• 4 months ago
In this episode we will be taking a look at potential Egyptian tanks that could be included in an International Tank Tech Tree for War Thunder, these being the T-100, T-122 and M4A4 with FL 10 turret!

Vehicles in this episode:
Introduction: 00:00
Egyptian History: 00:26
M4A4 Sherman with FL-10 turret (M4A1 with FL-10 Turret added in Update 1.75 "La Résistance): 3:45
T-100: 13:24
T-122: 17:13
Egyptian events: 18:38
Conclusion: 20:00

Link to MagzTV's video on new Matchmaking and Battle Rating changes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOfLQYk-_48

International Tank Tech Tree series
Argentinian Tanks: https://youtu.be/Z6p0kXANlrI
Austrian Tanks: https://youtu.be/cha99aucLPY
Australian Tanks: https://youtu.be/Z-P0xkdHQZQ
Belgian Tanks: https://youtu.be/IPUmZ1TFaIs
Canadian Tanks: https://youtu.be/dlkyfIcukqs
Czechoslovakian Tanks: https://youtu.be/OgGtRi07OIM
Egyptian Tanks: https://youtu.be/TXeQki7i854
Finnish Tanks: https://youtu.be/1SzQl9kRQiE

Information sources:
Bishop, C. (1999) The Directory of Modern Military Weapons. London, Greenwich Editions, Pages 152-153

Leland, L.S, Zaloga, S.L (2013) Companion to the Red Army 1939-1945. Stroud, The History Press. Chapter 8.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/armor/detail.asp?armor_id=408

http://the.shadock.free.fr/Surviving_Post-WW2_Shermans.pdf Pages 20-21

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_mm_field_gun_M1944_(BS-3)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post%E2%80%93World_War_II_Sherman_tanks#Egyptian_variants

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-34_variants#Egypt

Picture sources
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_of_Egypt

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Egypt_in_Africa_(controlled_hatched)_(-mini_map_-rivers).svg
By TUBS [CC BY-SA 3.0 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0) or GFDL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html)], via Wikimedia Commons

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File%3AM4A4-AMX-13-latrun-2.jpg
By No machine readable author provided. Bukvoed assumed (based on copyright claims). [GFDL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html), CC-BY-SA-3.0 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/) or CC BY 2.5 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.5)], via Wikimedia Commons


http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:T-100-latrun-2.jpg
By No machine-readable author provided. Bukvoed assumed (based on copyright claims). [GFDL (http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html), CC-BY-SA-3.0 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/) or CC BY 2.5 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/2.5)], via Wikimedia Commons

http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:T-100-batey-haosef.jpg
Photo by User:Bukvoed.

