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00:00 You are listening to Inside the Hive on the All Hornets Podcast Network.
00:05 Today, maybe we call ourselves Hornets Therapy.
00:08 This is one podcast feed with multiple shows,
00:11 making sure we cover the Charlotte Hornets from every single, very sad angle.
00:15 If you like what you hear, please subscribe and Apple Podcasts and leave a five star review.
00:20 The All Hornets Podcast Network is affiliated with the Fans First Sports Podcast Group.
00:25 Today's show, we're largely going to split in two.
00:28 First, we're going to talk about the latest on Lamella Ball's injury.
00:32 And then in part two, we're going to be looking at how Miles Bridges
00:35 since he returned to the court and what we've made of his play so far.
00:39 So, Chase, I feel like this is our third time around now doing like a potential Lamella Ball serious injury podcast.
00:46 If practice makes perfect, this is going to be a damn good podcast because it feels like we've been here before.
00:51 I know. I mean, the first time we did this a couple of years ago when he broke his wrist
00:55 was like probably the most dejected that I've ever been in recorded media over the many years that I've been recovering the Hornets.
01:02 And the next couple of times, it hasn't been quite as bad.
01:05 So, I mean, now that we're here for the third time in four years,
01:08 which is just such a horrible experience to have to go through yet again.
01:13 And here we are. But you're right.
01:16 I think this should be a pretty good podcast by now because we know how to talk ourselves through an experience like this at this point.
01:22 Absolutely. And if you're hurting like we are, you know, I know we are.
01:26 We view this with a little bit through a journalism lens, probably more so than a lot of listeners.
01:32 But, you know, we still understand we are watching and following this team day to day.
01:36 You know, we want this team to be relevant. We want it to be enjoyable.
01:39 We want to see good basketball. We want fans to enjoy it. And to not have that is painful to see.
01:43 But look, when it all first happened in the second quarter of the London Magic game,
01:48 LeMellor Ball went down with a right ankle strain.
01:54 A right... what did Hornets PR...
01:55 Strain, I think.
01:56 Yes, a strain.
01:57 I think it was right ankle strain.
01:58 That's what Hornets PR listed it during the game.
02:01 As we start recording, we've got a update of sorts from Hornets PR.
02:06 LeMellor Ball for the next game on the 28th is listed as doubtful with a right ankle.
02:14 Now, if you listen to this, this is arguably good news, right?
02:18 Because he is not out, which means, oh, then that means there's like a...
02:22 If it was the NBA Finals game seven tomorrow, could he technically play?
02:25 That's kind of what I always view doubtful as.
02:27 It's like he's probably not going to, but if he needs to, he could.
02:32 Look, I'm going to be like, Teru Zews I list as doubtful or questionable right after he did his groin.
02:38 It seemed bizarre at the time. And then he missed three weeks.
02:41 Now, saying that, if you offered me three weeks without LeMellor Ball right now,
02:45 I would bite your hand off because when I saw the injury, and we're going to get into the detail,
02:49 I was thinking anything less than two months I would take right now, this instant.
02:56 What was your gut reaction seeing LeMellor go down, the amount of pain he was in?
03:03 What did you think when you saw that?
03:04 Did you think this is season over? Did you not know what to think?
03:08 Yeah, so I think my natural reaction when confronted with traumatic, unfortunate situations,
03:14 such as this one, is to run through every horrible possibility and just kind of check them off
03:20 as we go along and cancel off these possibilities.
03:24 My immediate reaction, when they replayed it and they showed the angle of him grimacing
03:30 while he was still in midair, basically, before Paulo Boncaro had fallen on him
03:35 or rolled on his leg or whatever it was when they had actually come down,
03:38 I thought he had torn something and was going to be out for the rest of the year
03:43 or at least a very long time and have to have some sort of surgery.
03:48 It wasn't like when he rolled his ankle over last season and ended up breaking it,
03:53 and he was just kind of grabbing at it when he was sitting there.
03:55 Before he even hit the ground, you could see that he was having a painful reaction to it.
04:00 He laid flat on his back for a trip up and down the court before the Hornets could call timeout,
04:06 and he had to be carried to the locker room.
04:08 That is not a doubtful-for-the-next-game type of injury reaction, but like you said,
04:15 that was basically the same thing that happened to Terry Rozier.
04:17 When he hurt his groin, he also had to be maybe not carried to the locker room,
04:22 but they had to help him up. He was sitting there for a while.
04:25 He was clearly in a lot of pain when that happened as well,
04:28 and he was also listed as doubtful-for-the-next-game,
04:31 but ended up missing from November 4th to the 26th.
04:35 So obviously was doubtful for quite some time, which I mean, hopefully if Lamella ends up
04:42 being doubtful for 22 days and then comes back, that is a huge win for what that looked like
04:47 in the moment, but I mean, obviously it's not a win at all to have to miss him for any sort of time,
04:52 especially with the start to the season that the Hornets have had here.
04:56 No, I think it was around 14 and a half minutes.
05:00 That is how long the Charlotte Hornets have their first choice starting lineup this season.
05:06 And right now...
05:07 It was a great 14 and a half minutes, wasn't it, James?
05:10 You know, I feel like I put the hoax in all this when I said after the first quarter,
05:16 this is the most organized. They've looked on either side of the ball.
05:20 Like, Orlando Magic are good this year, don't get me wrong.
05:22 This is not last year's Orlando Magic. They were leading after the first quarter.
05:26 They were right in the game in the second quarter and obviously just lost their way
05:31 once Lamella went down. But it was a good 14 minutes, but it's just so depressing
05:36 that the day you get... You couldn't make it up.
05:40 It's like there is NBA God, you know, is up there just playing with the lives of the Charlotte Hornets
05:47 being like, "Hey, wouldn't it be cruel if we gave them their two starters back
05:51 and then we took away the star player again for what it feels like, you know,
05:56 the third season in a row?" It's just really, really painful to see.
06:01 If we touch on the injury itself, there wasn't like a great low-down, high-res camera angle
06:07 of exactly what happened to his right foot. But I have to say, like, watching it back,
06:12 and this is what makes it even more worrying, he just kind of looks to land on it okay.
06:19 Like, if you'd have not told me it was an ankle injury, I would have watched it and said,
06:23 "Well, maybe he's twisted a knee," because his ankle doesn't come down like...
