On this episode of Scran Rosalind is riding the wave of Michelin star celebrations when she speaks to two new recipients. Stuart Ralston of Layla and Rodney Wages of Avery, both very new restaurants, join Rosalind to talk all about the process of gaining the star, how they have achieved it, what it means for their teams and what happens once they win.
This episode gives a great insight into the world of fine dining and just what it takes to reach the pinnacle of the industry.
This episode gives a great insight into the world of fine dining and just what it takes to reach the pinnacle of the industry.
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LifestyleTranscript
00:00Hello and welcome to Scram, the podcast passionate about the Scottish food and drink scene.
00:07I'm your host, Roslyn Derskin, and on today's episode I'm chatting to two chefs, Rodney
00:11Wages and Stuart Ralston, whose restaurants were recently awarded Michelin stars at the
00:16ceremony in Glasgow in early February.
00:18Hi both, and congratulations on your stars.
00:21Thank you, yeah, we're happy to be here.
00:25Welcome back, Rodney, and first time chatting to you, Stuart, so lovely to see you both.
00:30I know that I spoke to you a little bit on the night, Stuart and Rodney, I'm really sorry,
00:33I had to disappear off to file some copies and I've never got a chance to speak to you,
00:37but extra congratulations because your wife's just had a baby.
00:40Yeah, it was kind of a crazy 24 hours.
00:42We literally got her checked out of the hospital and then we came home and introduced the two
00:49kids together and then had the family for a glass of champagne and then I jumped in
00:53the train and headed straight to Glasgow, so it was definitely really intense getting
00:59there.
01:00They were yelling my name like, anybody seen Chef Rodney?
01:02I was like, shit, I'm running as fast as I can.
01:06So it was, I think everything happened so perfectly and my wife and I have been working
01:13really hard for basically leading up to this moment, so it's great to get the accolade.
01:19And Stuart, what does it mean for you as well?
01:21Obviously you guys are leading the restaurants, but it must mean a lot for your staff as well.
01:25Yeah, I think it's just a positive recognition for all the hard work we've put into the restaurants.
01:31I mean, I've said this before, but me personally, it feels like a bit of a recognition for a
01:36few years of work, not just last year's.
01:39And obviously for the team that opened the restaurant, it's really motivating for them
01:44to get to the place where they probably wanted to get to.
01:47And it's obviously, it's been quite a tough time for hospitality.
01:50Is something like this a type of thing that sort of garners the team together and maybe
01:55gives longevity to jobs that you might have been slightly worried about people being a bit transient in?
02:00Yeah, possibly.
02:01I think most top level chefs want to work in Michelin star restaurants.
02:07So if you have one, it probably gives you the sort of safety net of people going to stay.
02:13But also on the flip side of that, it will bring in new people as well.
02:17It'll be more attractive to people to come to you.
02:19So I think it's a bit of both, but I think it's the main thing that's probably like very
02:22motivating for people.
02:23And Rodney, this is your sort of second experience because you had a Michelin star restaurant
02:27in San Francisco.
02:29I know we spoke to you on the podcast we did last year.
02:32But for anyone that doesn't know, can you just talk us through the process of the Michelin
02:39sort of process, like how involved you are, how often they come to assess you, that type
02:45of thing?
02:46And did it differ from America to here?
02:49The assessment, you don't really know when they're coming.
02:52And you can shake your magic eight ball and see, you can find the guests that are actually
02:58the Michelin inspectors.
03:00But I think something I always tell the team, it's like you can't pretend that these people
03:04are Michelin inspectors because you need to make sure that everybody has a great time
03:08and that your job and your goal is to give a consistent experience for everyone.
03:15So we never really, I always told the team never really to focus on if they thought they
03:20were an inspector, if they were doing something that was unusual that they would think that
03:24an inspector would do.
03:26I would just kind of keep things, keep them positive and keep them focused on the bigger
03:32picture.
03:35In California, I think it took me a couple of years.
03:40So we opened in 2018 and we didn't get our first star until 2021.
03:44COVID definitely probably put a wrench in that situation.