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Game: War Thunder ⬅️

#warthunder #egypt #egyptian #tank #toreno
Transcript
00:00Hello everybody, Torello here, and welcome back to another episode of my proposed international
00:04tank tech tree series.
00:06Now today we are looking at Egypt, and there's three vehicles we're going to be looking at.
00:10The Sherman with the FL-10 turret, T-100, and the T-122.
00:15Now like I said, there's only three vehicles, unfortunately while Egypt has built a lot
00:20of vehicles, they're mostly outside of the timeline, so we're just going to stick to
00:24these three vehicles.
00:25Now just to give a bit of background history about Egypt during this time, at the beginning
00:29of War Thunder in the 1930s, Egypt was still a British protectorate, not part of the empire
00:35but not really independent either.
00:37During WWII, while there was a lot of fighting around Egypt, for example at El Alamein, a
00:43massive famous battle, the Egyptian army itself wasn't really used during the war.
00:47I think there were some trust issues and possibly it wasn't particularly well equipped.
00:52In 1948, Egypt got involved in the first of the Arab-Israeli wars, which didn't go particularly
00:57great for Egypt.
00:59In 1953, Egypt became a republic, the monarchy was overthrown and exiled.
01:05In 1954, a man named Gamal Abdel Nasser overthrew the president, and became the president himself,
01:14and he actually nationalised the Suez Canal two years later, while banning Israeli shipping
01:19from the Straits of Tehran.
01:21The British, French and Israelis were kind of angry and decided to invade Egypt.
01:25Militarily, it didn't go too well for Egypt, they were beaten quite easily, which to be
01:30fair they were going up against some of the most powerful nations on the earth, so not
01:34too surprising.
01:35However, politically things went much better, lots of political and economical pressure
01:40was applied to Britain, France and Israel by the Arab states, the Soviet Union, America,
01:45and eventually they were all forced to withdraw, although the Israelis did actually achieve
01:48their goal, they did get the Straits of Tehran open to Israeli shipping.
01:53Other than some involvement in the North Yemen Civil War, things were relatively peaceful
01:56for the next ten years or so.
01:59Egypt actually joined up with Syria and formed the United Arab Republic, which only really
02:03lasted something like three years until Syria left, but still a bit of interesting history
02:08that most people don't know about.
02:10Egypt had also started cosying up with the Soviet Union and started to receive a lot
02:14of Soviet weapons, but in 1967 Egypt was attacked by Israel, Israel claims it was a pre-emptive
02:20strike, other Arab nations claim it was an invasion.
02:24Again things went quite badly and Egypt lost the Sinai, which gave Israel access to the
02:28Suez Canal, it actually controlled one side of the Suez Canal, lots of other Arab states
02:33also lost territory.
02:35In 1973 Egypt struck back, they had lots of new weapons from the Soviet Union which allowed
02:41them to make a pretty good air defence system around the Suez Canal, and they had quite
02:46a bit of success at first, but they brought the Syrians in, and the Syrians didn't do
02:51as well, so to help the Syrians the Egyptians started launching attacks against Israel which
02:56led to them going outside of their air defence, which led to them taking quite bad losses
03:01and Israel counterattacking and taking back most of the territory, and I think even invading
03:05Egypt at some point.
03:07The last war which really fits into War Thunder's timeline is the Libyan-Egyptian War, where
03:12Libya tried to invade Egypt, and predictably this didn't go particularly well and Egypt
03:18kicked them out pretty easily.
03:20Since then the Sinai has actually been returned to Egypt by the Israelis after a peace accord
03:25was signed, and Egypt did realign itself towards the Americans, started getting American equipment
03:32and started building its own equipment, which has built some pretty good stuff.
03:37But now we've got the basic background history of Egypt and the wars it was involved in out
03:41of the way, let's get straight into the episode.
03:44Now the first Egyptian vehicle we're looking at is this Egyptian variant of the M4 Sherman,
03:49and it's basically an M4A4 Sherman, which we don't have in the game at the moment, it's
03:54got a lengthened hull and it's got a Chrysler engine, a gasoline engine, but the Egyptians
04:00have put in an M2A2 diesel engine and the FL-10 turret from the AMX-13 light tank.
04:08Now the FL-10 turret could carry two different weapons, a 75mm gun, the SA-50, and a 90mm
04:15gun.
04:16Now there isn't much information about this tank, but any information I have found has
04:19mostly suggested it used a 75mm gun, which makes the most sense, because the French didn't
04:26add the 90mm gun to their own AMX-13s until I believe around 1966.
04:32I'm not sure when this vehicle came into service, but I've seen some suggestions it may have
04:36been around as early as the Suez Crisis in 1956, and while it's possible it could have
04:40come into service at a later date, I still think it would have been far too early to
04:44get the 90mm gun.
04:46There was also the possibility of 105mm guns being used on the AMX-13, however I don't