06:27 It doesn't roll. It doesn't come down and kind of get crushed on or anything like that.
06:32 It just looks like he plants his foot. But like you say, as soon as he does,
06:36 he lets out that scream in midair and then just stayed down and motionless.
06:41 And when you say carried off by teammates, this isn't like, "Oh, yeah, he was limping off."
06:46 He put not one ounce of weight on that ankle while being carried off.
06:50 You know, he couldn't even put anything on it.
06:54 It's just so strange to see such a painful-looking reaction to what looks like pretty...
07:02 You know, a play that didn't really have much to it.
07:07 Yeah, and the unfortunate thing too is it's like...
07:11 It happened doing the exact thing that both he and the coaching staff and Hornets fans and media alike
07:17 have been asking him to do. Like, a hard, aggressive drive to the rim.
07:22 He jumped up and I think he was making some sort of drop-off pass back to JT Thor for a layup.
07:28 There was a left-hand layup over Paolo O'Kerry.
07:31 Oh, right, right. Okay, yeah. Right, yeah, right.
07:33 And people say Paolo fouled him. I'll be honest. I watched it a couple of times.
07:37 I don't think so.
07:39 If there was any foul, there was a tiny little push before the ball even starts to shot attempt.
07:44 There was a tiny... But we're talking marginal contact, if you're calling that.
07:48 You're calling everything. I don't think this is Paolo O'Kerry's fault.
07:51 For people who want to blame that, I don't really think it was a foul.
07:55 It was just he kind of... To contort his body, to get the soft touch he needed to get it off the glass,
08:01 he kind of had to turn his body round and then he had to put all of his power and momentum
08:07 back through the right foot as he planted it from the move. But, yeah.
08:13 It just sucks seeing it happen, doing the one thing that people have been asking for him or from him.
08:19 It was like these hard physical drives to the rim with a physical rim protector right ahead of him,
08:26 going through the contact, not shying away from it, trying to at least get to the line.
08:30 That was exactly what he was doing.
08:32 He just took a hard, whatever, awkward angle spill and then, of course, now it's only listed as doubtful
08:41 for this next game against the Knicks on Tuesday.
08:43 But, obviously, it does not seem like this is going to be a day-to-day type of injury.
08:48 At least, it will be week-to-week going forward.
08:51 Yeah. And Spencer Percy of BuzzBeat Podcast shared earlier today,
08:57 and Spencer's had a pretty good track record going back for the last five to eight years now
09:03 around Hornet's injury in town, that Lamella Ball has avoided a second fracture in his right ankle,
09:10 which I think a lot of people view as good news.
09:13 I don't even know if that's good news.
09:15 Like fractures, when you speak to doctors, fractures are simple to fix, right?
09:20 You hold it in place, the bone reheals of someone his age and everything like that,
09:25 and a lot of the time it grows back to be just as strong,
09:28 unless it's in a weird place like an avicular fracture where there's limited blood flow.
09:34 That probably means the injury is going to be ligament-related.
09:38 So you're talking maybe high ankle sprain.
09:41 You've got grade one, two, three strains.
09:44 You've got ligaments that could have been torn, could have been stretched.
09:46 I believe Achilles could still be in the possibility right here because that's a trouble.
09:53 When players are diagnosed with Achilles injuries, unless it happens right away and it's obvious,
09:59 you're pretty much always given either ankle or calf strain as your pre-injury diagnosis.
10:06 I wouldn't rule that out necessarily.
10:09 That was obviously the worst-case scenario probably would be any sort of Achilles injury,
10:14 but just because it says ankle, I wouldn't necessarily rule that out
10:18 because a strain is what that implies, like some sort of stretched ligament
10:23 that is no longer fully intact in the way that it was before.
10:28 Yeah. So I don't even know if that's good news, but it's some news.
10:33 It really might not be. That's a good point.
10:35 People can take solace in the fact that it's not like he has a bone weakness
10:40 and he's broken it once, he's broken it again, and there's concern he might just keep breaking it.
10:47 We'll have to find out more.
10:49 By the time you hear this podcast, we're recording Monday evening,
10:52 we might have an update, although I doubt it.
10:55 I think we're probably more likely to get an update on Tuesday, the day this podcast is released.
11:01 Let's move to try and look a little bit bigger picture for what this means for this team and for Lamella Ball.
11:07 Lamella was in the middle of his best run as a pro.
11:12 I mean, if he'd have kept that level of play up all year, which is probably unsustainable,
11:16 let's just be honest. I don't want to say it definitely is, because every breakout player,
11:19 you probably think it's unsustainable, and then it's not.
11:22 It's just who he is. But I think with other people coming back, his usage would have gone down
11:27 and probably his assists would have gone up and his scoring might have been less aggressive.
11:31 But he had to be that aggressive in that stretch for them to try and get some wins.
11:37 It's just a real shame that every time this team, you start to try and think,
11:43 OK, we can get some answers now. All right. We have these players on the court.
11:46 We talked in the last podcast. What does that point differential with Mark Williams,
11:52 the Lamella Ball, Brandon Miller look like for the season? That's what's important.
11:56 Well, now we don't know what it's going to be. And even when Lamella does come back,
11:59 he's going to be coming back from the injuries.
12:02 There's probably going to be two or three weeks of him not being 100 percent, maybe on a minute's limit.
12:07 It just makes everything more difficult on the court and more difficult to analyze off it,
12:12 because now all of a sudden everyone is thrust into roles that they're not really ideally suited to.
12:18 Miles Bridges might be a first or second option. Terry Ozier, Point Terry.
12:24 The only person who may be a benefit for this is Gordon Hayward,
12:26 who seemed to have kind of lost his way here with Lamella Ball's hot streak.
12:31 Maybe he, you know, excels being featured a little bit more.
12:35 I don't know. It doesn't really make sense on paper why that would be the case.
12:38 But what are your big takeaways here?
12:41 Let's just assume for now that we think Lamella Ball is going to be a multi-week absence at least.
12:46 What are you expecting the knock on effect and impact to be in terms of roles for other players going forward?
12:52 So, I mean, I think mine and a lot of people's natural train of thought here is like,
12:57 which player is taking up Lamella's minutes directly?