03:48But I think they're looking for that consistency and that integrity to your craft.
03:55And they're looking for that chef to really keep that vision kind of driving forward,
04:03which I think we did really well in San Francisco.
04:05And I think we tried to make sure that we did that in Scotland and just shifting the
04:11products that we were using and inspiring the team the same way I did in San Francisco
04:16where we want to actually give a level of experience for the guests and kind of keep
04:22that consistency that we had in San Francisco.
04:24So we're always kind of coaching, I'm always kind of coaching with the team like how do
04:28we serve the plates, what ingredients we're getting, how we're cooking with them.
04:32So I think with Michelin, the difference between California and Scotland, I don't think
04:40it's too much of a difference.
04:42I think the biggest thing I noticed was a different experience for me was that everyone
04:49was way more congratulating to me than they were in California.
04:55In California, it was like, oh, whatever, Chef Rodney, obviously you get a star.
05:00It wasn't as celebrated, which I think was such a great thing to see the industry really
05:08kind of patting each other on the back and saying like, wow, that was really hard work.
05:12And you guys, like everyone that I've talked to, even we've sent some bottles to chefs
05:17as well and letters and things.
05:19So it's like, I think everyone as a team realizes how much work it is.
05:24And it's such an accomplishment.
05:27I think everybody should celebrate a little bit more.
05:30In California, you definitely need to step up your game a little bit for sure.
05:35Maybe they just don't know how to partner, Rodney.
05:37Yeah.
05:38And Stuart, what about you?
05:39Is that sort of similar experience?
05:41Oh, yeah, same.
05:42I mean, same thing, exactly what Rodney just said.
05:44I feel the same about it.
05:46You might think someone's an inspector, but they could be from any guide.
05:51You don't know who they're working for or who they're from.
05:53And I think it's kind of false to chase each table and think that person on Thursday
06:01was a person or that person on Wednesday was a person.
06:04Like Rodney said, you have to be consistent all week long.
06:07Every single table that comes to Lila has to have a great time.
06:10We have to personalize everybody's experience.
06:13We have to pay attention to everything because they're all paying the same amount
06:17of money and the longevity of business is created from that consistency
06:22of looking after everybody, not just VIPs or inspectors or whatever it may be.
06:27I think you'll get found out pretty quickly if you're just chasing that one thing
06:31and that one table to try and inspect it.
06:33And I genuinely feel that's what consistency is.
06:36It's like making sure that on Wednesday it's the same as it is on Friday,
06:39no matter who's in the room.
06:41And have you had a party?
06:43Yeah, a couple, yeah.
06:44Or a wee celebration?
06:45A couple.
06:46I've been lucky to be invited to quite a few parties since.
06:49So it's been nice.
06:52Like Rodney said, it's nice to see people congratulate you and invite you out
06:57and do things.
06:58And I just got back from London, and it was sort of a bit of a celebration
07:02for them.
07:03So, yeah, it's been nice.
07:05It's been more so than I actually thought.
07:07I kind of felt a little bit like Rodney about Scotland.
07:09I don't know if we are all that close in celebrating each other,
07:13but since the Michelin star and the Michelin party,
07:16I've really felt a bit of a difference from that, for sure.
07:19Yeah, it's nice to support each other, especially when, you know,
07:22industries can kind of go up and down.
07:24I say this as someone in journalism.
07:26It's nice when you can kind of come together and celebrate the success.
07:31Rodney, you said for your San Francisco restaurant it took a few years,
07:37but your Avery restaurant in Edinburgh is new,
07:41so it's quite a remarkable achievement.
07:43And Stuart, same with you.
07:45I mean, Lila is relatively new as well.
07:47But, Rodney, how has the first year, I want to say year, in Avery been?
07:53I don't even know if it's been a year.
07:55Yeah, I mean, technically we opened in May of last year, like late May, June.
08:00We did some soft launch kind of dinner series before we fully opened
08:06because we were waiting on some equipment and a shipping container from San Francisco.