04:51think these could be used on the FL-10 turret, so it's very unlikely they would have used
04:56105mm guns either.
04:59Now before we go on to the gun stats though, I just want to talk a little bit about the
05:02FL-10 turret.
05:04The FL-10 turret is unique in that it's one of the only oscillating turrets to actually
05:08go into operational service.
05:11The only other turret I can think of is the one on the SK-105 Austrian Tank Destroyer,
05:16and I think even that's a variant of the AMX-13 turret, I think it's the FL-12.
05:22But for those of you who don't know, an oscillating turret... how can I explain it?
05:26If you get a normal tank and you elevate the gun, the gun barrel goes up.
05:31If you do it on an oscillating turret, the entire turret moves with the gun, which basically
05:36makes it a lot easier for autoloaders to be used, because this does have an autoloader.
05:41It has two revolver-like magazines which carry something like 6 shots each, and you can fire
05:46a shot once every 5 seconds, so 12 shots in a minute.
05:51Unfortunately to reload the revolver shells, you need to get out of the vehicle, which
05:56isn't particularly practical when under fire, and I'm guessing is going to be quite time
06:00consuming.
06:01Now, moving on to the penetration statistics, I don't want to go into too in-depth about
06:06the information, because obviously it's a French gun, I'm going to be talking about
06:10it a lot during the French episodes.
06:13But for the 75mm gun, I found the following penetration statistics.
06:17The Directory of Modern Military Weapons says they only used high explosive and heat, and
06:22that heat had a penetration of 170mm.
06:25I found some references online, citing James Armour and Artillery, 1984-85 edition, page
06:3238, stating there was an armour-piercing capped and armour-piercing capped ballistic capped.
06:37I think the statistics are for 1000m, not entirely sure, but for APC it could do 110mm
06:44penetration at 0 degrees, and 60mm at 60 degrees, and the APC BC could do 170mm at 0 degrees,
06:53and 40mm at 60 degrees.
06:55I've also seen 1 or 2 references to an armour-piercing discarding sabot, but they didn't cite any
07:01sources, so, you know, take that with a pinch of salt, but they gave 300mm at 0 degrees
07:07and 80mm at 60 degrees.
07:09Now moving on from the gun, we've got the armour of this tank, and like I said it's
07:13supposed to have been built on the M4A4, which we don't have in War Thunder at the moment.
07:18However, assuming it's got the same armour as the M4A2 and the M4A3, it should have about
07:2463mm of armour on the front, which would give it roughly an effective thickness of between
07:2980 and 95mm.
07:32However, the FL-10 turret is a bit of a different story, because it's from the AMX-13, which
07:38was a light tank.
07:39The thickest the armour got on that vehicle was 40mm at the front.
07:43I'm not sure if that includes the turret, but best case scenario we've got a turret
07:47with 40mm thickness, and worst case scenario it's probably going to be a lot thinner than that.
07:53You know, it's not really going to be blocking any shot.
07:55Which made sense, because the FL-10 turret and the rest of the AMX-13 were designed after
08:01the war, when heat rounds could basically penetrate any tank in the world.
08:05It was kind of seen as a bit pointless to keep adding increasing amounts of armour,
08:09because it would be penetrated anyway, so the French went with the lightly armoured
08:14fast AMX-13, and so the turret didn't need to be particularly well armoured.
08:19This is somewhat related to the next stat we're looking at, speed.
08:24Most of the M4 Shermans in-game do about 24-30mph or so, so not particularly slow, but not particularly
08:32fast either.
08:33However, it does put it at quite a bit of a disadvantage, because obviously the FL-10
08:39turret was originally mated to the AMX-13, which was 37mph top speed, which was good
08:45for getting flanking shots and the like.
08:48The gun's not really meant to be used against frontal armour, but if it's attached to the
08:52Sherman it's going to be quite a lot slower, you're not going to get as many opportunities
08:55to take flanking shots, you're going to end up in a role it really isn't suited to.
09:01So yeah, the mobility could be a bit of a disadvantage for this tank.
09:06Now the last major stat we need to look at is the crew, and the regular Shermans had
09:11five crew, gunner, loader, commander, bow machine gunner, driver.
09:16Obviously the autoloader gets rid of the loader, so that takes us down to four crew.
09:22It depends if they kept the bow machine gunner, you can see the machine gun is still in the
09:26bow of the tank, so presumably they did keep the bow machine gunner, the Egyptians, but
09:31I couldn't really find much information about the crew, but I'm going to assume they kept
09:35the bow machine gunner, so best case scenario, four crew, worst case scenario, they did get
09:40rid of the bow machine gunner, and only three crew.
09:44So where do I think this tank could go on the tech tree?
09:47Well we deal with the battle rating first.
09:50The only similar tank to this that I really know of is the T92 light tank, which is slated
09:56to be released in patch 1.53.
10:00We don't know what battle rating that's going to be exactly, but leaks from the Chinese
10:05dev server suggest 6.7, which does seem about right, I think that's the same as the T-44,