13:01 Like Nick Smith, Tao Maldon, Ish Smith, Bryce McGowan.
13:05 Like all of these players, maybe a healthy James Booknight here pretty soon.
13:08 Any of these guys could kind of eat up some of these minutes.
13:11 Obviously, Terry coming back is going to be a big part of it too.
13:14 But he kind of had his own minutes blocked away anyway for when the team was going to be fully healthy.
13:19 Now you have everybody except for Lamella again.
13:22 Do you give Nick Smith a crack at the rotation?
13:24 Do you continue burning Tao Maldon's two-way availability?
13:28 And I actually saw a tweet from Keith Smith about this today,
13:31 which made me feel a little bit better about it.
13:33 There are teams like across the league that are burning two-way availability for their players like early in the season.
13:39 Tao's already played 12 games.
13:41 Like that's a good like 20% chunk of his two-way availability already before we're even in December.
13:47 But the fact that other teams are doing it maybe kind of indicates that later on in the season,
13:51 there might be like a shuffling of two-way players as guys get waived and replaced with other players to reset that 50-game counter.
13:58 Maybe that happens to Tao as well.
14:00 He's like signed to some sort of minimum contract or they waive him and sign another point guard.
14:05 Or they just put Nick Smith in and just avoid that situation entirely.
14:09 Tao has not done anything for me to earn.
14:12 And like he has just been objectively worse this year than he was the previous year.
14:17 He just can't score the ball.
14:19 Like his defense is good, but he's not a good enough shot creator for himself or for others.
14:25 And that is the issue.
14:26 He is an absolutely offensive liability and he often finds himself on the court with the likes of JT Thor.
14:31 Who like he can shoot corner threes, but can essentially do very little else.
14:35 And there was just not enough like offensive skill on the floor for you to be able to score.
14:40 And this like NBA, look at all these units they're against.
14:43 And all these teams just have such more skilled players on the floor when those guys are out there.
14:48 Right. And the two guys that you're going to get back from injury here,
14:51 Frankie Laquina, especially, and then James Booknight,
14:54 neither of those guys are necessarily like offensive creators that you're going to get back.
14:59 So you have Tao who's already been playing and has shown none of that,
15:03 which is what you kind of need to replace when you lose a player like LaMelo.
15:06 Like you're not going to replicate it, but you can at least try and replace some of that scoring and assist production.
15:12 Tao hasn't done it so far.
15:14 It doesn't seem like the coaching staff trusts Nick Smith to do it yet.
15:17 Frankie Laquina isn't geared towards that anyway.
15:20 He's like more of a defensive specialist. James Booknight is like an off-ball guard.
15:25 Ish Smith is like already kind of playing,
15:27 but he was like a break glass in case of emergency point card that they signed after the season had already started.
15:34 After the emergency had happened. Right. Exactly.
15:37 So it's like, I don't know how much they even want to just funnel him minutes like on a nightly basis.
15:42 Like at that point, wouldn't you rather just give them to Nick Smith?
15:46 So let's talk about this. Let's have a good conversation about Nick Smith right now.
15:50 In the minutes we have seen so far from Nick Smith,
15:56 he's had a little bit of like non-garbage time and he's had some garbage time.
15:59 Have you seen enough that you think that he should be the one to get an opportunity going down the stretch?
16:05 Not down the stretch. During this opportunity, is this the person that you would turn to ahead of Tao Maladon?
16:11 I think like right now, yes, because Tao has gotten like ample opportunity,
16:19 I think, to show that he could be a backup point guard and really hasn't been anywhere near like NBA rotation caliber in that regard,
16:26 except for defensively. And what this team needs is more offense when you lose Lomelo.
16:31 Nick hasn't shown that efficiently so far.
16:34 But like you said, it's been kind of a weird mix of like actual important minutes
16:38 when the team was down a lot of players a couple of weeks ago and garbage time minutes when,
16:44 you know, the team, the game is out of reach and he comes in for the last four or five minutes.
16:47 But he hasn't scored efficiently really at all.
16:49 But he has had some nice like flashes of touch on those like mid paint, like floater, runner type finishes.
16:56 So at least giving him an opportunity to expand on stuff like that,
16:59 I really don't think he's going to be a point guard at all, which is like kind of the problem.
17:04 But then again, like if Ish Smith is kind of already factored into the rotation for like 10 minutes, that might work.
17:11 You can maybe just give Nick and Terry or give Ish and Terry all of the point guard minutes and then Nick play off ball for 10 to 12 minutes a game
17:19 and kind of get some more extended run here. But yeah, I mean, like, well, like you said,
17:24 all of these players are just being thrust into roles that they probably shouldn't be thrust into if you want to get the best out of them.
17:30 So even if you did put Nick in right now, I'm not sure you're putting him in the best situation to have like repeated good games or like impact winning in a positive manner.
17:40 So it's like, are you even going to, you're kind of like setting yourself up for failure in certain regards,
17:46 because like unless Nick just comes in and absolutely dominates and shoots really well or defends really well,
17:52 it's going to be really tough for him to like get any sort of rhythm going.
17:56 Yeah. So, I mean, Nick has played like 24 minutes, so he's not played at any time in the G League yet.
18:03 But what Clifford are we talking, everyone would be looking at Nick Smith in a vacuum.
18:08 They'll be looking at those, you know, some of those shots that he's made, which have looked really smooth, really good.
18:13 I completely get that. And going, hey, Maldon can't throw anything even near the basket.
18:19 What people need to zoom out, and I'm not saying they're wrong for thinking that,
18:23 but Steve could be talking about how do you execute when you're out there?
18:27 And right now, Nick Smith is like a minus 19 on off net rating in his minutes.
18:33 And a big problem there is like he's got like a turnover percentage of 18%, which is really not good for a guard.
18:40 I mean, that is extremely high, basically turning over almost one in five possessions that he has the ball.
18:46 And that's just his that's the challenge. Those are the big challenges.
18:49 His shooting is really clear. He makes high effort plays. You've already seen some of those where he's been getting up and down the floor,
18:57 hustling back on defense. And I really like the energy that he brings.
19:01 And like I agree with you, I think I would prefer to try and go there rather than experiment with Tao Maldon.
19:08 But I talk about Tao, he was sorry, Nick being minus 18. Tao, even though he's been pretty horrible this year in his minutes,
19:15 he's only there only minus three and a half points when he's off the court.