08:12You know, I think it's been interesting to see the difference between, you know,
08:18the amount of reservations we're getting now with having the Michelin star
08:21versus, you know, when we had all the press from just opening.
08:25I think, you know, the first year had its ups and downs.
08:30I think the consistency of reservations was kind of inconsistent with that,
08:37and now it's a little bit more kind of even across the week.
08:42You know, like Wednesday, Thursday, you know, we have similar bookings to the weekend,
08:48so it's giving the team a little bit more of consistent schedule and execution,
08:53which I think is, one, it's good for product and also good for, you know, team morale.
08:58You know, if you come in and one day you do two covers and then the next day you come in and do 12,
09:02it's like it's kind of hard to get that consistency when you do the 12 covers
09:07when you're used to doing, you know, smaller numbers.
09:10You know, our dining room only seats, you know, a handful of people.
09:13I think our max occupancy right now is about 16 people,
09:16so I'm not necessarily saying that we need a lot of covers to keep the wheels moving,
09:21but I think it's definitely, you know, making sure that we're sticking to the experience we want to give
09:29and the quality of ingredients that we want to use,
09:32and I think it's paid off of, you know, kind of having that integrity to what we wanted,
09:37the best experience in receiving the Michelin star in Scotland,
09:42I think is what we were after and what we were hoping for.
09:46But I think what, you know, the end game of what we are for the end experience we wanted to give
09:51is similar to what we had in San Francisco.
09:53You know, me transplanting myself from San Francisco to Scotland
09:56is bringing my craft and my art with me, you know, moving my family
10:01and finding a place that would embrace what I do for, you know, for my hobby as my wife calls it.
10:09And I think we've done justice to Scotland, you know, in the ingredients that we have here.
10:15There's some amazing stuff here, so I think it translated relatively easy
10:19and I think that's why we were recognized this year for the Michelin star
10:22because I don't think the experience really shifted too much from what we had in San Francisco.
10:28And sure, what about you? Lila's been open more than a year?
10:31A year and a half.
10:32A year and a half, yeah.
10:34And how's it been from, like, from opening until now?
10:38And have you seen sort of interest uptake given the star or was it always sort of busy?
10:43Because, you know, you're on the site of what was 21212.
10:46Yeah, I think we've had similar, like, inconsistent periods for sure.
10:52We've had, when we first opened, it was very busy.
10:55So we opened in the end of October and it was busy as soon as we opened.
11:02I think people were excited that we were opening a sort of new fine dining restaurant
11:06and taking over from Paul and Katie in the restaurant gave it already quite a big boost
11:12because they were so well-known and it's such a well-known site
11:14and it previously had a Michelin star.
11:16And I guess that was the sort of focus on us was, you know,
11:19what are we going to do there and how is it going to be different?
11:22But then you go into, you know, January, February, it's quieter for sure.
11:27So last year we kind of had inconsistent periods, midweek especially.
11:31Lila's an expensive restaurant, so midweek that can be a bit of a challenge
11:36to give up that time and that money on a Wednesday, Thursday night.
11:40But similar, since we've got the star, I'd say on the day of the star was announced,
11:46I think we've 300 tables, something like that, booked over the next couple of days.
11:51So it's had a big impact on business and consistency.
11:55Like I say, now it's Wednesday, Thursdays are busy.
11:57Weekends are absolutely packed with waiting lists.
12:00So it makes it easier to manage.
12:03A busy restaurant isn't the easiest restaurant to manage.
12:07Like Rodney said, if you're doing two on a Wednesday and then 25 on a Thursday,
12:11it's kind of shifting gears all the time, keeping the amount of produce you need
12:15and when we dry-age things and the timings of everything needs to be really looked at.
12:20But yeah, it's definitely given us a boost.
12:22And obviously for me, maybe a bit different, I have four restaurants.
12:27So the trickle-down effect on the other restaurants also,
12:30you can see it's been busier at the other restaurants
12:32because if someone's coming into town and they're looking for a Michelin star meal,
12:36maybe they'll come and have dinner with us,
12:37but then they may want to try our more casual offerings as well, which helps.