10:12which if I'm correct actually has worse ammo than the SA-50 75mm gun, so that does seem
10:18like a good battle rating, especially for a light tank.
10:21However there is some bad news with this battle rating, because as most of you are probably
10:26aware by now, a new battle rating system has sort of been introduced.
10:31Basically all the Cold War tanks have been reduced in battle ratings, so they now can
10:36beat 6.7 tanks, which doesn't really make any sense to my mind.
10:42MagsTV actually did a pretty good episode about the battle rating changes and their
10:46bad effects.
10:49So that kind of makes it not a very good battle rating at the same time, because 6.7 would
10:55have been quite good in the old system, but now it's going to be going up against T-54s
11:02M60s, Leopard 2s, I mean it could deal with the Leopard 2, but the M60s and the T-54s
11:08and T-10s, which were tanks that this was never designed to go against.
11:12As I said the AMX-13 was meant to go for flanking shots and such.
11:17This is on a slower M4A4 hull, so it's not even going to be able to get as many flanking
11:23shots.
11:24It's going to end up, you know, having to duel with these tanks front to arm, and it's
11:29just not going to work.
11:31I suppose you could possibly put it down to battle rating 6.3, I'm not entirely sure.
11:376.3 to 6.7 does seem like the most sensible thing.
11:41Hopefully they'll change the battle rating system back and put the Cold War tanks up
11:45in battle rating, so it could go to 6.7 and not have to meet all these overpowered tanks.
11:51But 6.3 to 6.7 seems the best place.
11:56Although even then 6.3 might be a little too low, but that's the only thing I can think
12:01of really.
12:02Of course I also have to decide where to put the tank in the tech tree itself, and I've
12:06put it in undecided slash premium, because we've got a lot of tanks with the 75mm gun
12:13from the AMX-13.
12:14We've got the SA-49, a short 75mm, and the SA-50 variant of the AMX-13, with the longer
12:2175mm.
12:22We've got the M50 Sherman, which was an Israeli variant, which is pretty well known.
12:27I believe that and the M51 are known as Super Shermans.
12:33You could put the Egyptian variant in the light slash medium tank line of the tech tree,
12:40but then you're going to be going through about three or four variants of tanks, which
12:46are pretty similar with the same gun.
12:50So it could possibly go in a premium part of the tech tree, because these were only
12:55made in small numbers from what I understand, as opposed to the AMX-13 and the Israeli variants,
13:00which were built in rather larger numbers.
13:04So possibly a premium or in the medium part of the tech tree, in the medium line.
13:11But I think this would be a nice tank to see in the game.
13:13I do hope it could be added.
13:14It would be nice to have this tank.
13:16It would be a bit of a disadvantage, but it seems like a unique vehicle, and I do hope
13:21it could be added to War Thunder.
13:23Now the next Egyptian vehicle we're looking at is this tank destroyer, the T-100, also
13:29known confusingly as the T-34-100.
13:32Some of you may already know we have a T-34-100 in War Thunder already, so I'll just refer
13:37to it as the T-100.
13:39Now this was armed with the Soviet BS-3 anti-tank gun, and it looks like it's going to fall
13:44over.
13:45It's a bit too big for the chassis, which is a T-34 chassis.
13:50Honestly I'm surprised it hasn't just fallen over on its own.
13:53Now from what I understand, the BS-3 was quite a powerful anti-tank gun, unless I'm mistaken
13:59it uses the same ammunition as other Soviet 100mm guns, namely the BR-412, 412B and 412D.
14:09Now the penetration stats for this ammunition seems to be the same across all the vehicles
14:14that use it, about 188mm at 500m of armour piercing, 0 degrees.
14:21The armour piercing high explosive ballistic capped about 191mm at 0 degrees, 500m, and
14:29197 with the armour piercing capped ballistic capped at 500m, 0 degrees.
14:35Now the muzzle velocity of the BS-3 is about 900m a second, which is a bit higher than
14:39the other 100mm guns in-game, but it does seem safe to say that it would have the same
14:44or at least very similar stats with regards to its ammunition if it was added into the
14:49game, as it seems to be the case with basically all the tanks that use the BR-412 ammunition.
14:54However I will try and put the other penetration stats I've seen in the description or in the
14:58stats in case you want to check them out.
15:01Also just in case you're wondering, the turret can turn, you can see here it's pointing rearwards
15:05and in the first picture it was pointing forwards.
15:08Just in case any people were a bit confused, at first I thought it was a fixed gun mount
15:12until I found the second picture, so yeah I don't know what the turning time would actually
15:18be with the turret, but I'm guessing it would be quite slow, but yeah the turret can turn.
15:23The next important stat is of course armour, I'm not entirely sure what the armour of the
15:27turret would be because obviously the turret's been quite modified, but again it's going
15:31to be a later tier vehicle so the armour's not going to be too important.
15:35The whole armour is probably going to be the same as the regular T-34s, 45mm, effective
15:41thickness of between something like 70 and 80mm, speed, I'm guessing it's going to be