19:20 So right away there, that's the thing that Steve Klippert is looking.
19:22 It's not looking at the individual player and what that player does is how do they help everyone else?
19:27 That's through communication, defensive awareness, you know, ball movement.
19:30 How do they play without the ball, make offense for others? It's all these little things.
19:35 And that's what Tao probably brings that Nick doesn't.
19:38 So that's the reason why. But I actually agree with you because for me, Chase, this season isn't going anywhere.
19:43 We knew we needed the season to get off to a good start with that easy schedule.
19:49 And now there's been so many injuries even before the lamella ball injury.
19:54 This team is cast away already. I just don't see any world for this team to bring it back to go like plus 35 wins and even have a shout of the play in.
20:04 Would have to be a pretty monumental turnaround. I mean, you were just telling me before we start recording,
20:08 you look to games till mid-January and the easiest game the Charlotte Hornets basically have in the next six to seven weeks is the Brooklyn Nets,
20:15 who smoked them already down two starters. So I'm just like for me, I know this is not the Steve Klippert style here,
20:24 but if people want to enjoy the season, it's not watching Tao Maladon and you're not developing him for future seasons.
20:32 I think we're pretty clear past that point with the drafting of Nick Smith Jr. and Omari Bailey.
20:36 So I think I actually am ready to let him go out there, let him make some of those mistakes.
20:42 I know Steve Klippert, that's not his style, but already I just feel like the situation has snowballed away.
20:49 And yeah, that's just not what I want to see. I understand why from a coaching perspective, you do it,
20:55 but it's just not what I or fans want to see.
20:58 Yeah, I mean, a five and ten start. Now you're down your best player for what we can imagine is going to be at least a month.
21:05 If not more, this is just not a recipe for success. I mean, not that it matters how far out you are from playing range in November,
21:14 but I mean, your individual record is five and ten. So you have to rip off multiple lengthy win streaks here just to get back above 500
21:25 and then launch yourself into the range of even being in the discussion of being a contending team for that.
21:30 And without your best player, you're just asking so much. And we saw last year that that just isn't going to happen.
21:38 I don't think they won on a win streak of longer than three games last year, I don't think.
21:43 I think they had one three game win streak later on in the year.
21:47 But I mean, anything more than that even would just be even more difficult to ask.
21:52 And we've already seen that it's not something that's going to come to fruition.
21:56 We've become preconditioned to disappointment.
21:58 I mean, when anything positive happens to this team, everyone watching it is just waiting for the other shoe to drop.
22:08 That something is going to go wrong soon.
22:11 And when we say, well, we should be on this podcast talking about beating the Boston Celtics in overtime,
22:18 talking about beating the Wizards, a two win streak, a competitive game against a streak in Orlando Magic.
22:25 That's what we should be talking about. But that just now feels like it was in a different world.
22:30 And I mean, on that Boston game briefly, I mean, wow, talk about fumbling a game away.
22:37 Boston should have won that so many times.
22:40 I mean, I'm really happy for the fans in the building that the Hornets got to win because the Celtics have stomped Charlotte in Charlotte for years now.
22:48 So I'm happy that all the Celtics fans who turned out for that one got had to go home eating a little bit of humble pie.
22:56 But the Hornets have continued like not to play well from start to finish at any point.
23:03 Yeah, and like, sorry, I just wanted to say this, too, to add on.
23:08 Yesterday, that game against the Magic was the best shooting performance of the season, really.
23:14 They're one of their best, most efficient offensive games in terms of how they scored.
23:18 Just doesn't matter, like at all.
23:21 Even without Lamella, the team was still scoring at an efficient rate.
23:24 They finished at 53 percent. They made 13 threes, which is one of four times that they've made 13 or more threes this year.
23:31 Like should be a extremely positive note that we're on here.
23:35 But just, of course, the one domino that couldn't fall has already fallen here.
23:41 Yeah. Walker Mell tweeted today of Lockton Hornets that he talked with Lamella at Spectrum Centre on Wednesday last week.
23:51 And he confirmed, he being Lamella, that he hasn't worn ankle braces all season.
23:57 And he quotes, "Hurt for real." He tried practicing with ankle braces and said he, quote, "couldn't do it."
24:04 But he did say he'd been taped up this season.
24:08 What do you make of this? Obviously, there was a big hoo-ha.
24:11 We talked about it on this podcast about Lamella Ball's going to wear ankle braces this season.
24:16 That's something he's going to do. He said he was going to do it because that's what the Hornets medical staff wanted him to do.
24:23 He's obviously gave that up pretty quickly.
24:26 Do you think this is a big deal, one?
24:31 And two, who do you think is to blame for this situation if you do think it's a big deal?
24:36 I don't know if it's necessarily a big deal.
24:39 He did also say that he's been taping himself up this year, which isn't quite the same as wearing a brace, but is at least a half measure of sorts.
24:48 I don't think that a lot of the injuries that he's suffered are necessarily being prevented by wearing an ankle brace.
24:56 Is his ankle not going to fracture in that way, like when he had that awkward fall last year if he had a brace on? I'm not sure.
25:04 With this one, we also have a very infrequently detailed injury report here.
25:12 Right ankle strain could mean a lot of things at this point, or this early on in the process.
25:17 It's not even listed as a strain anymore, that's all to remember.
25:20 When we talked about it, he's now listed as doubtful for the next game, which is his right ankle.
25:24 The strain element is gone. The strain was listed during the game.
25:29 It's now just listed as right ankle doubtful.
25:32 There is uncertainty here in terms of if it's a strain, is it not a strain?
25:36 There's definitely some fishy stuff going on here.
25:39 Yeah, a lot of ambiguity, which we're seemingly getting very used to as Hornets fans when it comes to injuries.
25:47 If he wasn't going to be comfortable in them also, at a certain point, you can't really ask someone to be uncomfortable just as a preventative measure.
25:57 It's different if it's something that is actively causing something to happen.
26:02 If his ankle hurts during the games, then he would wear a brace.
26:07 When he comes back from that injury and he's healthy, he's ramping up, his ankle doesn't hurt.
26:12 In his mind, all the brace is doing is causing something negative happening.
26:17 He hasn't gotten hurt again yet, so why would he need the brace until that happens?