12:41So against a ghosted group, I'd say there's been a bit of an increase.
12:44And so talk to me about tasting menus.
12:46They seem to be all the rage and you guys serve them.
12:53Am I right in saying that, Rodney? You've got a tasting menu as well?
12:56Yeah, a tasting menu.
12:59So do they allow for a bit more creativity given the number of dishes?
13:04Or what is it about them that sort of, why are they so big just now?
13:09And obviously you guys serve them.
13:11Again, the tasting menu definitely gives you a little bit more scope
13:15to be a little bit more detail-orientated because you can focus on those dishes
13:19because they're the same dishes that are going out.
13:21You're not having to juggle a la carte where you're, you know,
13:24cooking various different things at different times,
13:26which take different times to cook.
13:29I think when you're working within a small team, it's kind of essential.
13:33Similar to Rodney, we've only got four chefs at Lila.
13:37So it's not like a huge team that can prepare tons and tons of different things.
13:42We're very limited in what we offer in the sense of dietary requirements
13:46so we can really focus on what we're doing.
13:48There's less wastage, which always helps in a restaurant.
13:52We've got 25 people booked tonight.
13:54We buy 25 scallops, so nothing goes in the bin.
13:58That's problematic when people don't show up.
14:00That's why we kind of have, you know, cancellation policies in charge.
14:05So I think the tasting menu just lets you focus on things.
14:08It lets you be definitely consistent, you know,
14:11because you're doing the same thing kind of each night 25 times
14:14so the repetition is there.
14:16I think you can get into the debate where people will say, like,
14:18our tasting menu is dead and small plates and all these sort of things,
14:22but I feel like, you know, places that do tasting menus really well
14:25will always succeed, and, you know, that's the mantra of any restaurant.
14:31If you do something well, you probably will be okay.
14:34But I enjoy all of it.
14:36I enjoy the tasting menus that we do at Lila and A-Zone,
14:40and I also enjoy the a la carte that we do at T-Po and Noto.
14:43Yeah, I mean, I think the creativity side, I think,
14:46is one of the reasons why we've stuck to tasting menu at Avery.
14:51You know, I think there's a lot of times where guests would tell me, like,
14:54oh, you know, I don't really like eel or I don't like this.
14:58So I think it also kind of opens up people's palates a little bit more,
15:01tasting menus, and letting the guest trust the chef, I think,
15:06is the mentality that I want to kind of build with having a tasting menu.
15:11Because I think when you're coming to an experience like this,
15:14you're coming to try something that you've never tried before
15:17or experience something that you've never thought you would ever try
15:20because if you wanted to have something that you've had before,
15:24you can just go to the pub or go to, you know, an a la carte menu
15:28that you can just pick and choose what you're in the mood for.
15:31So I think this, you know, these experiences with tasting menus
15:34are more about the craft of the chef
15:36and the art kind of experience of what it is,
15:40not necessarily just the food.
15:42It's more like a theater experience that you're buying into,
15:47and that's why the prices are what they are.
15:50It takes it to theater.
15:52You're marking tables, you have these glasses, these silverwares,
15:55all these things that you're kind of amplifying the experience
15:58within the tasting menu,
16:00which you wouldn't really get in an a la carte experience.
16:02Yeah, it definitely feels like a sense of occasion.
16:04And even if you think, well, that looks like a lot of food,
16:07it's never like, oh, I'm so stuffed I can't possibly move.
16:10It's just the right amount of everything.
16:13It's really nice.
16:15Of course, it sounds intimidating,
16:17but I think when it's kind of perpetually moving,
16:20you're having wine,
16:22you're actually getting to have a conversation with your partner
16:25instead of just eating and going.
16:27I think the tasting menu option, I think, is definitely a good way
16:34for people to reconnect with each other and get off your phone
16:38and actually have a conversation and talk about the food
16:41and talk about life rather than sitting and having dinner
16:45and then running off.
16:48Yeah, that's a good point.
16:50So both of you guys have sort of travelled about
16:55and worked under different chefs.
