.
21:06And you, no, I don't think so,
21:08everything was stolen.
21:10And based on what?
21:12Based on the affection you have,
21:14because the right, Luis,
21:16is something very technical,
21:18and based on the evidence.
21:20No, one has enormous respect
21:22for Andrea's professional career.
21:24An emblem of the Argentine novel in the world.
21:26But here, let us suspect the maneuver.
21:28Well, she, in some way, was part of it,
21:30a necessary participant,
21:32a possible necessary participant.
21:34The maneuver is suspicious.
21:36The maneuver of hiring is suspicious.
21:38That's why they go to trial.
21:40Now, doctor, beyond the strictly,
21:42or technically, judicial,
21:44or political analysis
21:46that we can make of this,
21:48she makes a self-criticism
21:50of her assertiveness.
21:52This happens with many artists.
21:54They praise their career,
21:56they praise popular artistry.
21:58As Palito said,
22:00throwing the honor to the dogs.
22:02Unfortunately, the country is so divided
22:04in a political crack that affects
22:06journalists, actors,
22:08lawyers, it's crazy.
22:10Today, any artist
22:12who goes out to support, for example,
22:14Amelie, or not,
22:16or against her,
22:18Amelie Becerra,
22:20for me, the artist has to be evaluated
22:22for what he does.
22:24Do you regret that?
22:26No, no, I didn't ask her,
22:28but I don't think so.
22:30You said before, we have different
22:32political views.
22:34It's very respectable,
22:36and it's valuable that you also
22:38defend someone,
22:40and you make a technical defense.
22:42What I do is a technical defense,
22:44professional, and I'm trained,
22:46and the client looks for me for that,
22:48to solve the problem,
22:50not to share political ideologies.
22:52I would call him, doctor.
22:54You would call me, I don't know.
22:56But I wouldn't ask you
22:58who you talked to,
23:00what color you are.
23:02Ventura shot something,
23:04and I want to continue being Diablo's lawyer.
23:06Another thing that was questioned
23:08is the hiring of the daughter and the sister,
23:10because it was said that even,
23:12let's say, the trajectory
23:14or the stellarity that the daughter had
23:16at that time, didn't justify
23:18the street
23:20with an aggravating.
23:22With an aggravating.
23:24The claim of the father,
23:26Ricardo Villa Sotti,
23:28that he didn't want his daughter to work.
23:30No, he signed the authorization to work.
23:32Let's go back to the street issue,
23:34because it was said,
23:36Andrea, take advantage of the contract
23:38with the state to cover the daughter,
23:40to cover the sister,
23:42and on top of that, you pay them wages
23:44that are not market.
23:46It's great that you ask me,
23:48but what about Campanella?
23:50You're not going to say that
23:52Campanella is on the political line.
23:54Andrea, right?
23:56They made her a note.
23:58She knows the financing mechanism
24:00not only in Argentina,
24:02but in the world.
24:04The world finances
24:06audiovisual productions.
24:08It happens in France, it happens in Spain.
24:10This is not a defense, Andrea.
24:12Yes, but this is through the Incan,
24:14not through the mechanism used here.
24:16I'm going to say two things.
24:18Campanella said,
24:20the costs used for the production
24:22are not fair, they are low.
24:24Such a video, put it if you want.
24:26They are low.
24:28The funds used are totally
24:30suitable for the market.
24:32Campanella said,
24:34I don't share her political ideology,
24:36but I recognize that this was like that.
24:38Doctor, now we go with Ezequiel.
24:40He is waiting for us.
24:42We want to ask some questions
24:44related to the issue of insecurity.
24:46Everything for a price.