26:22 Then maybe he comes back and it actually does hurt or gets sore frequently and the brace helps.
26:27 I definitely get it from if the medical staff approached him and was like, "Hey, can you please start wearing these braces? We think it would help you."
26:35 I totally understand that, but I also understand him being like, "This is extremely uncomfortable. It limits my movement," or whatever it was that would have been his reasoning for it.
26:45 Then just not wanting to do it. I understand both sides.
26:50 I've seen a lot of people saying what are the training staff doing and they should be forcing him to wear it.
26:57 You have to understand, these players are their own bosses, right?
27:02 You can't force them to do anything. That is the first thing we have to talk about.
27:07 It's not NBA 2K where you can put ankle braces on. Not that 2K does that, but you know what I mean?
27:12 It's like saying a video game. You can have your physio and your medical expert saying, "Lomelo, we think ankle braces will help you for reasons X, Y, and Z.
27:20 Here's all the statistics and the data, the research to show how it can help you."
27:24 If Lomelo tries it and then finds it uncomfortable, let's say maybe he wore them at the start of the season when he struggled and he ditched them and then went on that run.
27:32 You can't force someone to wear them. They can't get them changed in the morning and say, "Lomelo, go back to the locker room. You're not wearing ankle braces."
27:39 You have to treat these people like men. They're their own people. They make their own decisions.
27:45 You could argue that, yeah, Lomelo, maybe now you might want to try and commit to wearing ankle braces because it's the second ankle injury you've had.
27:54 This isn't like a freak one-off thing now. There's two right ankle injuries.
27:58 But I think there are aspects where the Hornets medical staff have been fair to criticize over the last little bit of time.
28:07 I don't think you can put this on the Hornets medical staff. I promise you they will have pushed as hard as they can.
28:13 But ultimately, at some point, the athlete takes some ownership.
28:16 It'll be interesting to see. And like I say, they have taped him up. So maybe that was a middle ground.
28:22 But I've had my ankle taped. I've had it in braces because I had awful ankles for basically years playing basketball.
28:29 And I'm telling you, the braces do a lot more for stability, for structural control.
28:34 I can just feel it. And, yeah, they are more comfortable, more uncomfortable, but that's just that's just how it's going to be.
28:40 So I thought that was interesting to hear that kind of come out today.
28:45 But like you said, there isn't. We're all talking about if, buts and maybes.
28:48 All of these things could have still happened with ankle braces. They don't solve anything.
28:53 They probably give you a like a tiny percentile.
28:58 No one can even tell you what of a better chance of minimizing injury.
29:04 Is that worth it for the potential offset of pain and, you know, lowering of performance?
29:10 If it is a minuscule percentile, there is nobody in the world who can give you a straightforward fact driven answer there.
29:17 It is all grey area that we just don't know.
29:22 OK, anything else on the ball here before we move on to our next topic, Miles Bridges?
29:29 Hoping for a very speedy recovery.
29:32 Hopefully this doubtful listing for the next game against the Knicks is as good of a sign as it seems on paper here.
29:40 So, yeah, get well soon to the judging by the schedule and previous previous years.
29:45 It feels like we're maybe just one or two more podcast episodes away from a Gordon Hayward injury.
29:50 Just right. Feels like we're getting to that point in the year of the season now. Right.
29:54 Yeah. And then some sort of impact role player, you know, you can pick and choose the names out of a hat will suffer a freak injury of some sort.
30:01 Like when Kelly Ribery broke his hand last year. So we're all we're maybe maybe some more off court drama.
30:07 It's like a suspension. Maybe we thought we haven't had for a while a drug suspension.
30:12 Maybe get one of those. The old Malik Monk. What was it? 20 games he got.
30:17 Maybe that's going to be coming soon. Look, when it rains in Charlotte, it pours.
30:23 The Panthers are in a terrible situation. They fired the head coach today.
30:27 The Charlotte Hornets have lost the Melibor to injury.
30:31 I think it's time people start looking at the draft prospects already. And it's November.
30:37 Wow. It's a it's a shame here. But look, hopefully that discussion on the Melibor helped air out maybe some of your thoughts
30:46 and frustrations with this whole thing. Look, I think it's fair to say.
30:51 And we had the same conversation when he got injured last year. And I know we sat on different sides of the fence.
30:57 I thought Melibor was injury prone then. I pointed to his history of injuries.
31:02 I pointed to his brother. And, you know, genetics is a fact that you are likely to have genetics and to run into injury issues.
31:11 You're more likely to have injury issues with a brother than you are as well.
31:16 I will say it doesn't matter if he is injury prone. You still have to sign to that contract.
31:23 You are in a no win situation here. Right. There is no way you're finding a talent like that.
31:29 And we've seen this long list of injury players like Steph Curry with injuries early in his career.
31:35 Other players who have managed to completely overcome them and looked really good later in their career.
31:41 And you just have to take that ball. You have to take that risk with the Melibor.
31:46 I do think he's injury prone. It's not his fault. OK, some people it's just genetics.
31:51 It's how it works. Right. And Charlotte have to run the risk with that.
31:59 They played the lottery and it's it's not come up on their side yet. But look, fingers crossed, this is not a serious fingers crossed.
32:07 We can come back on this podcast and talk about the Melibor on the basketball court later this season.
32:14 Miles Bridges has returned to action. He has now played five games this season and, whoa, pretty, pretty good five game stretch here.
32:24 He is averaging 21 points, nine rebounds, three assists, one and a half steals, half a block and is doing it a career high efficiency as well.
32:35 Like if you actually look at his seasons, if you were to keep up just what he has done so far,
32:40 this would pretty clearly be the best season of Miles Bridges career from an efficiency standpoint, a rebounding standpoint.
32:49 All the areas are pointing up after over a year away on the court.
32:56 You have to see what you like from Miles Bridges so far. You can't argue he's given this team something like Washington Wizards, Boston Celtics.
33:03 I don't think this team wins either of those games without Miles Bridges.
33:08 No, I definitely don't. Since he came back, it really was just that one game in the first game where even then he played pretty well.
33:16 But since then, he's had an argument for best player on the court pretty much every game.
33:21 The rebounding production has definitely been there. He's been scoring pretty efficiently at all three levels.