16:57How important is that when you're younger,
16:59for anyone coming into the industry,
17:01or we've just seen who's up for the final for the Roux scholarship,
17:04there's a lot of young chefs.
17:06How did you find your experience of working under different chefs?
17:10I mean, yeah, essential to work under great chefs.
17:13And at times, potentially,
17:17working in Michelin star restaurants when I was younger was hard.
17:20It's definitely hard work.
17:22And going through the timeframe that I went through in the sort of 90s,
17:26it was definitely a tough environment to be around.
17:29But travel was essential, I think, for me to be successful.
17:33I think it shaped, you know, after living in New York for six years,
17:37I became a totally different person
17:39because I kind of grew up, you know, for the most part in my 20s in New York,
17:43which is quite the formative years as a young adult,
17:46which I didn't really ever value at the time as much as I do now,
17:49and how that influenced me by being around tons of different cultures
17:54and tons of different influences,
17:56opened up my mind to possibilities.
17:58And I lived in the Caribbean for a few years.
18:01So I think travel massively for me has made a big difference
18:04to my style of cooking or my viewpoints on people and life
18:08and just a general more rounded person for being able to travel.
18:14I really value those years a lot more now.
18:17And I think I would encourage anybody,
18:19even my own guys, I try and encourage them to move around.
18:22I think now it's a lot easier to move around internationally for jobs
18:25than it was potentially when I was younger.
18:27The opportunities were sort of limited and visas were more difficult.
18:32And I feel like in the chef world, you know,
18:35working around different countries is kind of quite normal now
18:38rather than, you know, quite niche when I was younger.
18:41I didn't really travel too much.
18:44I went to culinary school in the Midwest
18:47and then I went straight to California.
18:49Thomas Keller, you know, French Laundry, I was there for four years.
18:53Immediately after, we basically went straight to Bennu.
18:57And then I think with those two restaurants,
18:59it really kind of solidified my trajectory
19:03and, you know, eventually owning my own place.
19:05And eventually I worked for Cezanne and also Dominique Crenn at Atelier Crenn.
19:09And I think what I, looking back on my career, I was always,
19:13I had ambitions to open my own place.
19:16I wanted to be, you know, a chef eventually.
19:18And I think I surrounded myself with people that were just as ambitious
19:23as myself and learning as much as I could from them.
19:27You know, I started French Laundry when I was 18, 19 years old.
19:30So living in Napa Valley, not being old enough to drink in America,
19:34the only thing I could do is really focus on, you know,
19:38learning from all the guys in the kitchen in French Laundry
19:42that were, you know, in their 30s at the time.
19:45So it was such a good experience, you know,
19:49being surrounded with super talented people that are mature
19:52and kind of helping you kind of build that foundation when you're young,
19:57I think was really important for me.
19:59So Rue Scholarship I think is great when they put you into a restaurant
20:04that's going to give that same experience.
20:06And a young chef being surrounded with people that have a common goal
20:11is going to completely change their trajectory and career.
20:14It's going to keep people, you know,
20:16keep people from going down the wrong path of anything that happens
20:20in the restaurants.
20:21And I think we know what I'm talking about.
20:23But I think, you know, having people there mentoring you
20:26and keeping you excited about your craft and excited about food
20:30and always staying hungry I think is a good thing for a young chef.
20:35And every time I went to the next restaurant I was always like,
20:40why am I going this, what am I going to take from this next place?
20:44Am I making the right direction, you know,
20:47making the choice in the right direction?
20:49And I think with all those things that I chose throughout the career,
20:54I think the travel wasn't the huge thing.
20:56It was learning, you know, eventually how to become an artist
21:00and create my own food.
21:02And I think that's the hardest part of being a chef,
21:04especially when you start out really young and you're just kind of trained.
21:07And this is the only way that you can do things and you kind of get that,
21:12you know, that military kind of foundation of like this is how you cut chives,
21:16this is how you roast the beef,
21:17like when you're learning your foundation.