15:46slowed down quite a bit.
15:48The regular T-34s in game do 34mph, I'm guessing it's going to be quite a bit slower than that,
15:54maybe something like 30, 25, because obviously you've got that huge gun.
15:59With regards to crew, I only really found one site that dealt with that, militaryfactory.com,
16:04which said there was four crew members, with the driver at the front and the three others
16:09presumably in the turret.
16:11That does seem the most logical configuration for crew, because you don't need the bow machine
16:15gunner, so presumably there's three in the turret and one driver.
16:19The only other configurations that really make sense are two in the turret, one driver,
16:24or bow machine gunner, driver and three in the turret.
16:28So where should this vehicle go in War Thunder?
16:31I think 6.7 seems the most sensible place, that's the same as the SU-100, which also
16:36has a 100mm gun.
16:38It could go to 6.3 possibly, if needed, but 6.7 seems to make the most sense.
16:45Although again, like I said, they have changed all the battle ratings, so that will end up
16:51going against a lot of Cold War vehicles, but if I put it lower, it's going to be going
16:55up against quite a few World War 2 vehicles, and it's probably going to be a little too
16:59overpowered.
17:01So probably 6.7 seems the best place for it, and I think it would be a nice unique vehicle
17:06for Egypt to have in the tech tree, and I think it would be good for the international
17:09tech tree as a whole.
17:11Now the last Egyptian vehicle we're looking at is basically the same as the T-100, but
17:16with a 122mm D-30 howitzer in it.
17:20Basically the stats would be the same with armour and speed and crew probably, or at
17:25least with minor differences.
17:28The weapon though, of course, is a 122mm howitzer.
17:32It's not particularly great, I mean it's got good ammo, but there's only two lots of ammo
17:36that are really relevant, Fragmentation High Explosive and HeatFS.
17:43High Explosive isn't going to be very good at the higher tiers where this would have
17:46to be, and HeatFS does about 460mm of penetration, according to my book The Directory of Modern
17:53Military Weapons.
17:55So where would this vehicle go in War Thunder?
17:56Well it would have to go on the Assault Gun line I suppose, because it is a howitzer,
18:02but the High Explosive shell isn't going to be that great at tier 5.
18:06You might get some success shooting the sides of lightly armoured vehicles, but that's not
18:09going to be too helpful, really you're going to have to rely on the HeatFS, which is actually
18:14more powerful than any other HeatFS in the game, 460mm of penetration.
18:21So it would have to go battle rating 7.7 or 8 if they bring that back.
18:25I'm not really sure if this tank is actually needed in the game, I just thought I'd add
18:28it in so people are aware there are more Egyptian vehicles.
18:31It would be nice to have it in the game, I'm just not really sure there's much of a role
18:35for it at the moment.
18:37So that's all the Egyptian vehicles, so how would Egypt itself fit into War Thunder with
18:42regards to events and such?
18:44Well the obvious events would probably be with regards to the various wars it's been
18:50involved in since the end of World War 2.
18:52For example the First Arab-Israeli War, the Suez Crisis, the North Yemen Civil War, Six
18:58Day War, the 1973 War, the October War, the Yom Kippur War, I've heard it referred to
19:04as both, and the Libyan-Egyptian War.
19:07So there's quite a few different wars you could get events from, in some of those events
19:12you'd probably have to use other nations vehicles but with Egyptian markings because a lot of
19:18the Egyptian-made stuff wasn't around until outside the game's timeline.
19:23You could probably also add in some alternate history events, although the only ones that
19:27really make sense or stand out to me are maybe World War 3-type events like World War 3 breaks
19:33out and Egypt has to take a side or defend itself from other nations, or maybe one of
19:39the superpowers tries to take the Suez Canal, maybe the Suez Crisis goes a little bit differently.
19:45You know there's quite a few different events for Egypt to be involved in and you can get
19:49Egyptian camouflages and skins for various vehicles and yeah I think it could contribute
19:53quite well to War Thunder with regards to events and camouflages and skins as such.
19:59So that's the end of this episode, like I said there aren't as many vehicles as I would
20:03have liked but a lot of them were outside the timeline or I just wasn't able to find
20:06enough information about them, but I think Egypt would be a nice nation to have in War
20:10Thunder. Next week we'll be looking at Finland, obviously Finland is kind of in a similar
20:16place, quite important in history but didn't produce that many of its own tanks, but we
20:21get a few vehicles for that. After that we'll be doing France which is going to take a long
20:25time, I'll have to split that into multiple episodes. But anyway thanks for watching,
20:31hope you enjoyed the episode, leave a like if you did, leave feedback, could always do
20:34with more feedback, subscribe if you like these sorts of videos, and yeah thanks for
20:39watching, I'll see you next time.

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