33:27 I think he's at 50.7 percent from the field right now, 38 percent from three on five attempts per game.
33:33 Across the board has been scoring very well. He's defending at a pretty good level as well.
33:40 He's been playing multiple front court positions. He's switched between the three and the four pretty seamlessly when they needed him to.
33:46 It's unfortunate that the one bright spot of this team lately has been the biggest negative from the team for the last year and a half.
33:57 But the script flipped quickly when Miles went from being suspended to being back on the court here.
34:05 Also, he regained his starting role very quickly as well. Partially due to Lamello now being injured, he's locked into that spot again, I think.
34:14 PJ Washington being out too, Miles went back into the starting lineup, continued to play well.
34:20 When this team was healthy two years ago, Miles started over PJ as well.
34:23 I would imagine that he's going to continue starting, playing extremely high minutes load.
34:29 I think he played 41 minutes in that game against Boston, the overtime game was his third or fourth game back.
34:35 Doesn't seem like he's out of shape or out of rhythm in any way.
34:39 Credit to him. He's come into the season, he's obviously kept himself in good shape.
34:45 He's come in and played good minutes straight away. He looks sharp. He looks ready to play NBA basketball.
34:51 I think a lot of people would have understood if he had started slowly, there would be a lot of people out there going,
34:56 "Well, give him some time, he's easing his way in."
34:59 But he has just come in and looks better than he was a year ago.
35:04 The three-point shooting especially, he's made some really tough looks so far.
35:09 So credit to Miles Bridges, physically he's in a really good place and is contributing to this team.
35:16 When you see him playing, it just makes you remember, "Oh my God, he was really good."
35:23 You forget the two-way ability, the ability to slash as well, get to the rim, rebound the ball well, play his defense.
35:33 He's the one strong player on the team for his position that Shelts seemed to have, that can play with his chest.
35:38 He just adds so much to this team. It was just really incredible.
35:45 You see him and it just reminds you of what an impact that he made
35:49 and how much this team has missed his impact in the first 10 games of this season and all of last season.
35:55 Because he was the second best player on the team, the leading scorer, before he got out and being suspended.
36:01 You're right, we talked in this last podcast, we said, "I think Miles Bridges is going to be back sooner rather than later in the starting lineup."
36:08 Because Steve Clifford is coaching for his job and that is a move that is right there in front of him.
36:14 He made it literally the next game and not a surprise at all because PJ Washington, since Miles has been back,
36:21 and maybe even before, his players really dipped recently.
36:24 I know he hit some threes the other night against Orlando, but why can't PJ Washington and Miles Bridges play well together?
36:32 Why can't they play well at the same time? Why does it have to...
36:35 We talked about this last time, always this flip-flop between someone has a good game, oh, but they have a bad game.
36:41 Teams just never seem to complement each other.
36:44 It's like whoever has it that night just seems to go, but it always just feels like it's in a fruitless loss.
36:52 Yeah, PJ had 32 against Miami and then Miles comes back and scores six points on two made field goals over the next two games.
37:02 They played pretty well together in the Boston game, I think.
37:05 But yeah, I mean, again, in Orlando, PJ just kind of went missing in that second half.
37:11 I think he made one or two threes that were fairly timely, but I mean, with Lonello going out, you just need a lot more than that.
37:18 Yeah, exactly. You just need more, especially given the context of the game, than what you got from him in that regard.
37:25 But yeah, it would be nice if this could line up at one point, but I think that we'll be staring at a wooden box six feet under before that happens.
37:34 Yeah, and PJ's been playing a lot of five because Nick Richards, another injury, by the way, has been out with concussion from the Milwaukee Bucks game.
37:46 And you think with him playing the five, he has a real advantage in terms of quickness and shooting the ball.
37:52 And that's not quite come to fruition yet.
37:55 But one thing I did notice, just to go back to Myles, his rim finishing, down at 59% this year, which is a lot lower than his.
38:07 He's normally between 68 to 72% for the last two seasons.
38:12 And I've noticed it as well. He's had some short finishes.
38:17 And also, there's been a few times where I think, Oh, Myles is going to rise up for a dunk here and slam this home, and he's not.
38:24 And part of me thinks he looks in great physical shape in terms of like he has his wind, he's getting up and down the floor.
38:31 But I do wonder if there's been a slight, slight athleticism drop off just a little bit, because there's been a few times where I just like used to seeing him, remembering him exploding at the rim.
38:42 And he's just not quite had that same level of vertical pop.
38:47 Yeah, that's definitely something to look out for here going forward.
38:50 I didn't take note of that quite myself, but I did notice that he wasn't finishing very well at the rim, which part of that could be due to the lack of dunks that he's getting.
38:59 Obviously, it's a much more efficient shot than really any sort of layup.
39:02 But I also think part of it is when this is something that I've really noticed since he got back is it looks like he's like a much more willing playmaker now than he used to be.
39:12 I think he's over the season, the entire season when he was still healthy a couple years ago, he averaged like four assists per game.
39:19 I don't think he's quite there right now, but I don't even know if he'll average that over the season this year either.
39:25 But it seems like he's just much more geared towards that now.
39:27 And like you said, he's like the best, most consistent source of rim pressure.
39:32 Like nobody gets to the rim as easily or consistently from like the three point line or from any sort of like triple threat spot up position as Miles does on this team right now.
39:42 So maybe he's kind of just putting that upon himself to make plays and find more kickouts to shooters and cutters and stuff like that than he would have otherwise.
39:52 But I do think part of it is just that like, and maybe the finishing among the trees is just something that he wasn't necessarily great at in terms of like layup finishing anyway.
40:02 And if that athleticism is gone, then maybe that would just be something that we have to expect going forward to be like the at rim efficiency going down a slight bit.
40:10 But we'll have to give it some time.
40:12 Right.
40:13 Yeah.
40:14 You wouldn't think that.
40:15 This isn't like somebody who's 29, 30 and we do know like the dunkers, the Aaron Gordon, Zach Levine's.
40:21 We know that they do lose that athletic part like in their late twenties, but he's 26 coming off a year and a bit of not playing basketball.
40:29 Like he is probably fresher than, than most.
40:32 The question is just if like he is still maybe again, even though he's like he looks, he's playing heavy minutes and it doesn't look like it's impacting getting up and down the court.