21:19And I think when you kind of branch out to be your own chef,
21:23you have to kind of reinvent the wheel and, you know,
21:26find a way to create your own kind of mark on your own cuisine,
21:31which I think each chef that I worked with gave me a stepping stone
21:38to that kind of idea of creating my own flavors and experience.
21:43And Stuart, you mentioned it was quite tough in the 90s,
21:46I think everybody outside of the world of kitchens has an idea
21:51of what they think it might be like.
21:53But how has it changed over the last few years?
21:56I mean, has it become a bit more, I don't want to say zen,
22:01because I don't want to assume that it's always been horribly stressful,
22:04but like, you know, is staff welfare, are things a bit,
22:07are people a bit more aware of welfare and taking time off
22:10and not working crazy hours and being shouted at?
22:14Yeah, I think so.
22:15I think it's sort of almost 180 you turn on,
22:18on how it used to be from working every hour that, you know,
22:22you could and being yelled at and having a sort of very aggressive
22:27kitchen nature is to now, for sure,
22:30like staff well-being is on every employer's mind when you're,
22:35when you're setting up your benefits and stuff like that to work in hours.
22:39You know, you just, it's not sustainable to work, you know,
22:43crazy, crazy hours.
22:45There's a burnout culture within chefs that probably existed quite well in
22:50the late nineties, early two thousands.
22:52Nowadays, I don't think people would accept that.
22:54They don't really want to do that.
22:57Sometimes good and bad.
22:58I mean, I think there's a balance to be had.
23:00I think you need to work hard and you need to do a certain amount of
23:02hours to get somewhere,
23:04but I also know that that needs to be managed well and you need to be
23:07limited to a degree.
23:09How you treat people and how you look after them.
23:12You know, people, especially younger chefs,
23:14they're coming to people like me to learn how to cook.
23:18And also they're growing up at that same time.
23:20So you've got to be a little bit more nurturing and understanding of things
23:23like that. I mean, it's obviously it's, it's for the better.
23:26Now that's definitely the best it's been in terms of wages.
23:31When I started cooking, I was getting paid 9,000 pound a year, which,
23:35you know, you wouldn't get now for anything,
23:39which is better because it just makes things, you know, people happier,
23:42more motivated and keeps people within the group.
23:46But it's definitely changed a lot for sure.
23:48And Rodney,
23:49were people shouting at each other a lot in America when you were training?
23:52I think I signed paperwork to say, I'm not allowed to talk about that.
23:59It is a very different mindset, I think now than it was before.
24:03And, you know, I think being a young, young chef, you know,
24:07I think you don't think about it when you're in the,
24:12when you're in the middle of it,
24:13but the people that are mentoring you in training are also young chefs as
24:16well. And in a way, you know, they're learning how to manage people.
24:20They're learning, you know,
24:21they're learning how to deal with their emotions and all these other things
24:24that I think people are as a, as an overall general,
24:29what I think people are doing or being a little bit more management,
24:34managing their emotions and being a little more thoughtful of other people
24:37than they were back in, I wasn't in the kitchens in the nineties,
24:41but back in the 2000s, early 2000s.
24:47So I think seeing, you know,
24:48seeing how people interact with each other now is definitely much better than
24:52it was.
24:53And there's a lot more open kitchens as well.
24:54So if you're going to start losing it in front of, you know,
24:57your diners are going to see and hear it.
24:59So I imagine it also would be, you're not going to want to do it,
25:02but it's also going to be harder to get away with.
25:04You'd be surprised. I think some people probably like to see that.
25:07Oh, really?
25:10God, that would make me so uncomfortable.
25:12Do you guys have any dishes that have been on the menu and will stay on the
25:18menu and you know, where that came from? Rodney, I'll come to you.
25:22There's this dish that we have that we, I call it tortellini and brodo.
25:26It's just like a very wholesome dish with very simple pasta filled with
25:32mushroom broth. And it's, it's more about, you know,
25:35the texture and the flavor and like the comforting aspect of it that we've,
25:40we had it when we first started our pop-ups in 2016.
25:44So it's basically one of the first couple of dishes that we created when we
25:48started the project for Erie. And I haven't been able to take it off the menu
25:52since. So it's kind of just been, been there.
25:55And I've took it off a couple of times and people,
25:57regular guests have come in and like, why, where's the tortellini?
26:00It's like, why, why can't I like, why do you,
26:03why don't you have tortellini on the menu right now?
26:05Like this is bizarre. So I think that that dish will probably stay for,
26:10for a while. I don't, I don't see it coming off anytime soon.
26:14Yeah. Same. We've got a few dishes to be fair.
26:17They've been on since the beginning that people seem to love and generally get
26:21the fanfare every time someone dines.
26:23I think the one thing that won't come off is probably the langoustine dish.
26:26We do a very simple sort of ode to kind of like a fish and chip type thing,
26:32but it's a langoustine that's been wrapped very thinly in Katafi pastry and
26:36then blanched in a fryer for 30 seconds.
26:39So you've got that kind of crispy outside and then inside the suckling fish.
26:44We serve it with a burnt apple sort of ketchup,
26:46which going up on the East coast in Fife, you know,
26:49you'd get a lot of brown sauce cut with a lot of vinegar in chip shops.
26:53So we put tamarind through it.
26:55So it's got a sort of sweet and sour sort of flavor to it.
26:58And, uh, that's probably something that won't come off the menu.
27:02It's so simple and it's, uh, it's quite easy to prepare,
27:06but people just generally love it.
27:07And I don't think it's anything better than a really simple langoustine.
27:11What we do, obviously shellfish really well here.
27:14I'm glad you mentioned Fife because I was going to say to you,
27:16we're both from Fife and I was going to ask if there's a fish and chip element
27:20because neither one of us is from the really posh bit.
27:23So it was just chippies all the time.
27:27Um, but yeah, no, it's, it's, it's a really nice dish.
27:30I remember that from when I was there. Um, do you guys go about,
27:34do you have time to go about and visit either each other's restaurants or
27:37other, um, restaurants that you might sort of feel inspired by,
27:42whether that's Michelin stars or otherwise?
27:44Um, we've been, uh, we've been to Lalique a couple of times, um,
27:50Mark's good banter, super, super delicious food up there. Um,
27:54he's doing something really special in Gloucester in Edinburgh proper. I don't,
27:58we don't really get out too much, you know, more and more, uh,
28:01we leave the dining out to special occasions, you know, we'll go, you know,
28:05we'll do a Sunday roast at a moral or something,
28:07but that's just cause they're really family friendly and they help,
28:11they help with my daughter as many as if we need it so we can actually eat. Um,
28:16so, I mean, I think for, you know, for the most part,
28:18I think we saved those, you know,
28:21those dining out experiences for places like Lila.
28:23I mean, we went to Lila in 2023 right when we moved,
28:27basically became in November, right when you opened, um,
28:32just kind of scope out the competition and, uh, just see, see what's going on.
28:36And then, uh, we haven't been back since, but I think we were, you know,
28:40with Olivia, just, just having the baby, we're, we're,
28:42we're talking about trying to figure out a way to make our rounds around
28:47Edinburgh again, Timberyard and Bylaw and Heron and,
28:50and those places that we haven't been able to really have a chance to go,
28:54go and dine out yet.
28:55And Stuart, do you get to tour about or?
28:58A wee bit. I mean, I obviously lived in the town a bit longer than Rodney.
29:02So I, uh, I have places that I go.
29:05I'm generally speaking sort of Monday and Tuesday kind of tourists.
29:10So I work the rest of the week and I don't generally like very rarely take the
29:14weekend off. So, yeah, I mean, I love Yamato. It's my favorite sushi place.
29:18It's near my house. Uh, I go there quite often. Um,
29:23and again, somewhere that I can take my kids is really the main thing.
29:27I do like going out for, you know, Michelin star meals and that's,
29:30but again, can I save it for a special occasions?