40:41 Maybe just being a little bit more tied and winded, maybe being a little bit heavier, even though he doesn't look that way to me.
40:46 I have to say he looks in good shape.
40:48 Maybe that is just a marginal factor there.
40:50 But yeah, his right hand offhand finishing and his ability to finish with both hands around the rim, even though it's mostly right.
40:58 He does sometimes I think he had a left-hand reverse the night is just super impressive for like, and he gets that super low dribble where he kind of like almost bends down, bends his knees and gets the ball right close to the deck.
41:10 And he gets a lot of reaching fouls there.
41:12 And for someone who's as strong as he is, he's only 6'6", but he gets so low and he's got that strength and flexes and he just kind of barrels his way into the paint while maintaining good body control and balance.
41:23 And he's able to kind of make plays off the dribble there.
41:26 So yeah, it's been an impressive return.
41:30 And it would have been very interesting to see that starting unit, the start against Orlando for this whole 14 minutes.
41:38 We might be talking about this 14 minutes on Orlando for like the next two months here.
41:42 Being like, well, in those minutes, they were pretty good.
41:46 But he's going to be thrust into like a, I mean, who do you think has the highest usage now?
41:51 Lamella is going to be out.
41:53 I'm going to go with Terry would be my guess, just because I think A, he was pretty damn good in his return himself.
42:00 I think he started three for three from the field.
42:03 He had like 13 points and nine assists, like halfway through the third quarter.
42:07 Very good distributor and was obviously scoring very efficiently, getting to his spots in the mid range as well.
42:14 Terry would be my guess to lead the team in usage rate for now, just because he's obviously going to play point guard.
42:19 He's maybe the best scorer right now.
42:23 I don't know, but maybe Miles will take that title from him with a little bit larger sample size.
42:27 But at this exact moment, we're recording the podcast. Terry is the best scorer and point guard on the team.
42:33 So I'll give that mantle to him.
42:35 But obviously, Miles is probably going to be the second number two right there.
42:38 And I imagine it's just Terry, Miles, Hayward, Brandon Miller is your top four, probably in that order as well.
42:45 And then after that, who can you even really trust to have a high usage rate of any sort and put the ball in their hands for the majority possessions outside of those four guys?
42:56 So you kind of have to just force them to stop doing Terry Miles.
42:58 Well, I'd like to see an uptick in Brandon Miller.
43:00 Yes, absolutely.
43:01 As the season goes along, I understand easing him in at the start and the guys, even though they've been hurt, you want to build the guy's confidence slowly, right?
43:11 Just let him catch the ball and get the ball in situations that you know he feels comfortable in.
43:16 And they've done that well so far.
43:19 As the season goes along, and especially now, if the Miller ball is going to be out, like both for the development of Brandon Miller and for the benefit of this team trying to win, whatever angle you're coming at it from, I think more Brandon Miller is better because I think he's already beginning to understand how to get to some of his spots, what he can and can't do, how NBA defenses are going to play him.
43:40 We talked a little bit about like, get ready for the regression.
43:43 Teams are going to play him a certain way, and they already have started doing that now.
43:47 The scout is out and he's still finding ways to be effective.
43:51 So that's the big thing.
43:52 I think Brandon has continued to play well, really well recently.
43:56 Obviously, he had the Knicks game, played well the other night against a very good defensive team in Orlando.
44:02 He's been playing well.
44:03 We've not touched on Mark Williams yet, another one who might be injured.
44:06 He had a lot of strapping on that left shoulder in the Magic game.
44:09 I think he'll be an interesting guy to talk about next episode.
44:11 I think the Mark Williams like value and impacts right now seems a little bit hard to judge.
44:20 You know, you look at the statistics and yeah, they look really good for a second year player.
44:25 But this is the 30th ranked defense in the league or close to that.
44:30 And Mark Williams, don't get me wrong, he is the guy at the heart of that.
44:33 And while Nick Richards has been out, Mark Williams has found himself in a lot of foul trouble,
44:38 which has meant we've had PJ Washington and JT Thorne, and it's a lot more than I think Steve Clifford wanted to play.
44:44 So maybe that's something for next week.
44:47 We can see how Mark Williams gets on here.
44:49 But he has also now lost his pick and roll partner in Lamella Balls,
44:53 who can probably expect a little down tick in his offensive efficiency as well going forward.
44:58 Yeah, and all of these guys that we just talked about are going to have the opportunity to do pretty much anything that they can to positively impact the offense here.
45:09 Like there's no, you know, Miles Bridges is going to be in more of a spot up cutter role and transition finisher.
45:14 Like no, if he turns out to be a good shot creator over the next month, he's going to be able to do that as often as he needs to.
45:21 Mark Williams ends up being an extremely efficient short roll finisher.
45:25 They're going to run a ton of pick and roll to Mark Williams and use that as often as possible,
45:30 because the amount of options and the layers of versatility and how predictable you are as a team in general right now is extremely limited.
45:37 And you now have very few ways to beat players or beat teams consistently.
45:42 So if anybody can show something here in the next month or so, that is what's going to be like ridden across this time without Lamella here.
45:50 So I'm interested to see kind of what pops up, because obviously somebody's got to fill that void.
45:54 They're not going to score 82 points per game just because Lamella is out.
45:58 Hopefully, I guess it's possible, but hopefully, hopefully not.
46:02 I mean, to put a bow on this episode here, I think we're coming towards the end.
46:08 Do you think in some ways the injury issues the team have faced?
46:13 I mean, like I say, we've barely even mentioned, you know, Nick Richards being a help, Frank Nalokina.
46:18 And like, we're not even mentioning guys because there's so many more important people.
46:23 Do you think in some ways it will have helped the job security of Steve Clifford?
46:29 Ooh, that is a very interesting way to frame that.
46:36 Yeah, probably. Right. Like, I don't think it hurts. That's for sure.
46:42 It definitely at least bides time more so.
46:46 Like, because now if say the Hornets go on a tough streak here with Lamella out.
46:50 I already said it. Tough streak with Lamella out, which is exactly what happened last year.
46:56 Like, that was the reasoning for, you know, the Hornets having a poor record last year
47:00 and keeping Steve Clifford around. Not that that was a decision that they were actually making,
47:04 but in terms of our perspective, like, that's why you would give him another year to show you
47:09 what he can do as the head coach of this team.