29:34And to be honest,
29:35like nowadays I mostly wait until I'm traveling to do those types of meals so
29:39I can see something different,
29:41maybe be inspired by someone else's cuisine a little bit. Uh,
29:44go to London a fair amount at the minute. Um,
29:48but I think Edinburgh has got kind of everything you want to have if you do
29:51want to go out. And, uh, if I could take some more weekends off,
29:55I could probably get, most places are shut the same days as me. So it's, uh,
29:59it's a bit of a challenge to get those times off. I've been to, to, to Avery.
30:03It was great. I've been to Herald and loved it. Uh,
30:06haven't been to Timbiard for a while, but I'd like to go back. Um,
30:10so yeah,
30:11this depends really between life and running four restaurants and having two
30:14kids is a challenge for me.
30:17It's quite busy. Um,
30:20and do you have anything coming up in the next sort of few months that you want
30:24to, to mention,
30:25or you've had some like guest chefs or guests sort of collaborations. Um,
30:29is there more of that to come?
30:31Yeah, we're going to do another series in the winter time.
30:33The guest chef series was really good. Uh, it was just,
30:38it was amazing time to get some friends and some new people that I've not
30:41worked with before,
30:43all guys that have got Michelin stars and just see how they work.
30:47It's good for the team to keep them motivated.
30:48So we've got another series coming up in the winter time.
30:51We're hopefully going to get a few more international chefs coming over. Um,
30:55I've got a lot of friends in New York and across the state.
30:58So we're going to try and get some people for that.
31:01We are looking at our expansions a little bit at the minute and figuring out
31:05what's next for the group. Um, so there's something definitely,
31:08it's a movement happening there and just focusing on the,
31:12on the restaurants as a whole, I guess.
31:15And Rodney, what about you?
31:16What have you got coming up in the next few months?
31:18It was funny. So all my,
31:19all my family came over to the house to watch the Michelin awards.
31:23And I think some of them didn't realize like how,
31:25how much of a big deal Michelin was until they saw,
31:28you know,
31:29saw me get on stage and saw everybody how excited and,
31:32and, and, and celebrating. And as soon as I got home, my,
31:37one of my, my family friends asked me, she's like, are you running?
31:41So what's what's next? What's going on tomorrow?
31:45Like thinking that there's going to be like even more excitement happening than,
31:48than what we did the day. I mean, I think for now, you know, we're,
31:51we're kind of focusing on, uh, you know,
31:54making sure we're keeping consistent in the restaurants. And, you know, we,
31:58you know, when we first moved to Edinburgh,
32:00we had ambitions to do a little bit larger project, but I think now we're,
32:04we're kind of focusing on, on Avery. We want to do some, some reef,
32:08refurb in the, uh, in the space and adding a private dining room and, uh,
32:13a proper wine cellar and things like that. So we're,
32:16we're kind of focusing just on the space and St. Stephen's street for now and,
32:21uh, spending time with my son.
32:22So I don't really have too many huge plans for the rest of the year.
32:26Um, we're probably going to do some, uh,
32:29we're doing like a whiskey collaboration with, uh, uh,
32:34uh, Finn Thompson. We,
32:35we did a barrel selection with them that we might do a kind of a fun whiskey
32:39dinner, um, with them as, as kind of a collaboration.
32:44And then we, I was talking with some chefs, uh, from San Francisco,
32:48possibly doing, you know, like a chef French kind of thing.
32:51We're having some chefs come from San Francisco, uh,
32:55during the French to do, do some collaboration events as well.
32:58But I think we haven't really had the time to, uh, really nail that,
33:03nail that down yet on the dates.
33:06Thank you very much guys. It's been great to chat to you.
33:08And congratulations again, um, on the Michelin stars and, uh, yeah,
33:12hopefully see you at the ceremony next year, wherever that might be.
33:16Thanks very much.
33:17Thank you very much.
33:18Thanks Rodney and Stuart for being my guests on this episode and thanks you
33:21two for listening.
33:22Please remember to rate, review and subscribe so you never miss an episode of
33:25Scran. Scran is co-produced and hosted by me, Roslyn Derskin,
33:28and co-produced, edited and mixed by Kelly Crichton.