47:11 But, I mean, I don't know if you're going to get another year of that same excuse,
47:17 especially if the team ends up being just as bad, if not worse, win loss wise compared to last year.
47:23 But, I mean, yeah, it definitely doesn't hurt.
47:27 I think so.
47:28 I'm sure it gives them a little bit more time to, and just another thing to think about
47:32 whenever the owners are making this decision over the summer.
47:35 Because his contract expires. He's not even, like, signed to coach the team next year.
47:39 So they'd have to sign him to a new deal anyway.
47:41 So this is another thing that they're going to have to think of here.
47:44 That ain't going to happen. I'm just saying. I just don't think it's going to happen.
47:48 Probably not.
47:49 I still think the GM will be the, you know, I think Mitch Kupchak will be the first person
47:54 to leave his post before Steve Clifford. I think that will happen, I think, before the trade deadline
48:01 would be my educated guess right there.
48:06 But I feel sorry for Steve Clifford.
48:09 If you think about how these two years in Charlotte have gone since the day he took the job.
48:13 I mean, literally, I think the next day the Miles Bridges situation happened.
48:17 It could not have gone any worse, right? Between suspensions and injuries.
48:20 He has never had the group of guys that when he took the job and he was planning for his interview
48:27 and he sat down and projected over the next two years, this is what we're going to do.
48:30 He has not had that single group of players once.
48:33 And as much as he says in interviews, I didn't think about that stuff.
48:36 I just coach. I just coach the guys who are in front of me.
48:39 He can say all that stuff.
48:40 I feel sorry for him that he has never really had the opportunity with the most talented team
48:47 that he probably has on paper in his time coaching.
48:50 Equally, and these things can be true at the same time, and I've said it already,
48:54 I don't think he's coached well this year.
48:56 I don't think he has helped get more out of this team than his talent.
49:01 Like you look across some of those other teams in the NBA and there are other teams with injuries
49:06 and dealing with their own issues and they've been able to get more competitiveness.
49:11 They've been able to have a style, a defined style that you know what you're getting out of them
49:16 every single night, and that is something he has struggled with this year.
49:19 So I feel sorry for Steve Clifford whilst at the same time feeling that he's left a little bit
49:26 on the table in terms of I think this could have been a team that was more prepared coming into the year.
49:33 Yeah, I completely agree.
49:35 I mean, I know you just said that this year he may have left a little bit on the table
49:40 in terms of getting the most out of his roster, but throughout his coaching career,
49:44 I mean, that has been like one of his best traits is getting role players or low-level all-stars
49:51 like into nightly contributors that can lead a team to a playoff berth.
49:56 Like Nikola Vucic has only been an all-star under Steve Clifford.
50:00 And there's probably a reason for that.
50:03 That's because Steve Clifford knows how to get the most out of talent in certain situations.
50:07 Obviously, that situation is not present this year, but I mean, this was really his last opportunity
50:13 to solidify his legacy as an NBA coach, and it's gone about as poorly as you can imagine
50:21 in terms of like a win-loss perspective.
50:23 I'm sure off the court there are plenty of positives that we who are not in the building
50:28 are not privy to, which I can completely understand from his perspective.
50:32 But yeah, I mean, it definitely stinks to see his overall coaching record and whatnot
50:38 and all that type of stuff kind of tanked a little bit at the end here,
50:42 even when it could have been a really good opportunity to have the opposite happen.
50:45 It just was taken away for many, many reasons that were out of his control.
50:50 Yeah. The Charlotte Hornets are the... I don't know if it's the unluckiest franchise in sport.
50:59 Well, I don't know if you can say the franchise unlucky. The fans.
51:03 Let's say, I would say that Charlotte Hornets fans are the unluckiest fans in Americans' pro sports.
51:08 I don't follow baseball, but I just struggle to see that there's another situation
51:12 where this fan base unfairly just gets, you know, has to deal with these terrible situations,
51:20 some of which are pure luck, injuries, some of which are self-inflicted, suspensions,
51:27 you know, people turning down jobs. I think all sorts of things.
51:31 If you look back over the last two, three years, we lived through it.
51:35 We podcasted about it. We talked about it. When you put everything together,
51:39 I mean, you couldn't write a book because you'd think that's not realistic,
51:44 like for a team to go through what they've gone through.
51:47 It's like a terrible storyline in some straight-to-TV movie, right?
51:52 It's just sad. And I sent out a tweet the other night. It was getting frustrating.
51:56 Like, it's just hard to get up to talk about this every week and to podcast about this
52:01 when, like, it seems like the season is becoming, essentially, regular season is becoming meaningless
52:07 earlier and earlier, like, as the seasons go on here. And if anything, when we looked,
52:13 when we made that play-in for the first time, Hornets were the buzz of the league.
52:18 And from that moment, it has just been, well, playoffs after, the play-in after,
52:25 just been an absolute struggle greater than anybody, even the greatest Hornets skeptic
52:32 could not have said, could not have predicted it's been as bad as it's been.
52:37 So I keep waiting. Sometimes the Phoenix is going to rise. That's why I keep thinking.
52:44 But, Chase, I don't think it's going to be this year. And I'm sorry for all these people
52:48 who bet on the Hornets' win differential over 30.5, which I said I would put serious money on.
52:54 And by the way, I did put serious money on it. I'm hurting just as much as you.
52:59 And again, I will point to injuries to be the reason for that.
53:05 But that is not a good-looking bet right now. So I don't put big money on the Hornets
53:11 very often because I know the track record. I've been actually very good betting on the Hornets.
53:16 I feel like I might be on the wrong side of that. And the draft show might be back in
53:20 for another important year, Chase.
53:24 Yeah, we definitely might be. It's just icing on the cake to end the episode here.
53:30 Yeah. All right. That's it for me, Chase.
53:33 Anything else you want to tell listeners before we get out of here?
53:36 Stay positive, people. There will be more basketball games online.
53:40 After all of that, you're like, stay positive.
53:42 No matter what. No matter what, they've got to play 82 games this year.
53:46 So you might as well at least try to convince yourself that there's a reason to keep going.
53:55 Well, that's a great sales pitch right there.
53:58 I'll speak to you next week.
54:01 Thanks, everybody.